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Who is running a single 12" sub?

Discussion in 'Audio & Video' started by 1lowlife, Oct 13, 2020.

  1. Oct 17, 2020 at 4:08 PM
    #61
    1lowlife

    1lowlife [OP] Toxic prick..

    Joined:
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    DALLAS TEXAS
    Vehicle:
    2014 MGM DC SR5
    Most of what I listen to is XM.
    I'm aware of XM's crappy signal, but many songs sound good enough for me.

    Listen to my iPhone thru Carplay as well, and the majority of those are fine.
    I'm not going to go out and get 5000 FLAC files to replace the 5000 songs on my iPhione.

    Again, I'm not an audiophile.
    There is no reason I can't get a decent sound from XM with the equipment I have.
    I ran XM for years in my 2005 with lesser equipment and it was fine.

    I have very mild high end hearing loss, as well as tinnitus, 24/7 anyway.
    I can hear everything, but certain things I have trouble with.
    For instance I can hear my wife talking to me, but in a crowd, I can't always decipher what she is saying.

    But my issue with my Tundra, isn't high end, it is low end.
    It is much better since I lowered the gains.
    I've been able to work with it today.
    It hits harder and clearer than it ever has since I've owned the truck.

    Although I'm still considering a 12" in a sealed enclosure to get the lower end I feel I missing that the JLs are not producing.

    A DSP is out of the question.
    I don't have the time or desire to jack with it.
    Only reason I've had time this week is that I'm on vacation.
     
  2. Oct 17, 2020 at 6:10 PM
    #62
    Toyotoholic

    Toyotoholic -4Life-

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    Pro suspension, sways
    Keep tuning!
    You're getting there.

    Gains on my amp are set at less than half for both fronts, and just above half for the subs...(a little higher for range of the Bass knob). You should never need to be above 3/4 of the amp's full gain. And I bet that sub sounds better after getting the wiring sorted out. Good job!

    Also if you do find the need for a dsp, the easiest way is to swap in a HU with it all on board.
     
    Rica25 likes this.
  3. Oct 17, 2020 at 7:02 PM
    #63
    RotorRail

    RotorRail New Member

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    I hear you man. 90% of my listening is from Apple Music with my iPhone XS Max plugged in via lighting to usb. I’m not suggesting at all you convert all your music. Hell no in fact. Have you ever tried tidal? I think they have a free trial. Listen to some masters from there and see if you can find 2 versions of the same song to compare. Apple Music actually does a good job for most albums to my ears anyway. I asked how you were connected cause you won’t get the quality you’re after with Bluetooth.
    Try this. Get something playing while driving (crucial step cause it sounds better parked in the driveway) and kill all the bass with your dial. It should still be thumping up front from your 6.5’s. It’ll sound weird cause you lost your fill bass but you’ll get a better idea of what kind of bass you want. If it sounds tinny up front without your subs helping them your problem is there and not the subs. I sound like a broken record but what high pass and slope do you have your front focal 6.5’s set to? I would run them 50-60hz up to 400-500 and then let your mids take over the heavy lifting til around 5khz where your tweeters will take over. We have the same truck, same hu, same speakers, same subs. I don’t think the amps are what’s making the difference. The best I can get my stealthbox to sound is with my monoblock on pass through and the hu set to 80hz crossover and 12db slope. At 24db I’m missing detail
     
    Rica25 likes this.
  4. Oct 20, 2020 at 3:22 PM
    #64
    19TurdPro

    19TurdPro New Member

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    I know jack shit about audio, but I've read your thread and thought the same about my two 10s.
    I *think* due to lack of space our subs end up being more mid range and muddy.

    I have a Kenwood HU, smile eq, bass boost set to 1 (for no other reason than the door speakers sound better with it on), stage set to high, 50hz crossover with a 18db slope. I go between that and 60/18.
    I also use the bass ext on the EQ. I think mine sounds pretty good now.
     
