2022 Tundra

1000% correct, I've been able to drive 3.5 EB and 5.7 hemi quite a bit, and even the 6.2 GM and the 6.2 gets the best fuel mileage when I drive. Sure if I baby the 3.5 it can get the best, but I'm not driving 80 km/h out on the highway 100% of the time.

It's just like dieselgate - the manufacturers know how the EPA does their testing and some tune their cars to be absolutely ideal under those conditions. But those conditions match very few people in how they drive day to day.

 

Agreed. I think Toyota realizes how many of their customers are going to swap the bumper right away. So why does Toyota manufacture it like that? Likely because toyota is chasing mpg numbers and the aerodynamics of the current design is a big part of that. Like Mike Sweers says in his interviews. The best way to increase aerodynamic efficiency/mpgs = Slam the truck to the ground (kinda like the nascar tundra version). But the compromise is the approach angle. So we will see a hit to the mpgs when we throw the “underbite” bumper in the trash while leaving the dealership parking lot. My guess, that hit to the mpgs will be negligible and well worth the improved approach angle (depending on how you use the truck of course - if you’re on pavement most of the time and towing down the highway, that air dam / low front end might be pretty awesome).

 

It’s hard for me to complain about a company designing a bumper with better mpg and safety in mind. None of that bothers me as it’s all replaceable. Want it higher? Lift your truck. Want a better approach angle? Get a metal bumper. Want a good highway rig and tow rig then get a trd sport.

 

I highly doubt it will require removal of the air dam.

 

plus.. they need to be red for instant hp/tq boost!

but honestly, if this ends up being the solution, even Honda ridgelines will laugh.

no offence ridgline owners.. okay maybe a some offence

 

Semi's even have the removable tow pins, if it works for them then it's gotta work for the Tundra if they designed it that way. Maybe the Tundra would start a trend if they indeed did that

 

I mentioned it several pages back.
The issue for me is that my current truck has better skid plate protection. While I understand why Toyota did what they did to most trims of Tundras (more seamless plastic shapes to smooth airflow out for better MPGs) I am surprised they did it to the TRD Pro. I get the argument for huge plastic fascia, motorized air dam, lack of tow hooks, strange rear bumper, etc for the majority of truck buyers will be happier getting better MPGs every time they fill up than the rare time they need a bumper side step or tow hooks....but the TRD Pro is a different mission. I have heard several YT'ers mention Toyota has geared the new Pro as more of a higher speed desert runner, however I think most people will want to use it as an all-around capable off-road rig for various environments. The hidden TRD Pro skid plate up under a huge plastic schoz with no tow hooks will be something the aftermarket will tackle pronto...mark my word. People will be hacking up the front end (and losing MPGs to do it!) to regain approach angle and tow hooks.

After realizing the mission for the TRD Pro is not what I would use it for, I think I can settle on a normal Tundra with a 4x4 upgrade, the TRD Pro is too expensive and will require too much hacking for what most people will do to get their ideal Pro.

My current truck has appropriate skid plate, 1/4" thick (with an oil change door!) and tow hooks in a good location. Those talking about tow hooks down by the Pro sway bar make me cringe, likely if you need a tug, it's gonna suck to get to tow hooks under the nose of the truck.

 

Very true. But semi trucks are pretty much exclusively highway towing machines with low bumpers for the best possible aerodynamics they can get (the front of some rigs is around 4” off the ground). So they NEED those style of tow hooks, it’s not designed that way for any other reason.

A TRD pro tundra on the other hand (marketed as an off road truck) meant for off roading, should probably have “off roading” style tow hooks

Not trying to be argumentative, just trying to see Toyota’s thought process.

I take my vehicles off road, and I understand I might be in the minority. I’m not expecting Toyota to make a “hell’s revenge” capable truck right off the factory line. But it seems the absence of standard tow hooks is a bit of a miss.

