PEX vs copper

Whatever your choice, make sure you can get what you need to finish before you start. Unfortunately, labor and material will continue to be high demand and short supply.

 

Oh, yes. The sharkbite fittings are quite nice, but a little more expensive.

 

Wrong thread needs to be in tundra spotted thread lol.

 

We must be pretending because I would be amazed if copper and pex come in at the same price !

I've done a bit of building in the NE and would go with copper... besides it's a good investment and you could tear it out and sell it one day to make a mortgage payment down the line if prices keep going the way they are !

 

If pex freezes it can expand to 7 times its original size before bursting. Pex is the way to go. Its not permitted in alot of large cities (NYC) around here. Apparently the rats can smell the water in it and its an easy chew for a city rat.

 

Insulated and installed properly copper will never freeze either.
You will know that first winter if someone goofed up... after that, you're good to go for a lifetime.

Just noticed OP isn't concerned with freezing temps.... lucky guy.

 

I'm guessing they meant these type, that require a crimping tool.

 

Live in Massachusetts town only uses cooper put in heating system mass save! From street about 200 ft need new turn off valve 1926 so cost more to dig up driveway! But all copper inside and out! Lucky mass save let’s you pay $200 a month for 8 years! Yes needs to be installed correctly more $ but not moving anytime soon!

 

Nope, SharkBite fittings require no crimping, you just push them on. (I never worked with what you illustrated. I don't like the O-ring)
SB's are great for some repairs but I wouldn't use them for a new install over sweating joints...

https://www.sharkbite.com/us/en/brass-push-to-connect

 

I should've quoted @bwh in that post too. Those ones I shared are typically called press fittings. Used with a tool like this.

 

Cooper doesn't freeze when installed right.

 

I use both actually Copper is done with press fittings and Pex-A is done with an expander tool. Don't have an issue with either one of them. Haven't had any problems with them leaking and they are used in a harsh enviroment of grey water recycling.

 

I agree I don't trust a sharkbite fitting over a long period.

 

Great opportunity to learn something new.

Sharkbites are not press fittings. Sharkbites are push fittings. They are for temporary repairs and/or outside the wall connections. People have buried them behind finished walls before and been fine for years, but people have also been burned by them leaking. I would not risk it in a finished job, but you can make your choices on your house.

Press fittings are what were linked above in the image. They use a crimping tool and are as good as sweat connections. Sweat has its place in the industry, especially in large diameter connections, but press fittings are considerable faster to do at scale. There is a moderate cost to start (~$1k for a good crimper like Milwaukee, but Rigid is a great #2 for considerably less), but if doing an entire house it is well worth it.

I've seen too many PEX expansion and crimp fittings fail to put my weight behind it.

 

The other reason I like the copper press fittings, is you don't need to turn off the water on the copper pipe if you have sprung a leak. Cut the pipe, deburr it and place a copper press fitting and press it. If you have to braze it, no water in in that pipe. Becomes an issue for us at least because of where our shut off valves are located. I've used it in a lot of my residential properties as well. Yes the fitting are more money, probably more then the fittings for Pex-A. But still love it either way.

 

Pro press/ Vega

 

Great info! Thanks!

 

Whoa, no way sir! That's expensive. A copper joint costs less than a dollar, especially in bulk. Those sharkbite are $6 and up each for the 1/2" variety. Last house I repiped took about 11 90s and several couplers per bathroom and about the same for the kitchen. Using press fits would get expensive fast, plus I don't like that they swivel.

Edit- I've never seen these crimp copper connections. Thats interesting and would be nice for those cases where you can turn off the water but can't properly drain it. Learned something new.

 

You not running Copper as fast as PEX...period, more durable?...not!

 

Yeah.... that swivel action is a little disconcerting ! That and the fact that they are removable....

 

I guess when I see PEX it brings up nightmares of polybutylene pipe. If any of you have found that in a house you know what I mean. It's every bit as good as orangeburg sewer pipe. PEX sounds like an amazing solution, I just never used it and will probably stay that way.

The pipe of choice for me is good old galvy. Now get off my lawn!

 

It takes 3s per crimp with pro-press.
It takes ~10s per expansion with PEX.

That is 2-3x faster with pro-press.

You don't seem to understand what durability means either, so I'm not shocked that your perception of time is wildly inaccurate. Metal is substantially more durable than polyethelene, especially the levels used in PEX. Now if you want to argue that one handles temperature fluctuations better, or certain water conditions, and is easier to get into small spaces or weird turns, then PEX is a major player. But in terms of the durability of plastic vs metal, there's only one winner.

 

Copper will last 20+- years longer than PEX, if that's the durability you referring to

 

So what do the o-rings in these fittings do? I work in a hospital and our maintenance dept uses these everywhere. Some are quite large in diameter. If that o-ring is actually doing anything, what is going to happen to it in 15-20 years?

I just installed a new water heater for my daughter and rerouted and sweated all copper. She had ask a neighbor who is a plumber about doing it but after finding out the cost, she ask me.
The plumber told her to tell me to use Sharkbites to do the job. I told her to tell him that I am going old school and soldering. I know nothing about Sharkbites so went with the tried and true.

 

The o ring is what seals, supposedly propress is nothing new in Europe and across the pond. I’d use propress over a shark bite any day.
@Darkness has seen my on call fun, but I can’t find any pics of the high grade copper and high grade repairs we do……

I’m also a braiser……. I used to pipe for low temp Reefer systems, I’ve silver soldered an entire service from the street to the house and didn’t blink an eye

 

thats a different kind of pipe entirely

 

The O rings are what "seals" the water or gas - the crimp just locks it all in place. And yes, they do have propress for gas, water, and even galvanized. Pretty cool stuff.

In 15-20 years, it will be fine. Vega (one of the main companies) has been out in Europe for 20+ years. I often think of putting your money where your mouth is, and Vega offers a 50 year warranty on their fittings. Upnoar is 25 years if memory serves. So obviously Vega is willing to warrant their stuff for half your life, which says alot about their confidence in the product.

 

How long did it take you? I just installed a hot water heater,
from unloading to turning it on was literally 15 minutes. Screw on hot and cold, sharkbite other end to existing lines. Connect gas line. Re-install vent duct, turn on. EASY.


The OP asked about new construction, not remodels or repairs. My vote is still unequivocally PEX over copper but if there are NO worries about install cost, time and no worries of acidic hard water then copper will last longer. That’s a lot of IFs. Good ole Bob Villa sums it up best:

https://www.bobvila.com/articles/pex-vs-copper/

 

Yea but copper is more durable-LOL
I concur with what you said "unequivocally PEX over copper"...its a no brainier