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Subs - 1 or 2

Discussion in 'Audio & Video' started by Ranger2005, Nov 19, 2021.

  1. Dec 5, 2021 at 8:33 AM
    #31
    RusPro21

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    2021 Pro!! Nitto’s Tyger blades, Arc audio!
  2. Dec 5, 2021 at 8:40 AM
    #32
    Ranger2005

    Ranger2005 [OP] New Member

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    Correct I am not. Yes the JBL head unit.

    Gain on doors seems to be set a little high because al vol 1 it's a little loud. For a volume 1 setting. Starting to distort ( but I'm being picky) at vol 35 -38.
     
  3. Dec 5, 2021 at 8:42 AM
    #33
    Ranger2005

    Ranger2005 [OP] New Member

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    I think the AP4 is used like the RF DSR1.
     
  4. Dec 5, 2021 at 8:49 AM
    #34
    RusPro21

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    If you can get a DSR1 and have James program it. He did mine and it sounds awesome. My 2 installers did the whole install and did not have to mess with it. Unless you get that figured out with yours.
     
  5. Dec 5, 2021 at 8:52 AM
    #35
    Ranger2005

    Ranger2005 [OP] New Member

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    Good to know. If we can't reach the goal that will be my next effort. Thanks for the feedback.

    Do you know what ohm setting your subs are running and what RMS power your putting on them?
     
  6. Dec 5, 2021 at 8:55 AM
    #36
    BlueTSS

    BlueTSS New Member

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    I amped up my factory system and added a single 10TW3. I plan to upgrade to 2 eventually.
    I don’t think 500w is enough for 2 of these subs. These take up to 400w RMS each.
     
    Ranger2005[OP] likes this.
  7. Dec 5, 2021 at 8:56 AM
    #37
    RusPro21

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    No problem hope you get it figured out. My 5 channel arc audio is 1100 but I’m not sure what ohms my subs are running at. If I get a chance probably tomorrow I can look. I think my subs boxes were marked 4 ohms. Not 100% sure.
     
  8. Dec 5, 2021 at 9:07 AM
    #38
    Ranger2005

    Ranger2005 [OP] New Member

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    We shall see.

    On a past system I played with the 2ohm / 4ohm setting and one way sounded a lot better but kept overloading the amp. If this situation is related to that it may be the cure and I may be in for a pleasant surprise

    As is it sounds great. I'm just losing quality when cranking it up. And not a full surround sound like the factory system offered.

    But this is why we do these things right! It's fun figuring it out and rewarding when the sweet spot is found
     
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  9. Dec 5, 2021 at 9:08 AM
    #39
    RusPro21

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    Yeah I crank mine up to 40 to 45 and Crystal clear and thumping.
     
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  10. Dec 5, 2021 at 9:09 AM
    #40
    Ranger2005

    Ranger2005 [OP] New Member

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    So doing what you did - did you also amp the dash speakers as well?
     
  11. Dec 5, 2021 at 9:10 AM
    #41
    Ranger2005

    Ranger2005 [OP] New Member

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    Cool, I have good equipment so it's just going to be a matter of fine tuning
     
  12. Dec 5, 2021 at 9:25 AM
    #42
    BlueTSS

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    No, my dash speakers and rear tweeters are powered from the head unit since I have the non-JBL entune system. The dash speakers were a bit overpowering to begin with imo.

    I think to maximize the bass output to what these subs are designed for in your setup:

    1. DSR1 to process/fix the entune signal. Or an aftermarket radio.
    2. Amp with more power for the subwoofers (~800w sub channel).
    3. Ported subwoofer box. Sealed will sound good too, but ported is louder.
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2021
  13. Dec 5, 2021 at 9:57 AM
    #43
    Ranger2005

    Ranger2005 [OP] New Member

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    Good feedback, thanks!
     