    1lowlife [OP] likes this.
  5. Oct 20, 2020 at 3:57 PM
    #65
    aparker813

    aparker813 New Member

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    It won't make a night and day difference but definitely should be noticeable - try using the XM app on your phone run through carplay or bluetooth. Same subscription you use in your car (no extra cost) and the sound is way better through the phone app vs over satellite.

    Its a free and easy change - the best kind of change!

    I know we've ruled out a DSP, which is definitely a big knowledge and time commitment if you're tuning it yourself, but to answer an earlier question about what is the benefit. The reason I recommended for your situation even though you're happy with the front end is to balance everything, make sure the acoustic crossover matches the desired crossover point, and to verify phase cohesion, all of which greatly affects how your ears perceive the full range of sound, including the low end. Again, i'm not trying to beat a dead horse and make you get a DSP, just trying to clarify why it was recommended when you only mentioned issues with sub bass.
     
    Rica25 likes this.
  6. Oct 20, 2020 at 9:13 PM
    #66
    1lowlife

    1lowlife [OP] Toxic prick..

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    Thank you.
    I printed that out and will try it this weekend..
     
    Rica25 likes this.
  7. Oct 20, 2020 at 9:25 PM
    #67
    1lowlife

    1lowlife [OP] Toxic prick..

    Joined:
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    DALLAS TEXAS
    Vehicle:
    2014 MGM DC SR5

    Thanks..
    I run the XM app thru the work vehicle radio from my iPhone via USB for 10 hours a day.
    Well, 6 hours a day, the other 4 hours are Compound Media.
    I never thought about trying it in the Tundra.
    I'll check that out.

    The idea of a DSP sounds great, it just seems it would take up a lot of time to tune that I don't have.
    I'll certainly keep it mind.
    If I where to go the DSP route, I'd probably bite the bullet and buy a JL Audio VX1000/5i.
    The iPhone app has basic functions (levels and crossovers) and maybe I could do more with the wife's iPad.
    Not sure what functions are available on the iPad app.
    I'm not going to buy a laptop just to tune my truck audio.

    The sub bass seems more workable since I turned the gains down.
    I just ran out of time to mess with it.
     
    Rica25 likes this.
  8. Oct 26, 2020 at 2:56 PM
    #68
    aparker813

    aparker813 New Member

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    Recently tried throwing a much better 12" into a sealed box in the backseat of my Crewmax and it made a world of difference. Doing so also required me to double check a few things with an RTA which will better illustrate my point above about phase cohesion and such. Not at all saying you need to get a laptop and test mic, but I would highly highly recommend spending <$20 and grabbing a polarity tester like this one: (might be an affiliate link, taken from https://www.dandftooldrawer.com/) https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00ZTA8XMI/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&psc=1

    That little tool will let you very easily (no disconnecting wires or anything) verify that all your speakers are in phase with each other, which may make a whole lot of audible difference.

    I used an RTA microphone stationary at the driver headest, system playing periodic pink noise. This was a quick and dirty RTA session with the engine running, no level matching of the sub, and mic stationary so no spatial averaging, - all of which is to say the readings may not look like they would match any curve, but still illustrates the issue I'm trying to show - which is the issue with subwoofer to midbass transition when a driver is out of phase.

    The readings below are comprised of 1) a reading of just both midbass drivers in the lower doors playing together (red lines), 2) a reading of just the sub playing (green lines), and 3) a reading of both midbass drivers plus the sub all playing together (orange lines).

    Where the red and green (midbass and sub) interact is the actual acoustic crossover point for the mids and sub. When both are played together we should see about a 6db peak right above the crossover point. With the sub in phase with the midbass (first pic) you can see an increase of just above 6db. With the sub out of phase (second pic) and sub/mids are played together, the result is a ton of cancellation causing a big dip from around 55hz to 70hz. In the first pic with sub in phase, the ~6db peak right above the crossover actually gives you a a nice boost from about 50hz to 70hz.


    Pic 1 (sub in phase)
    [​IMG]

    Pic 2 (sub out of phase)
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2020 at 4:21 PM

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