Any other Mac fans out there?

Both platforms have similar quality. Both have similar experiences. Both are generally speaking, equally capable. It really comes down to experiential preference. Both are similarly priced at the premium level.

Apple users seem to feel some yuppy elitism, but it's just hollow egoism without substance. Similar to Broncos and Cowboys fans - neither really matters in the grand scheme of things. If you like Apple, buy Apple - but don't pretend it's because you're smarter or more sophisticated than others. =]

 

Not saying that anyone here has done this. But just.. in general - and it goes both ways.

 

Oh, I like Apple, no doubt about it, and experiental preference is definitely part of it; but if the experience were akin to the ones I've had with HW/SW support with the Android phones I've had, I wouldn't give a sh*t - I'd ignore them.

Now, back to my tea....

 

Been on an iOS dev team since 2015. I’ve come around and sort of consider myself an apple fan boy, though PC’s certainly do certain things better (gaming for example). The apple silicon shift was simply remarkable. My M1 2020 pro destroyed the 2017 27” i7 with 32gb of ram that it replaced. I then upgraded to a 16” M1Pro MacBook with 16gb ram. Tbh the m1 air or now m2 air are probably enough machine for 90+% of users. I compile large projects repeatedly while running numerous dev tools so I returned the 16” M1Pro and got the 16” M1Max. No regrets, but you’d be hard pressed to need the Max over the Pro or even the M2 / M1. No desire for the ultra, but I bet it’s nice. My compile time was close to 4 minutes on my 2017 iMac vs 90 seconds on the M1Max (113s on the M1Pro, 130s on the M1).

Doesn’t hurt my view of Macs that I just retired a 2011 27” iMac that ended up as my sons Minecraft server and daily driver after it was removed from its development roll in 2017.

 

I'd agree. In the past I would have absolutely LMAO at the thought of using a machine long-term with only 8GB of RAM in it....but this M2 is absolutely destroying my 3 year old Core i5 w/16GB RAM at any test you can throw at it. Same goes for my work computer (Core i7, 11th gen) with 16GB.

The nerd in me will always want more; and in 3-4 years I'll likely gift this one (13" MBA M2) to my son and get a 14" MBP or 14/15" MBA with tons of memory. But will I *NEED* it? Not likely. I've TRIED to get this thing to slow down, and nothing I've done yet (50+ tabs in Chrome; copying data; light photo/video editing; etc.) has made a dent.

 

100% with your experience and path forward. I loved my 13" M1 MBP with 8gb of ram. The 13" screen was not ideal for my use especially during pandemic times where I went full remote and spent a lot of time waiting in the Tundra for my kids to do various activities while I worked in the back seat. Main reason I opted for the M1 Max with 32gb of ram was "future proofing" as much as possible. Also, when I looked at activity monitor I could see that I had more memory pressure than I'd like on the 16" M1Pro with 16gb. It didn't slow down, but it was using page swap so it sort of encouraged me to hop up to 32gb as I was able to. The battery life on the 16" M1Pro was better than the M1Max and the Max seems to get hotter so if thats of greater concern then I think it makes a strong argument for the M1Pro chip or whatever the equivalent is available when you are looking to upgrade.

I will say that the displays on the 14 / 16 are incredible (not sure if those have trickled down to other models yet). Even my non-techie wife was amazed when I threw on a "high res" video on YouTube at a claimed 8k source video (no the display is not 8k, but it displays the best picture I've ever seen on any screen bar none).

They also support multiple (2) external monitors well and the built in speakers impressed the heck out of me.

-fanboy out...congrats on a fantastic machine!

 

Would you guys be willing to run and post results from a cross-platform benchmark? I'm genuinely curious how my Windows pile of junk stacks up to your Macbooks and whatnot. Would be willing to share costs too..



While there are certainly more robust and comprehensive benchmarking tools out there, this one allows an "apples to apples," or in this case, "apples to windows" comparison.

 

I ran GB5 just the other day on my MBA. Single core score was 1944, I think.

Multi-core was lower - like 8955 or so. With that said, that was “known” to begin with - ARM architecture in Apple silicon is a single-core beast but falls short on multi-core. Mine is a base model MacBook Air, not exactly marketed towards those who buy a Ryzen 9. LOL

I’m about to head to work but will post later when I get a moment.

 

Macs are great computers as long as you know what you are getting into. I'd love to have a Mac Mini as my HTPC but 2 out of the 3 games I play are not available on Mac and since Bootcamp is a no go anymore, I have to pass for now. My 27" 2011 iMac still runs like a champ though!

