Tundra or Defender?

Lol! Please don’t do that. That’s almost 10ft deep

 

none of the stock tundras are worth a shit for real off-roading IMO, the approach angle, stock grond clearance, and lack of recovery points is just a deal killer

that said, it really depends on what kind of off-roading we are talking about here. if its just really mild , then get a hybrid lower trim and add a much better lift and suspension and you'll be cheaper and more capable than a stock pro

 

shit, I didnt know Ford made submarines too, HA

 

For forest roads, mountain passes, shelf roads, etc, the 2nd gen is pretty great. At least with a 2” lift like the Pro.

Everything is tucked up so high and tight, great angles, and it is easily maneuverable with a very tight turn radius.

I do agree that it’s substantially better as a platform to be modded.

Bone stock TRD Pro (down to the Michelins) tackling Moab and Sand dunes:
https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x3vgvtx

 

agreed, but I wasn't talking about the last gen, much better ground clearance and approach angles, on the new gen, toyota made the nose too long and turning radius suck on the new one depending on what your talking about for off-roading, along with no front recovery point that wont rip off the front of the truck

but I don't care about any of that anymore, Im more of a personal and business use pavement person now, tow my small fishing boat up north and I get a great business write off.

I just like trucks no matter what, I thought about a sequoia , but they totally phucked up the cargo area and I couldn't even fit everything I need for vacation in there

 

I was also going to suggest a 2021 LC as it’s pretty much at the price point that you listed in your first post. But since it doesn’t fit exactly all your needs and isn’t a forever vehicle for you, then I think you made the right choice. Might suggest upgrading to the latest iPhone or getting an Inreach if you ever decide to head out of cell phone range because I personally would have a hard time trusting that defender to get me there and back.. just my $.02. Cheap insurance

 

I have satellite emergency response. I’m good.

 

I love British cars. Have always had atleast one in my stable for the last 20 years. Never had any major issues other than a blown motor in the jag. But that was my fault. Some minor issues usually in the beginning of ownership and covered under warranty. It’s definitely not going to be problem free but that’s the price you pay for driving a British car. As long as you don’t plan to keep it much past 100k miles, you’ll be ok. The Brits make the best looking cars.

 

Both consumer reports and JD Power have rated Land Rover as the worst car in America. Rates one out of five on terms of reliability, which is backed up by anecdotal reports of friends of mine who had major problems early on, and never made it to 100k miles before selling them at a huge loss... IMO shittiest cars out there, and thats also how JD Power and Consumer reports feel as well. Didnt make it in 2021, and got killed again in 2022.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/joshma...merica-according-to-jd-power/?sh=6c5d053163b8

https://www.motorbiscuit.com/land-rover-officially-worst-dependability-2021-j-d-power-study/

 

Not trying to dog pile you, OP. Just want you to have all the info possible.

 

What's the date on that graphic? I only ask because Saab stopped producing cars back in like 2013 or something. Plus it's got Saturn & Pontiac on it.

 

Long term reliability study. It goes waaaaaaay back. This is a cumulative rating. Drivetrain issues only. The site is run by Volvo fanboys.

Edit: it is kept current. It is meant to inform buyers of how many drivetrain issues used cars have. Those cars still exist on the road and in the used market, so they’re still in the data pool.

www.dashboard-light.com

 

Looks like you already have your mind set on Defender, so just buy what you like. You're the one who's going to have to drive it every day. I like Defenders, just can't justify the price, and if your pockets allow you, fuck reliability, get that thing and enjoy it

 

i would buy one of these Explorers than have an 80k Land Rover given to me.

 

If the OP doesn’t need a truck, lives near a dealer, can afford the Defender, and understands Land Rover “reliability” then by all means buy the Land Rover. As a daily driver the new Defender will be a far nicer place to spend time than any Tundra.

 

Right you lot, time for a history lesson.

Land Rover is not British and hasn't been since 1994. BMW acquired them, and then Ford and now Tata. So if you want to bash the current Defender's reliability then blame the Indians who have it built in Slovakia.

The great thing about most pre-1994 Landies is that you could have a small toolbox in the back that would enable fixing pretty much any issue encountered on or off road, so whilst they may not have ever been the most reliable of vehicles anyone with half a brain cell could fix them. We always used to carry half shafts on board as the norm because the blasted things used to snap for a pastime.

So, if anyone is giving away a low mileage Camel Defender I'll take it off your hands but you can keep that modern plastic mobile entertainment muck that passes for an off road vehicle nowadays.

Edit: I'll let you know if I can think of any British vehicle that was ever known as reliable.
Most of the reason our large car industry went down the toilet is because manufacturers refused to move with the times and adopt the technologies that made the Japanese car industry what it is today.

 

I feel like you’re holding back from calling us bloody wankers

On a serious note, I did know that Ford bought them a while back; but I don’t know if that’s a point in favor of reliability or not. I’m leaning towards not. LOL

 

Sorry but this looks like a Honda element.

Interior is awesome though.

 

If it looks like an Element, you can say the same with the 3rd Gen Tundra - it looks like a stretched Tacoma.

 

I’m quoting your Forbes JD Power story:

“Some of the most deteriorated areas from 90 days to three years of ownership are starter battery failures, outdated maps and Android Auto/Apple Car Play and voice recognition problems, which I’ve written about extensively in this column. The increase in problems in the technology area shows the importance that over-the-air updates can play in correcting issues with audio systems and keeping the information in them up to date.”

That’s what issues LR had to get them on this list. Infotainment issues primarily. Not drivetrain. Not engine.

 

I think you mean that ford sold Jaguar/Land River to TaTa motors of India.

 

Defender is like a Kardashian.

Looks good from five feet away.

Will likely ruin your bank account and any chance to find a decent relationship in the future.

You will realize it was only the make up and clothes that got you interested and the inside was dead from the beginning.

But……..hey…….it is your life. Enjoy it to the fullest.

 

They are one of, if not THE, most unreliable car money can buy on average. I think they have recently been supplanted by tesla. Regardless, back when I tracked these things, Something like 43% of Land rovers had major defects from the factory.

 

Only if you want to be Lion food!

 

They can't move or keep out water but they make submarines.