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  14. Dec 5, 2021 at 9:57 AM
    #44
    Toyotoholic

    Toyotoholic -4Life-

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    Tuning is huge, but you have to know where to start and how to finish. It's a process that will fail if everything is not set up correctly. Speakers installed with solid mounting hardware and wired properly, baffles are treated with sound deadening, and panels are not blocking sound output. (Subs firing into the back of the seats can neuter the output if there is no airspace). Also x-over points, gains, EQ settings, source from HU and of course the HU itself is the most important piece of hardware. When using the OEM HU you must have the best possible DSP inorder to achieve anything remotely close to an upgrade. Our trucks actually suck pretty bad for an audio environment, there are terrible phase issues between the front and rear speakers, so much that I don't use any rears. I have 3-way Morel Elates up front with the JL stealth box (rear firing woofers) and it sounds incredible. Insanely loud and crispy clean at full volume. (A proper setup should never break up at mid-level volume)
    You have to understand what each setting does or you will be overlapping and over processing which will lead to distortion in a heartbeat, even at low volume.
    Take your time, and have fun!
    And @BlueTSS has stated many good points too!
     
    MichelleRae4x4 likes this.
  15. Dec 5, 2021 at 11:18 AM
    #45
    Ranger2005

    Ranger2005 [OP] New Member

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    That's why I let the pros do it. Car Toys usually has pretty good installers
     
  16. Dec 7, 2021 at 7:53 PM
    #46
    thedonn

    thedonn New Member

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    How are the focal speakers? did you get the sub figured out?
     
  17. Dec 8, 2021 at 6:34 PM
    #47
    Ranger2005

    Ranger2005 [OP] New Member

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    The focal speakers are great!

    Car Toys is ordering the 4ohm JL subs and we will see what happens. I've been tweeking the settings and I am accomplishing better more full sound but there is definitely a roll off happening. I am thinking that without a deep box I will not be able to get the low level rumble that is common in a lot of the Pink Floyd which is a real bummer but we shall see what happens with the new subs.
     
    MichelleRae4x4 likes this.
  18. Dec 8, 2021 at 7:36 PM
    #48
    Danimal86

    Danimal86 Looks clean even when its dirty!

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    The factory head unit will roll off bass the higher the volume. There are a few options to combat that.
     
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  19. Dec 9, 2021 at 3:15 AM
    #49
    RusPro21

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    Hey Dean, I did look at my boxes and my subs were marked 2 ohms but I could always confirm it with my installer if need to.
     
  20. Dec 9, 2021 at 4:18 AM
    #50
    thedonn

    thedonn New Member

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    I hope they figure it out quickly for you. I am a little undecided on my subs - I think i want the JL narrow 12 with 400 rms or so. I would also consider 2 of these or 2 10s if it might be better for space. you mentioned Pink Floyd, i love some of their stuff, also nine inch nails and that music is a great way to really show what a system can or cant do. I want mine to be crisp clear and warm. I would not be surprised if you would benefit from more power to the sub and at some point I think you may be limited by what the head unit can do.
     
  21. Dec 9, 2021 at 4:21 AM
    #51
    1999cutiger

    1999cutiger Top Flow Lifestyle

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    Go with two.

    8D9A25A6-5703-4AFC-A258-FEFD309BDC5E.jpg
     
  22. Dec 9, 2021 at 4:31 AM
    #52
    RusPro21

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    My install JBL headunit at number 40 crystal clear JUDAS PRIEST. Loving my system.
     
    Ranger2005[OP] likes this.
  23. Dec 9, 2021 at 4:41 AM
    #53
    thedonn

    thedonn New Member

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    they have some great stuff. My old Mustang had 6x9s and a 10 inch sub with a huge amp and that thing was incredible. I also loved Number of the beast to show off the system
     
  24. Dec 9, 2021 at 6:28 AM
    #54
    Ranger2005

    Ranger2005 [OP] New Member

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    And disturbed and Duran Duran's Come Undone and Led Zeppelin's no quarter and so many more.

    I do indeed like it as it is but I had this amp and door speakers running in my Honda Ridgeline and it was absolutely more full of a sound. The subs were 10in Alpine ?D4? And they were not shallow mount and in a deeper box.

    Here I'm having problems with getting the full sound because of rolloff and distortion. I've solved some of the distortion by lowering the gain on the doors and backing off the base on the head unit but it just isn't as "full" as I expected it to be. I'll keep working on it.

    The girlfriend thinks it's pretty damn good as it is so maybe I am being too critical...
     
