Suspension upgrade to fit larger tires and also improve the ride

You can fit that size tire on stock suspension with the right offset.

 

my summer rims have an offset of +19. I do want more clearance though and a smoother ride as my truck feels like a hay wagon on my road, and I have gotten hung up on the frame once already.

 

Do after market coilovers and shocks not last? do they have to be rebuilt regularly?

 

depends on the setup and what their used for...I was mildly surprised but it makes sense when they say "rebuildable." I suppose it was a detail I looked past long ago...I've had them on the 4runner since 2013 and they've performed amazing...just last spring I had to get them rebuilt...so not bad but no ideal...what IS ideal though, is the ride comfort...can't have your cake and eat it too sometimes...

 

OP, I did a very similar setup for a similar budget on my 21. I do not do any serious off roading so having the more capable suspensions was not a priority for me. I just wanted a leveled and taller stance that could clear larger tires. I did a Bilstein 5100 setup all around. Front struts at highest setting with an additional half inch spacer and then a spacer in back. All in, I have 3” front and 1.5” back lift. I paid just shy of $1k parts and labor including the alignment. Performed by an accessory shop owned by a local Toyota dealer.

I chose to keep my OEM 20” wheels (+58 offset) and changed my tires to 275 65R20 BFGoodrich K02s. They are 34” tall and just shy of 11” wide. These tires ran me about $1250 installed by the same shop.

Here are a couple of photos to show the final result.

 

If you dont rebuild what will happen? I've been very broke my whole life and have never changed a stock shock in my life as worn out shocks never prevented my vehicles from going or stopping. I expected that the aftermarket ones would ride better and last forever (becasue in my case the crap OEM ones have always lasted "forever" as well)

 

Maybe look at Dobinsons? They have quite a few spring options to choose from. Ive had one of their kits on since June, and I have loved every minute of it. I got the 778 spring option which yielded right at about 3” of lift in the front. Also, they’re having a 15% Black Friday sale going on right now, which puts it under the original 1k budget. Just to add, im running 285/75 18s.. which do fit on stock wheels.

 

They will just act like worn out OEM suspension...except, if they rebound better (aftermarket coil overs) and offer more comfort, they will also be felt more in a negative manner when they wear out...I noticed my drivers side front on the 4runner start feeling like it would bottom out way too easy so I took them to an suspension shop and they were surprised I hadn't had them rebuilt yet...overall, standard shocks/struts are meant to last longer...I often consider better struts in the OEM coils (Bilstein series 5100 or better) might be the best bet...best price, and are easy to find and "cheap" to replace if needed.

 

Looks good!

 

No, but the vehicle will ride like shit and you're accelerating wear on tires and other parts of the vehicle. It can also affect braking and steering performance.

 

true, but when you're broke those things dont matter. I spent the last year with my T100 using the emergency brake and downshifting for engine braking because the rotors were extremely warped and I couldnt afford to replace them.

 

Good grief. Let's not consider the safety of others....

 

so will any competent mechanic be able to rebuild most oaftermarket shocks?

 

Yes..but if they have remote reservoirs, that's when they will need the rebuilds done at certain intervals... you're far better off on "cost of ownership" on those without external reservoirs...any shop can do the standard aftermarket coilover rebuilds and install...

 

TY

 

Curious... What is your reasoning behind the remote reservoirs needing more maintenance?

To my knowledge and experience, those with remote reservoirs will need less maintenance. You will get less oil degradation due to the sheer volume of oil. Heat capacity will be higher, so you're exposing the seals to less heat. Also, you are placing the IFP in it's own separate cylinder, so it is interacting with even cooler oil, those seals will stay fresh longer. You also retain much more shock travel due to the IFP being in the reservoir. Emulsion shocks will experience more cavitation due to the nitrogen being mixed in with the oil. THOSE will require more maintenance as you're breaking down shock oil much faster. I've seen Kings with 80-100k on the original build STILL tearing up the desert. I typically only rebuild shocks when they are leaking or I notice a section of trail throwing me around more than I'm used to. If they aren't leaking, I'll only change the oil.

 

I would 100% agree with you. Though, all manufacturers have intervals they'd like to see their units rebuilt at. I was actually told every 15k miles on my setup front Icon...that f'n blew my mind and I was almost appalled! Though, the caveat is if they are NOT used as they are supposed to, ie, full stroke on coilovers...if you don't full stroke them once a month, the seals will slowly break down...they're all meant to break down...the less they're used in the ways they were designed, the higher chance of them needing a rebuild when you do finally make use of the suspension in the way they were intended...

Your logic is literally the reason why I thought how they worked and bought them, but I was awakened when I needed to get them rebuilt after 45k...which shocked Icon's resellers where I got my setup rebuilt...not hating on Icon or the shop, just wasn't educated on cost of ownership...or potential cost of ownership...the Icons are absolutely incredible over anything else I've used...

 

Interesting. I don't have any experience with Icon suspension. Only King and Fox. I haven't heard of the needing to cycle suspension through the whole stroke. I was taught that you want to limit the stroke to prevent bottom/top out. Which is why you set bumps and limit straps to keep the shock from hitting bottom/top. Keeping a shock from a full cycle prevents mechanical damage to the internals.

I'm not saying you're wrong or your experience isn't valid, but I don't think your experience is the norm for these kind of shocks. You were not putting a lot of heat into the oil and barely cycling it (seals don't care where they cycle, only that they stay lubricated). It's not connecting with me.

 

Though this isnt really what the OP likely intended, I am glad we are discussing this...I had no idea about any of it!

 

This is interesting as hell. A couple of salient points have been brought up I'd never thought of.