Anyway, I’m excited to see what options they might have. But I’m thinking it will be a case of: good MPGs off the line, and aftermarket to the rescue in the bumper/approach angle/tow hook areas.

 

Think they've made it pretty obvious who they're targeting with it - suburban families who want a big vehicle for daily driving that could in theory go off road or tow a camper trailer. Not that most won't actually do that stuff ever, but they like the thought of being able to. So MPG and crash test ratings are the biggest targets.

 

That’s what most of the current Tundras on the road are doing right now.

 

Absolutely. And like @JuicyJ said, the way the trims are shaping up, it would be a better idea to option out an SR5 or Limited to make it into what the Pro should’ve been.

probably a lot cheaper too!

 

Maybe they think they'll sell enough Pros that it would affect their CAFE calculations?

 

Yeah, that's what I was thinking too.

It'll be interesting to see what people get for MPGs on modified TRD Pros, with it being hybrid and all.

Some big tires, more lift, different bumpers should affect the MPGs quite a bit, but I bet it's still "good" MPGs when all is considered. I also think that the truck will still have good power even with bigger tires, the hybrid should help with that.

 

Toyota kept saying they were going to blow the doors off the competition pre press release. Come to find out now, they just kept up with the big 3. Granted toyota typically underates or other brands over rate their models. But legally those numbers are important. So much hype and secrecy and such a let down.

Ive had my 08 and been doing the job quite well for pulling my 7800 lbs toyhauler. But I was really hoping for something along the lines of the Titan XD number, a 5/8 ton truck. Again, toyota and all their hype really pissed me off.

 

When I first put LT tires on my 08 and towed 9000#, I had it at 70 psi in it. The combination of high psi and and brand new tires caused so much sway in the rear end, scared the crap out of me on the trip. Really caused me to scratch my head. I lowered the psi to 55 and broke in the tires and it now tows straight ike an arrow.

 

Thanks for replying, I figured the best way to reply is to bold your counter-arguments. I'm tired of these weak justifications for a 400W inverter. It's ridiculous.

All this "I'm so tough I don't need nothing but a tent and a coffee pot" is ridiculous. That two-stroke engine powered blender is the most laughable thing I've ever seen.

 

It’s called glamping!!

 

I love these 'camping supplies' sob stories. If it don't fit on your back or in your canoe it ain't camping. Anything more than that is trailering. He is right that the trailering crowd is more of Toyota's target than the camping crowd so maybe it should have all the fancy extras. But as someone who uses generators at work - give me the generator and not on-board power. Sure does suck when someone needs to drive to the shitter across the site or into town for supplies and takes your power away.

Want more heat in your tent - buy a better sleeping bag. Get a good sleeping bag and you'll be nice and warm as the snow covers you while you sleep.

 

I like having the ability of 1500w in my truck, if only for "more machine" (I love machines). I would rarely use it, TBH.

I feel like the Ford 2.4kW and 7.2kW options are super nice, but present a conundrum for me.

There's 3 ways the Ford system could be super valuable:

1. Building your own home/cabin and occasionally needing generator power. I, myself, love cutting wood in the back of my truck, it's a great work space, if I had 2.4/7.2kW available in this circumstance, I'd be stoked. Even 1.5kW would be awesome. 1.5kW could run nearly any 1 device most of us would use.

2. Emergency power related to natural event. However, in my case, my power panel on my house would require the truck be parked on my lawn, and most of my stuff is NG powered and will work without AC power. Long outages would be weird with your truck tethered to your house, but still could be very useful.

3. Trailer camping. Here's my biggest conundrum: I like travel trailers because you can disconnect from the trailer and drive around with an unladen vehicle. Setup your RV at a campsite, disconnect from the truck, and drive around to nearby activities/sights. If someone stays behind, or there's a need for all day power, well you better have a generator or healthy solar system anyways. I mean, it's cool the truck can power an RV, but most places I'd take an RV to, I'd be looking for hookups anyways, so it's an iffy thing for me.

