2022 Tundra vs 2022 F-150 opinion?

ya not buying that either, it’s not like Toyota doesn’t make a few cars lol.

they make a gazzillion of those and they are still more reliable than most of what the big 3 make

 

Both of those issues could have been solved most easily by shedding weight. Weigh more, less payload available. Plus you have to get and keep all that weight moving. Every EcoBoost guy will tell you it's one or the other. Eco OR Boost, but not both. The Toyota 3.4 is the same way I'm sure, have to keep it out of the turbos.. Best thing Ford did recently in my book was move to all aluminum body, and that wasn't even this generation. But it let the truck shed like 600 pounds.

 

My 21 lariat transmission was jumpy. My 22 and 23 tundra were smoother but still here and there jumpy. My biggest issue with the tundra is going from P to D on startup and it lunges forward every time. So far my raptor transmission has been the smoothest . My only gripe is the sport mode transmission programming is more aggressive downshifting than I want.

Suspension on the tundra is better if you get the pro or the AVS, otherwise anything else is negligible. But handling? Nah. It’s not hands down. The turn radius alone on the tundra eliminates that.

toyota does tend to be more reliable and the prior gen is bulletproof. But that assumption can’t be carried forward.

I’ve had 2 3rd gen tundras and 3 new gen f150’s. I’ve had QC issues with all of them.

 

Exactly.
By the logic above, a Camry should be unreliable. It’s not. Always near #1. Toyota as the number 1 automaker should have the worst reliability. They don’t. Always near the top. Lexus, the most complicated, is number one.

 

There is a difference between what I said "more problems" and what you are saying "bigger problems"
Maybe its just a misread but bigger problems to me implies problems that stop your truck. Engine, Transmission, Electronics/Computer ,etc....
I have faith that the Toyota Model will "more" guard against these types of problems over the Big 3.
But now all the model lines are integrated and parts come from many sources these days.
As an IT guy I do not have confidence in the "circuit boards/soldering/wiring" sourced from ???? for all these trucks, that allows for these integrated chips to be made and work. They control all aspects of the Truck.
So I think as you increase production and need more "chips" and their underlying circuit boards. which are in short supply - this will affect reliability. More problems.
My 8 year old Lenovo Thinkpad computer will still outlast the new Lenovo I bought last month brand new due to the quality of the circuit boards, soldering, wiring, etc... They were both made in China but they have been made very different.
I see differences also in the way my 4Rrunner is made versus my Tundra. Different factories.

 

Remember how the old guard bitched and bitched about the move to aluminum?

 

Ok, so you’re saying higher volume equals more problems and lower reliability?

 

Higher volume does equal more problems but doesn’t mean lower reliability.

 

Haha, I remember the Chevy commercial where the guy dropped a tool box in the aluminum bed and punched a hole. I still have not seen an F-150 bed with a hole in it in real life.

 

GM started having rear window leaks when they switched large portions of their trucks to aluminum in 2019.

 

I wasn't trying to kick off an aluminum vs steel discussion per se, just saying that losing weight on a truck is a great way to increase payload and efficiency. New FI motors, hybrid, gearing, active air dams, it will always take X amount of energy to get 6000 pounds up to highway speed from a stop.

 

I will say this, I got a particularly nasty shopping cart ding on my Powerboost that I already paid out of pocket to get removed and then have that bed panel repainted. It was a windy day so maybe that cart was really flying. But If this makes any sense, I feel like if it hadn't hit that hard, the aluminum would have done better than steel. But with it hitting hard enough to do damage, the dent was worse on the aluminum than if it would have hit a steel bed side at the same speed.

I guess Pretty much the same labor either way to repair regardless of the actual size of the dent. But I feel like dent resistance advantage of the aluminum vs steel goes down as severity of impact goes up.

 

Each case needs to be looked at differently.
Let's use the boat analogy as it applies to changing directions.
Smaller boats turn direction much quicker than larger boats.
Based on sales numbers a Tundra is a smaller boat than an F150.
If problems are found it is easier to change direction, analyse and resolve.
I heard reports this past year that Toyota actually stopped production to fix issues. They could do this because Tundra production is small enough and company structure (people/facilities) that support Tundra, allowed for it.
Once a company reaches a certain production Sales number there is a larger supporting crew and facilities needed. It is a multiplier effect.
I don't have the capacity numbers to say what the Toyota numbers would be, but at some point where company resources are stretched (these resources could be Builldings, parts, people, logistics, etc... related.
Problems become more difficult to respond to due to complexity , corporate, legal, trying to get approvals etc...
Problems go unresolved. Reliability ratings - one area - get hit.
jmo

 

My understanding is the F150 also uses different frames to save weight ?

