Tundra engine recall - interesting news

If you really think Toyota went to smaller displacement, turbo engines solely in the name of "progress" and EPA/CAFE regulations had no influence on that decision, I've got some ocean front property down here in Arizona I'd like to tell you about.

 

It's not about MPG for them, it's about emissions. They should go somewhat hand in hand, but they don't. Emissions are measured as parts per million at the tail pipe. Ways to reduce emissions that don't improve MPG.

 

Eventually we are going to end up with 5k lb vehicles all propelled by lawnmower engines.

That will be the pivot point at which EVs become the more desirable product. Which is what the OEMs want. Simultaneous running of ICE and EV programs will be increasing complex, expensive and risky from a business perspective. They will want to streamline to EV only and making ICE vehicles less desirable maybe a more decisive way of killing ICE demand than relying on EV product advancements alone

 

No, OEMs don't want that. OEMs wouldn't be pursuing EVs at all if it weren't being forced via regulation.

 

I guess on the bright side with this engine replacement, there are some screaming deals on gently used 2022's out there. I noticed there are better deals to be had on a low mileage 2022/3 than a comparable 2.5 gen.

It appears 3rd gen resale is tracking like a 90's Chevy commercial.

 

All the automakers are global. USA will be the

The big automakers are not going to just cede an increasing global market share to Tesla.

ICE will soon be a primarily USA only product. OEMs are global companies that want to maximize profits via global products. They don't want to make market specific products like they did decades ago. That hurts the bottom line.

Also gotta remember many of the OEMs are led by leftist CEOs or North American presidents who are all aboard with the green new deal. Like Mary Barra of GM. They are itching to kill ICE first chance they get; they dont care about needs of rural areas, contractors, farmers, etc. They are contributing large sums of $s to PACs to make it happen.

 

Facts. I’m still casually toying with the idea of selling my Tacoma for a Tundra (2.5 or 3rd). The prices of low mileage 2022-2024 are so close to higher mileage 2.5 gens is a compelling option, assuming one isn’t completely turned off by the engine recall.

Hell some of the 2.5 gen’s I’ve shopped are less than $10k difference from brand new 2024/25 already on lots. Bonkers

 

Discerning buyers know

 

Yeah, I was checking out the prices this morning and was shocked how many are floating around the mid 30's mark with less than 60K (still in powertrain) Not so with the 2.5 gens.

 

Objective opinions are abound.

 

those trigger you for sure, lol.

but, I do agree with the fact that long term reliability determination is going to take a while, its only been out for 3 years, its too early.

but just because its boosted doesn't mean it wont last, toyota has made plenty of charged and boosted cars that lasted.

obviously, the debris recall didnt help this perception, but it is what it is.

 

your underselling it trying to make a point, it's not "roughly the same" overall.
3-4 MPG is 25% or so, which is a lot. even at 3 mpg more, every 32 gallon tank gets almost 100 more miles.

and in my specific case, my 2016 got 13-15 city/highway, this one gets 17-22 city/highway. Both are crewmax platinum 4x4


that said, Ive never been much of a MPG guy, but I certainly don't mind not doing this all the time anymore

 

this ^.

emissions killed the V8s.

GM is the only one left with any displacement, we'll see how long that lasts.

When I test drove, I liked the 6.2 GMC engine, but damn the seats were so bad, I had to so no thank you. GMs 10-speed is also no where near the tundra 10

hemi is dead now

 

To be fair, Ford still has their 5.0 Coyote too. Unfortunately both that, and GM's 6.2 have AFM/DoD which kinda ruins the whole thing

 

Ford still has the 7.3 and 6.8. Ram still has the 6.4 Hemi as well.

 

I was being fair, I said with any displacement, 5.0 doesn't count for that for me.

I do agree with the AFM, and I was a little concerned with the lifters on that 6.2 since they just don't seem to fix that. I was going to give it a try anyways

 

not in 1/2 tons, I think 3/4 and up have different emissions requirements

 

In SuperDuty's, we're talking 1/2 tons. Do 3/4T and up even get factored into a manufacturers CAFE requirements?