 

Right - and that's the thing. Everyone's use case is different. My day job is as a server (VMware, SQL, SCCM) administrator; I spend literally all day fixing problems, both human and electronic. When I get home, with relation to my electronics, I want two things:

- I want them to just freaking work. I don't care if they have the most features or are the cheapest; I just want them to work.
- When they DON'T work, I want the solution to be simple, even if that solution is to buy a new one, have someone else fix it, etc.

With respect to gaming, I'm solely a console gamer. Unsure why - probably because I don't have to worry about patching the system I play on, or BSoDs, or what have you. That's why I own a PS5/Switch/Xbox Series S.

Same with a MacBook. It's not like my Windows laptops were fraught with peril, but again...whether the issue is software, hardware, or I'm just dumb and don't want to spend time figuring something out (lol), I can call one phone #, and get help with any of them.

I will say, though, that yeah, getting rid of Boot Camp was dumb, IMHO. I understand why they say they did it, but still - I used to be able to maintain another partition w/Windows on it. Now I have to hold onto another Windows machine. And unless there's a good business use case for it, I'm not spending $99 for Parallels.

 

These are all well documented if you are just generally curious, haha . Your motives seem suspicious, LOL!

I don't believe Apple Silicon even supports e-GPU support anymore so it's not like you can drop a 4090ti on your Mac or drop in 128gb of ram in a year or two. That said, this machine turns on instantly, runs silently (I've literally never heard the fans), and has the same performance on Battery as it does plugged in, and runs CIRCLES around the intel version that it replaced. So apples to apples this is the best ever. Apples to Windows it depends on the use and need as to which is "better". I rely on Xcode for my job and while a hack-intosh was absolutely considered when I was moved from the "Web/PC" team to the "iPad team" I wasn't willing to bet my income / employment on its reliability.

My results on my $3499 MSRP M1Max 16" MBP:

 

Not an Apple person, so I don't know their specs, but I'm guessing all of the speed you're seeing is a result of the latest

$19 M.2 NVMe SSD Enclosure, USB 3.1 Gen 2 (10 Gbps) to NVMe PCI-E M.2 SSD Case Support UASP for NVMe SSD Size 2230/2242/2260/2280(up to 4TB) (M.2 NVMe)

M.2 NVMe drives replacing either 2.5"SSDs or old M.2s. My work pushes computers hard for computation purposes (not a gamer), and these got so fast with write/read that I began spec'ing machines with less RAM in favor of scratch space on a dedicated NVMe. Not to mention the OS is super snappy. This one component, I'd argue, makes more of a difference than any CPU/GPU/RAM/Mobo combo for an 'all-rounder.'

 

I have an iPhone and iPad issued by work. My issued work computer is a PC. For personal stuff, my phone is a Pixel, my tablet is a Samsung and my computer is a Macbook Air. So I use a mix.

My opinion? I like the Macbook hardware but I can't wait to get rid of it and go back to a PC. I'm constantly swearing at my iPhone and iPad. I can't stand iOS, I find it to be the most unintuitive and clunky system ever. It takes me 2 - 3 times as long to do anything on my Apple products as it does to do on my Android stuff or PCs. Microsoft Office is the vastly superior suite when it comes to getting shit done. Just doing stuff like organizing folders, moving items around, and navigating around the computer system is so much easier with Windows than Mac for me.

I gave Mac an honest try, since I'm the guy who just wants my stuff to work and that's apparently what it's good at. Contrary to popular experience, Mac never worked for me and made everything way more difficult.

 

I’ve been Mac only for a long time. The record industry runs almost solely on Mac machines, from home studios to the biggest commercial studios in town. I used a 2011 MBP for work for 8+ years until buying a 16” MBP on Black Friday in 2019. It’s wild how much better the new one is. I plan on getting 8+ years out of this one as well.

I kept the old one running so long by not doing updates for the system or for the recording software I use. This worked well for me, as I do not come close to utilizing the full functionality of a DAW at home. What ultimately did the ol’ girl in for my specific use was DropBox becoming incompatible because the machine was soooo old.

 

I'm not concerned with performance per watt, but performance per US Dollar.

I'd love to see your benchmarks and your receipt. =]

 

This is my experience too. I work in a mixed environment and have been issued Apple gear in the past. It's junk, in my opinion. That said, I realize it's all based on experience. I'm a functional guy - I prefer function over form and I'm not trying to fit in with a bunch of middle-aged divorcees at Starbucks. I like stuff that works over a large variety of tasks. I like customization. Apple's interfaces are clunky and poorly thought out. Further, they are constantly behind the curve when implementing new tech, but their users are always like "YAY MY iPHONE DOES THIS IS AMAZING NEW THING!" while us Android users have been doing it for 3-5 years.

