Winter is here, Auto LSD is too!!!

Seriously, you guys need to read your owner's manuals... Here is a paragraph regarding our LSD systems:

The AUTO LSD system aids traction by using the traction control system to control engine performance and braking when one of the drive wheels begins to spin.
The system should be used only when one of the drive wheels spinning occurs in a ditch or rough surface.

The following warning is a few paragraphs down in the LSD section, titled 'To Avoid an Accident'...

To avoid an accident.
Failure to do so, a much greater steering effort and more careful cornering control will be required.

●Do not use the AUTO LSD system in conditions other than when one of the drive wheels spinning occurs in a ditch or rough surface.

● Do not drive with the AUTO LSD system continuously turned on.


It is not only harmful to the system to drive w/Auto LSD left on, it is dangerous!!!! Please re-read that last bold section from the owner's manual and stop giving people bad advice.

 

Please see the above....

 

I see that Western NY has 3 FEET on the ground already in some places!! Holy moly, better bust out the super duper 4WD machines for that type of accumulation.

 

Thanks for clarifying this. I did read my manual when I purchased my truck a couple years ago, but when winter rolls around I try and refresh with the 2nd Gen sticky page. This info should be added as well, it does a great job of explaining how to activate/deactivate. But says nothing about when it’s recommended/not.

 

Is it just me or is this system seemingly designed to be counter-intuitive? Although I suppose once you fully grasp what each thing is designed to do, it gets better. So just slap it into 4HI when you encounter significant snow or whatever and want the grip, add in the LSD if conditions seem a bit much for the 4HI system alone and you meet the other suggestions, wheels slipping/spinning, losing traction, etc?

 

This screams CYA to me. I have used AUTO LSD pretty extensively and it does nothing that I can tell until the rear wheel speeds are dramatically different and then it will grab the wheel that is out of control with the brakes. I like to call it my Poor-Man's drift mode because it will allow the entire rear end of the truck to slide, whereas normally just turning off traction control spins one wheel but the other maintains grip and the truck will not slide. This is what I assume the "much greater steering effort" is referring to.

I am just playing devil's advocate here but I'm not sure that there is a mechanical problem with leaving it on (other than brake wear as mentioned previously). It seems to me that Toyota just doesn't want to be responsible for any situation that could occur on public roads hence the "ditch or rough surface" note.

 

And do all of this switchology driving and avoid the idiots sliding out around you. I drove my Taco 4WD for 15 years in 4WD in mixed bag snow / ice / dry pavement with no popped CV joints or any other issues. I bought my Tundra expecting the same thing. The VSC switch on my Pro is tucked under the environmental controls and you have lean down to search for it to engage Auto LSD - not something you can really do on the fly and still pay attention to where you're going. I guess you only get to this if you're stopped and stuck.

Is the 4WD that really that fragile in a mixed bag of snow / ice / dry pavement? I understand not using 4WD on dry pavement.

 

The simple answer is no. The only thing you can't do is turn sharply on dry pavement. Long banking turns on dry pavement are not great for the system but it will tolerate it. Tundra has a locked center diff(transfer case) so when the front and rear wheels travel at different speeds it creates binding because the transfer case demands the front and rear move at the same speed. Again, only a huge problem if you are getting the steering near full lock on a dry high traction surface.

 

This I can see. Even with my Taco, I avoided tight turns in 4WD in the snow if I could or extended driving on dry pavement. Thanks!

 

While I do appreciate you bringing this up I would like to say something about it.

I feel “less” safe while having Auto LSD off in mixed conditions than having it on all the time, never had an issue. I have not felt it is harder to steer while it is on. It’s smooth as always.

I believe this is more of a way for Toyota to cover themselves from any legal trouble.

 

"Safe" is what I seek when I drive.

 

I am with you.

 

I just wished our trucks allowed auto-lsd in 4H or Atrac in 4L

 

On a related note, for the winter drivers having some fun in 2WD I made an observation.

My 2014 in 2WD, when disabling traction and stability control (holding trac) it would disable auto LSD. This would leave me in full traction and stability control off and lots of 1 wheel spinning.

My 2021 in 2WD, when disability traction and stability control, auto LSD defaults to On with stability fully off, which is a great combination for having some fun in the snow!

 

I tried auto LSD today in CO with our snowing conditions from yesterday. While I did feel it kick in once on the road when switching lanes in semi snowy conditions, it did next to nothing when trying to leave a snowy/icy parking lot. Just switched to 4h and np

 

Yes... that's by design. When you are stuck in a ditch or wheels are spinning because you're in super deep snow, etc. and you want to last ditch effort the truck and believe that by "sending it" you might be able to free the truck, this is when to activate the LSD.