 

I think they are exempt from that, that's why they still have larger V8s.

 

All the more reason Toyota should've moved into ¾-ton territory with the Tundra. A 6.4L iForce HD or some other silly moniker. 3k-4k payload (based on config), 6ft & 8ft bed options, 3 cab options. SR, SR5, Limited and 1794 (so they can play king ranch too).

I think they are severely underestimating that market. I'd be in it.

Make the Tacoma the trail, crawl, and mall rig (as it continues to bloat in dimensions anyway.

 

If we are going down the road of Toyota extending their truck offerings I think the best move would be to make compact truck to be a competitor to the Ford Maverick. Since prices have sky rocketed many traditional mid-size truck buyers are stepping down to compact trucks. The Maverick basically has no competition in the compact truck segment beyond the Hyundai which doesn't sell nearly as well.

 

Man, 12MPG! Ouch. I get 12ish towing the tractor and other machines and 16ish just driving…. maybe eke out 18 on the highway empty. I’d love to get better. I’ve looked at fuelly estimates, seems like 14-18 is the meat of the bar graph with 125 or something trucks for the 2022s. I know it’s the future for all trucks, but to me, it’s just another Rube Goldberg machine created by regulations vs consumer demand. Then again, here in NY they are pushing zero emission electric big rigs, which is the dumbest idea I’ve ever heard.

 

HD will be the last federally protected put what ever you want under the hood. If you got a $100k buy if for a grocery hauler no questions asked.

There maybe a business case for Toyota if they can build a HD truck that is capability competitive and price focused. Less what Taylor Sheridan drives on the 4 6's and more truck to do a big task.

 

Not all HD trucks are 100k...Especially the models equipped with the V8 gas.

 

I had a 2023 Sierra 1500 with the 6.2. I had all kinds of issues with the electronics and build quality. I also got 17 mpg on an engine that required premium fuel. So, I got the Tundra hybrid and get better mpg with regular fuel AND more power. GM is a dinosaur.

 

ya, Ive always noticed that some of the 5.7 trucks are just Total shit and always were and other seemed ok, mine was just a pig but I never really cared that much

I wanted toyota to offer a 6.2 iForce to go head to head with GM, but alas, they didnt.

That said, I really like this set-up it pulls and accelerates really smooth and easy and tows awesome.

The low end torque is really good and AISIN knocked it out of the park.

my only point was, they do get better on the average and 3-4 adds up for the MPG people. This current truck I have gets 22+ on the highway pretty easily, I never got that in any of my other tundras so I won't complain.

 

What I thought Toyota should and could do easily to offer more payload for a 1/2 ton truck is this...

offer the non-hybrid truck with the hybrid GVWR and call it a "payload package".

That would get an extra 400-600lbs so my truck for example would go from 1350 lbs to 1850 lbs. The lower lighter models would get over 2K for real in a crewmax using this.

They could do that without a bunch of BS, it doesn't even need any hardware changes as the rear end is only different due to the torque of the hybrid not capacity.

 

I have no regrets winding up with this tundra platinum over that GMC AT4 6.2 refresh. The tundra is a much better truck
I wanted to test drive one though as I had visions of a 6.2 Borla rumbling like a mofo, HA

but I really like this powertrain, it pulls and moves this truck so easily its ridiculous, the boost rush makes my 5.7 feel underpowered and it wasn't.

 

Don't mean to cherry pick your post, but this is exactly what I was hoping for/talking about.
6.2/6.4 either plus the Aisin would really give the new GM 6.6L + 10spd a market run. Again put the 3.4TT in a Taco Pro/trail, whatever, and use the 4-banger for the rest of the trims. Get out of the ½ ton market (even though the more and more bloated midsize tacos are probably approaching/exceeding 1k payload anyway) and make the Tundra an HD offering only.

 

ya, its a done deal at this point, and it looks like toyota knew what they were doing from a business standpoint

the gen 3 tundra is selling very well

2024-q3-truck-sales-tundra-gains-ram-big-drop-tacoma-slips

I would not want them to drop the 1/2 ton tundra, I don't want a HD truck for my needs though, and I don't want a TACO