Apple just doesn't fit the bill for me.

 

Any reliability complaints are anecdotal. I have several Windows machines running 24/7 doing various tasks, and there are no reliability concerns. Reliability is definitely one of the reasons that the Microsoft environment is used by the overwhelming majority of enterprise environments on the planet. Again, I don't think the performance or security arguments are rooted in fact. At the user level it's a preferential experience.

 

I'm looking for your specific benchmark, not an averaged performance standard. =]

This Windows box is 3-4 years old. I've got about $2000 in it. It's up 24/7, although I did reboot today.

 

My old bandmates were this way - must use Mac/Pro Tools. They eventually came around when they realized we could fully produce a track within Reaper without any issue. DAWs really only need RAM because of the plugins and a fast/reliable drive; even better if solid state (fortunately learned that at rehearsal instead of a show when the kick and bass drops would throw the drummer's click off because the whole session stumbled).

Of course, we were only townies opening for national acts, but it worked for us. You of course wouldn't send Reaper stems/sessions to a Nashville studio if that's your daily gig... Just depends on your use.

 

There is no proof that you actually own that computer without a personalized benchmark. It takes 7 minutes. Post it on up. =]

 

Meh, could be photoChopped or downloaded. Haha! Though I guess the question is which machine would photoshop or download better / faster for x dollar !!!!

In regards to your previous post...Nice Rack! (because I'm also 10 evidently)

 

Well, right. I thought about getting an M1 Pro, but if I'm not mistaken, in the configuration I wanted (at *LEAST* 8GB RAM/512GB SSD), at the time, I would have had to spend at least $1500. Conversely, I was able to get the same spec in an MBA for $1150. Given my use case (lots of surfing; a smidgen of photo editing; music; etc.) it didn't make sense to spend the extra $350 or so.

With that said, you may indeed be right...but last I checked I was up to about 13-14 hours off charger, and the battery was around 31%. That's more than good enough.

 

In general, you're not going to find a Mac that can't be bested by a Windows machine, for sure. But I think it says quite a lot that a *base* MacBook Air processor can beat a Ryzen 9 quite handily at single-core processing stuff, and not be absolutely destroyed on the multi-core stuff. 3 or 4 years ago I spent about the same amount on a ThinkPad T480s, and this laptop absolutely destroys it in GeekBench.

 

I'm not going to say Apple gear is junk; just like I won't say Android or Windows are junk. But I WILL say that if I worked in a mixed environment, it'd be a completely different experience. Usually 'mixed environment' means a bunch of Windows machines and a few Apple machines. Adding a few Apple machines to a Windows domain has always been a challenge at best; and the same goes for adding a few Windows machines to an Apple domain/workgroup.

Can't figure out off the top of my head how to export the results as a pic, so:

https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/19333882

 

I dunno man. So far we're yuppy elitists and middle-aged divorcees.

Actually it's the ARM architecture move. For multi-core stuff it can be argued that you can get performance for cheaper, but Apple ARM silicon is a freakin' monster when it comes to the single-core stuff.

 

There's always that one guy....

Seriously though - I've got Debian running on my old Shuttle home server downstairs. Big fan of Linux.

 

If you are in a "mixed environment (network)" on one of your Macs go into Finder > Network and look at the default icon that Apple chose for all PCs lol
Shots Fired.
(spoiler: If memory serves it appeared to be an IBM PC (style) with the Blue Screen of Death)

Also, I hope people would enjoy what they have and have what they enjoy. I don't care if you're pro PC or pro Mac. We're nerds folks. Same team.

 

Mac / iPhone user here. Mostly because I dont have to remember passwords for anything and the "it just works" tagline. Compatability is easy. connects to bluetooth speakers in my snowboard helmet, for music and other bluetooth speakers. I have a 2010 MacBook Pro that I swapped out the spinner and put a SSD in about 6 years ago. Transformed it to a new machine. handles the browsing, music, etc that I use it for. Connects to some guitar nerd gear that I have and handles that without a problem.
Currently typing at the office on a 2013 or 2014 iMac where I swapped the spinner for an SSD too. Runs like a top. I can airdrop photos with ease back and forth. No complaints.

I don't use apple play for the car or whatever, but my iPhone connects music via bluetooth to my OEM headunit every time without issue. Apple Maps automatically lowers the volume of the music and shouts out turn by turn etc. Apple may not be the top end spec wise, but the technology that I like and find convenient is always there, and always working for me. Kind of like something else we are all familiar with.