 

Maybe I’m missing something - but after all this I am feeling like Auto LSD is completely pointless because you’d prefer to just switch to 4x4 in the situations you’re supposed to use LSD in… no?

 

***Auto LSD 'activated' turns off Trac Control.... So, you lose the nannies that help reduce wheel spin during traction loss when accelerating, braking and cornering.

2WD w/the nannies on and the appropriate tires/traction device for conditions (chains, studs, etc..) and allow the Trac Control, etc. to do its job.

If you encounter deep(er) snow, activating 4HI and keeping your momentum will get you through most of the time w/decent tires.

If you are in ice, slow down, and have chains or studded tires w/truck in 2WD (again allowing the nannies to do their job). There are times where 4WD may help, but remember 4WD does not help you stop only go (straight).

*** Traction 101 ***
For you to accelerate, brake or turn safely, it is required that you have rolling friction. The only way to achieve this is through the tire having contact w/the surface it is being operated on and for the tire to be able to grip/bite into that surface. If you do not have this, nothing else matters!!!!

Hope this helps.

 

My '08 and '21 "cycle" differently through the nannies as well. Your 2014 should be able to disable trac and stab control and have LSD on if you keep cycling it through.

 

I think the part being missed is LSD (on our trucks) is not AWD nor is it similar to a Torsen LSD design. So, when you say 'situations you're suppose to use LSD in', I think the confusion is not understanding the parameters of the LSD system in our trucks. Please review the owner's manual for details on this.

Think of it as a "traditional" 4x4 system in that once you activate 4HI or 4LO the differential is 'locked'.... meaning that the differential is no longer allowing the "inside" and "outside" wheels to turn at a slightly different rate to prevent binding, etc. The 4WD system on these trucks function much like "old school" 4x4 trucks with the exception that you don't have to get out and lock your hubs. Additionally, they (Toyota) added the nannies to the 2WD systems to maximize traction during acceleration, braking and turning, and this is done by reduction of power to wheels that are slipping under various conditions.

The "Auto LSD" system in these trucks is ONLY used as a last ditch effort to free a stuck vehicle, and it is meant to be deactivated as soon as the vehicle is no longer stuck. Whereas the normal nannies would remove power from the spinning wheels as you are trying to "rock" or "spin" the vehicle free, Auto LSD allows you to send power to the already spinning wheel in hopes of getting it to "bite".

So, it's not pointless, but it isn't meant to operate like an AWD system.

 

I have liked Nokian Hakkapeliita LT3, but only have had them studded. Right now I am on Toyo Open Country A/T III which I also like even though they are not specifically a winter tire, they still have the 3PMSF designation. I'll probably give the GT Radial Icepro LT3 that landphil mentioned when I pick up a second set of rims for this new truck. In the past I have run a set of studded tires, which really are the best option, but I had another set of wheels for my last truck.

 

This is from another thread that was asking about the binding they were experiencing on dry pavement when in 4HI... It kinda talks about our 4x4 as it compares to AWD for those that are wondering. It does not address LSD, etc....


https://youtu.be/Jk246sutET0

 

I had the opposite experience with it in my wife's 2wd 4Runner a couple years ago during that big Texas snow/ice storm. I had trouble getting out of our driveway due to the drainage dip at the bottom, turned on auto LSD and and bam I'm out. Same thing when leaving the gas station, I was genuinely impressed. I have since replaced that vehicle with an AWD but the auto LSD worked fantastic for me. I guess anything can be good when you have very low expectations lol. Oddly enough she saw a 4Runner that couldn't back out of their parking spot in front of her work the next day, 4 people trying to push it. I said did you tell them about the button ?? She said no she was too shy...... Ugh

 

The Auto/Electronic LSD on these trucks is pure garbage.
Why Toyota wasted their time with it on these trucks is beyond me.
They should have just given us a true LSD.
The Auto/Electronic LSD is hands down my biggest gripe about this truck.

 

This thread is amazing.

“The auto LSD is so useful!”
“The auto LSD is total garbage!”
“I leave it on a lot.”
“Don’t EVER leave it on for extended periods of time.”

 

Does "YMMV" cover it?

 

When folks claim they like the system I always wonder if they have ever driven a true LSD?
If one hasn’t I could see why one may think it is a good system.

 

All that button goes is allow you to spin the wheels more without cutting power. The throttle is limited without it on but the fake LSD is always on unless you hold the button down to shut it off.

 

when I step on the gas without activating Auto LSD it does not work. The wheels just keep spinning. It doesn’t seem to cut power for me.

 

Someone posted this earlier in the thread and I just watched it not sure if you did https://youtu.be/0-IiaNoexpM I never really did any thorough testing on my own truck though