@GravityGear, you obviously have a lot of experience with suspension. I think most of us as consumers are always trying to maximize the value of what we get while operating within the confines of a budget. Value is not always linear either, and the struggle I have with some of this stuff is how much benefit you gain from additional cost. If you don't mind, can you give me your opinion on some of the best options for suspension within price brackets of $500 to $1000 intervals?

So if you have longer rebuild intervals with RR shocks, does the initial cost then become offset by reduced rebuilds? I'm thinking in terms of a 10 years of ownership. If I drop $1500 on a set of Fox 2.0 shocks, but needed to spend $2500 on three rebuilds over the 10 years of ownership, did I really save that much over spending $3500 on a set of Fox 2.5 that might only need rebuilt once?

 

Great discussion, although I know it’s strayed a bit from OP’s question.

I had not heard of rebuilds costing so much, but I admit I have no experience with them. I’m about to find out, though, as I just ordered a set of Fox 2.5 R/R’s.

I’m in TX, so I’m discovering there aren’t that many shops that offer nitrogen refills, much less shock oil changes or rebuilds. I’ve been perusing DIY youtube videos to get a feel for what’s involved, though. All the videos I’ve seen recommend shock oil and seal changes at periodic intervals, much more frequently than I thought, too.

Anyway, Fox’s own website has a guide for recommended rebuild intervals depending on shock and type of usage (street vs off-road or mix of both). I’m guessing King, Icon, ADS, etc., recommend similar such intervals.

But to answer the OP’s question, he might be able to add a better than stock suspension for a little over $1K if he does his own install and goes with front Bilstein 6112’s and rear Bilstein 5100’s. For a little more, he can go with rear Bilstein 5160’s or maybe Fox 2.0’s?

 

Thanks for the interesting info. Sorry for the dumb question, but with respect to front limiting straps, would keeping the sway bar on have the same effect in limiting down travel and keeping the shock from overextending and resulting in damage?

 

$1450 ToyTec boss 3 inch lift in the front and 1.5 in back fully adjustable to desired height. factory Rock Warrior wheels 34/12.5R17..spend alot of time hunting and off road and is also my daily driver. Had to trim about 3/4 inch off the front sides of the skid plate..now I have an RCI skid..no trimming required

 

$500-$1000? Anything in that price range is going to be fairly similar. You'd be getting slightly improved oil capacity over stock and some marginally beefier components. The stuff that people recommend here, the 5100s the OME Nitrochargers, etc would be alright.

START OPINION SECTION - Non-reservoir shocks ride like ass compared to RR shocks. 2.0 non-resi is not worth it IMO. Save for a bit longer and get 2.5 resi. END OPINION SECTION

It's not really for that. Rebuilds are an advantage so that you don't have to buy 4k worth of shocks when they wear out. You won't "recover" your costs per se (you might?), but you'll maintain the performance of your shocks without needing to buy new ones. It really depends on how you use them. If you're jumping the truck and ripping up trails at 45mph, you'll wreck 2.0s much faster than 2.5s. Not that you can't, but they'll get beat up sooner and will beat you up in the process. With non-rebuildable shocks, you just buy them when you need to. They are considered disposable wear items.

Yes and no. Depends on the situation. If the amount of flex exceeds the sway bar capacity (think bigger tires and more leverage) or 2 tires leave the ground, you'll top out the suspension.

IMO, the manufacturers put the service intervals up so that you know they aren't a lifetime thing. It kinda keeps the "If I'm paying this much for shocks, they better last forever" crowd in check. Be smart about this. I know people that own prerunners (actual prerunners with tube frame front and rear) and with how they use them, they should be rebuilding every time they go out, but they don't and they still tear it up and everything is still functioning well.

 

Sorry, I don't think I was clear in my question. I was thinking more in terms of price brackets of:
up to 1k
1k to 2k
2k to 3k
3k and above

Although from what you've stated already, I'm getting the sense there is a middle ground that maybe isn't really worth pursuing? Does this hold true if you don't jump the truck and drive 45mph down trails? This is where I wrestle with this. I value off road performance, but high speed doesn't even factor into the equation.

 

Again, thanks for the great info.

 

Those brackets are tough... Are we talking JUST shocks or an all inclusive package with arms, bumps, etc.

Honestly, I think one of the best systems for a daily driven weekend warrior truck that will give you upper echelon performance (not all up in there, but close enough) is Elka. They are reasonably priced, made of aluminum (they won't look like ass after regular exposure to road chemicals) have good valving and are rebuildable. You won't get the strength and features of the big boys, but again, it's close enough. Most people will not out-drive those. There's an Elka v King comparison on here from jberry. He did a good job. It's a good read.

I am heavily biased. I have experienced what it is to ride on Fox and King stuff. I can't help but compare it all. Like I said before, if you're ignorant to bespoke tuned, high end suspension, you will probably be happy with the results of an off-the-shelf system. They will give you improved ride characteristics. I can't say if it's worth it or not. That's a personal choice. For me, yes. For you, you may not value them as much and that's ok.

 

Fair answer, and I appreciate it. I drove a Dodge 2500 for years and thought I was pretty high techy with my Bilstein 5100s on it LOL. When I bought my Tundra, I had to learn on the fly. You bring up a good point in that without experiencing the difference, it's pretty tough to say what's worth it and what's not.

 

This thread has really opened my eyes. I now have more questions!!! lol

@GravityGear I am the one who brought up ELKAs..for speed limit daily driving and weekend hunting and fishing trip duty (slow speed towing a boat or ATV into the bush) you say the 2.0 non resi elkas are not worth it? even for my light duty?

 

Thank you OP for this, and sorry it essentially got hijacked