  25. Dec 9, 2021 at 6:32 AM
    #55
    Ranger2005

    Ranger2005 [OP] New Member

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    No need. Based on what I read 2ohms is louder than 4 and more power hungry and 4ohm is better quality but not as loud. For now I will let them make the swap and see what happens. Worst case I will drop more $$ into a more powerful amp for the subs but based on my experience with the Ridgeline it should not be needed .. but ..idk
     
  26. Dec 11, 2021 at 7:40 PM
    #56
    Toyotoholic

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    Impedance has nothing to do with actual quality. It is a parameter of the driver to be matched up as best as possible to the amplifiers output parameters. Ohms law my friend. Change impedance, you change current, they directly affect one another along with voltage. Increase impedance = decrease current and vice versa. The quality of sound and volume are just products the actual components, not the actual impedance. It plays a part in output so that's where system design and components selection is very important. The right matching components and amp will produce both high volume AND quality.
     
    MichelleRae4x4 and 1lowlife like this.
  27. Dec 11, 2021 at 9:27 PM
    #57
    1lowlife

    1lowlife Toxic prick and pavement princess..

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    I'm running the same amp, the Focals you have in the front doors, Focal Performance 100AC in the rears, all the dash speakers disconnected.
    Keep in mind I have an aftermarket Kenwood HU.
    The Entune is sh!t, no matter how much lipstick you put on that pig, it's gonna be lacking.

    That amp is plenty to drive 2 subs in a good box wired at 2 ohms.
    I have one running a JL Audio SB-T-TUNDB3 Stealthbox with 2 10TW3-D4 subs.

    r7df2zr7_zpscoegh5fw_e14e4e071c704d230b554daebfcc38c675bc6089.jpg
    IMG_1616_zpsskszdojb_b0f02fc5fe4699deadab8e9489baf631ad5103ea.jpg

    Long story short;
    My Stealthbox was supposed to be 2 ohms when I bought it from JL Audio.
    They come with 10TW3-D8s now, but back when I bought mine it came with 10TW3-D4s.

    SB-T-TUNDB3/10TW3/BK - Car Audio - Stealthbox® - Toyota - JL Audio

    PDX V9 is 2 ohm stable.
    The sub sounded like sh!te for 4 years: muddy, muffled, sloppy, weak bass.
    All the forums said you don't have enough power to it.
    JL Audio CS said that is plenty of power.

    Bought a JL Audio 1000 watt mono amp, loosely (tested) installed it, it still sounded crappy.
    Returned that amp.

    wgne9fof_zpsokcvqro6_43ee9649277bd0f2729734c44e5f13e8e3889706.jpgdu95rane_zpsuxulocs3_9e08b9c47e964b8d7af176d5ae69bbe0af1a3998.jpg

    FINALLY, after 4 years, I tested the sub box ohms and it measured 9 something, should have been 4ish.
    Was told when I bought it it was 2 ohms.
    Took it apart, it was wired in series that should have made it around 4 ohms..

    (edited)_2lyv879e_eb2e9aa3ffc6af7fef928a81ed3af8636515a001.jpg

    Rewired it to parallel, brought it down to 2 ohms, and it has been awesome ever since.

    Dual Voice Coil (DVC) Wiring Tutorial – JL Audio Help Center - Search Articles (zendesk.com)

    I spent 4 years hating my $1K stealthbox, but the issue turned out to be it was wired wrong from the factory..
    My sub gains are set very low, it takes very little to pump that sub box.
    Front and rear gains are set around 11:00.

    That may not be your issue, but that was my experience.

    Good luck...
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2021
  28. Dec 12, 2021 at 5:24 AM
    #58
    2010bigdog

    2010bigdog New Member

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    what FOCALS do you have the UTOPIA's ?
     
  29. Dec 12, 2021 at 6:20 AM
    #59
    Toyotoholic

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    As a rule of thumb when installing any system, I always put a meter on the speaker wires before I connect them to the amp. Then take a small AA battery and "pop em" to confirm polarity too. This way you know exactly what your amp is up against. Though it took a while for you to find the problem, nice job pushing through and getting the results your system was capable of!
     
  30. Dec 12, 2021 at 6:23 AM
    #60
    nobodyintexas

    nobodyintexas What?

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    Whatever this forum told me to do
    Old school talent

    I love it

    I was in the early 90’s

    Orion/fosgate/audio control/ image dynamics

    I tip my to the folks that still participate in this fine art

    I will do
    My truck next year
     

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