On a Crew Cab 4WD, the 3.3L and 2.7L Ecoboost have a lighter duty frame.
the 5.0L and the 3.5L Ecoboost come with the Heavy Duty Frame.

 

Not saying you are wrong, but I have not heard that anywhere else.

 

Labor is generally higher on PDR for aluminum. In fact, it is often the first question they ask. Aluminum usually has an upcharge as it requires more force and time. Not knocking aluminum (it's the future), but just something to be aware about.

 

I have. I think they actually have 3 frames - the two @borla123 mentioned plus the one for the Heavy Duty Payload Package.

 

Interesting, I'll have to look that up.

So Ford has three different frames for one truck but Toyota puts the same frame in every 4x4 they make. Talk about different strategies..

 

I should add that was meant very tongue in cheek. F-150 is a huge portion of FoMoCos total sales and and even larger portion of their profit while the Tundra is a sliver of Toyotas global sales. TBH if they didn't make the new Tundra share so many parts with other models they probably wouldn't make it at all.

 

I've posted in this thread previously. Longtime Toyota/Lexus guy (20+ years) who sold my 4runner for more than I paid for it after 5 years of use and decided to get a 2021 F150 Powerboost Platinum because the Tundra launch was so delayed/difficult. As I've noted in my prior posts, there's a ton to love about the F150 and it's a great truck, in my opinion, when it works. I've had way too many little annoying problems and two "bigger" issues that have me throwing in the towel at 21,000 miles before the warranty is up early next year. I'm going to get a 23 Tundra Platinum as I just don't have the patience, or long-term reliability confidence, in the Ford after 2 years, no matter how much I like the truck.

 

@Cpl_Punishment


You need to have access to the Ford ESource Book. But somebody posted a PDF link to the F150 2020 on the internet.
I'm sure there is 2022 info posted somewhere.

You need to scroll down to page 33 of 45. I took a screen print that shows the LD and HD/HPP Side Rail section and Section Modulus shown in inches. Its a thinner metal with the LD.

The Payload numbers (interesting) are page 14

https://madocumentupload.marketinga...aa8da0220006ddaacf8145ae76afdb8e29d3&v5=False

 

My 2014 Lariat was 6140 lbs completely empty with a full tank of gas bone stock.

The fattest 2015+ F150's(excluding the Powerboost or Raptor) are like 5500 or 5600 lbs. Unfortunately, they also reduced the GVWR(mine is 7700 lbs and they were dropped to 7050 lbs for the same config) by a similar amount so a truck optioned similar to mine was within 25-50 lbs of payload.

 

here is 2021:


There is a website you can download them at back to 2014 for any Ford truck.

 

Just two frames, then. My mistake.

Highest payload you can get is 3270 lbs in a 4x2 regular cab long box with the 5.0L V8.

Highest payload in a 4x4 crew cab is 2710 lbs in a standard box truck with the 5.0L. Highest in a 4x4 crew cab short box is 2080 lbs or ~800 lbs more than my truck.

 

My truck is 7000 GVWR with a payload of 1577. Wife just HAD to have the moonroof......

 

I have personally seen a crew cab 4x4 with >2000 lbs of payload on a dealer lot. it was an XL with the STX package. They are not impossibly rare, you just cant get a pimped out Limited.

Honestly, the current XL trims come pretty well equipped all things considered. And with Forscan making it so easy to upgrade things on the F150, you could the XL to pretty close to higher trim trucks without a ton of investment.

 

ya, most people who are weighing are finding a few hundred lbs more than the sticker says. I havent weighed mine, I don't rally care all that much, its rated for enough for me and is several hundred lbs more than my 2016 was

 

Yeah but with my 2018 Crewmax Tundra I have a 1) Big Ass Cab, with a 2) Big Ass Moonroof and heavy motor. and a 3) Big Ass Roll Down Rear Window heavy motor 4) Big Ass Tall Real Steel Bed.
All 4 kill payload. I would not give up 1, 3 and 4.
Number 2 the Moonroof with motor ? Came with it, never open it , even keep the cover closed for glare, it has the worst moonroof seal design I have ever seen on a vehicle.
Rear Axle lbs rating for bed carry is higher than the new Truck.

 

Mine said 6000# last time I left the dump.

Sticker says truck is 5423. With me (180), diamondback (120), hitch (60?), 35" tires(100) and small amount of gear it's about right on the money.

 

No moonroof here and I don't think the F150 cab is much smaller.