My main issue with the Toyota 400w system is that it requires the truck to be running at all times, and that's the fail on Toyota's part. They should have an auto-start setup where the system will only call for running engine when necessary, like Ford does. I sure the hell don't want my engine running just so a wimpy 400w outlet can be powered.

 

Would it be possible to buy the inverter from the sienna and retrofit the tundra? Would it be a fairly simple swap?

asking for a friend.

edit: honest question. I’ve never worked on a hybrid. There’s a reason everything is marked with orange (for guys like me to steer clear).

 

The *smartest* way to fit a high-wattage inverter (IMO, anything over 400w) is to fit the inverter under the hood, near the battery.

high-wattage inverters draw tons of current at 12VDC, simply consider that 120vac current equates to roughly 10x more current at 12vdc, so 15a @ 120v is 1800 watts, back-maffs that and it is 150a (minimum) at 12vdc, requiring HUGE power cables. If you keep the inverter near the battery, you can run much thinner power cables out of the inverter at 120v to an outlet 16 feet away. Basically, instead of needing welding cables to install an inverter in the bed or cab, you can run 14awg or 12awg wires to an outlet(s).

However, I can't find any inverters that can survive under-hood environment.

I bet the Sienna inverter resides in the engine compartment, meaning it is environment-appropriate.

Maybe someone who has access to a Toyota spare parts catalog can find out? The Sienna inverter may need CAN-bus comms to operate, though. Not sure.

 

Yes I think you are right. The hybrid inverter is usually in the engine compartment. In the pics of the new 2022 I believe this is the inverter:


so would it be technically possible to swap this one out for the sienna’s inverter for the guys who want 1500w of power?
I’m sure it’s more difficult than a direct swap, but honestly I’ve never worked on a hybrid / have no idea.

Edit: I mean, from the YT reviewers it sounds like it is the exact same size nimh battery from the sienna. So maybe it’s something that can be upgraded for those that want it?

 

Problem would be any CANbus and/or BCM coding that may be required, and Toyota won't make that easy.
Also, futzing with the Hybrid power lines is an automatic warranty cancellation, and seeing as how long the Hybrid warranty is, I wouldn't want to risk it (I'm all about voiding 3/36k warranties!)

BTW, thanks for the Sienna references, never saw how it's done before

 

I’m not even in the market for one of these. Quite happy with my 2010! But hearing the complaints about the 400w inverter had me curious. Those guys make good arguments as the (f150) competition has much higher capability in that dept, yet Toyota already has the 1500w inverters in stock for the siennas which have hybrid battery’s that are apparently very close to the tundra. They must have a reason why they didn’t put them in the tundra. Cost/ demographics / or other technical reasons (I’m sure it falls into this latter area), I’m honestly just curious as to why, that’s all.

 

Maybe not as cheap or simple as just buying a Honda inverter generator that you can have in the truck when you want or conveniently take places your truck can’t get...?

I totally get the sleek factor of a built in APU but even the quasi convenience of running off the truck’s fuel tank means it likely has yucky non stabilized ethanol gas sitting in it for long periods when you’re not using the gene. There’s also accessibility for service if you’re doing them yourself or paying an hourly rate. I tried looking for info on the F-150 version but came up dry, gotta be a thing though?

Sorry could be just my resistance to change acting up again and didn’t mean to discourage a cool idea if it is workable. I had actually wondered about some form of hybrid battery connection to tap into that is gas engine rechargeable. If only I were an electronics engineer lol.

 

I bet almost any commercial marine inverter would be fine under the hood I like Newmar which are used in some Army landing craft and Xantrex are pretty robust too.
There are also rotary generator inverters like the cable and utility companies use where truck power turns the motor which makes AC power.Redline are a common model there and again they are robust for commercial use for sure.

 

APU! Someone has worked in the aviation industry

 

The problem with the 5/8 truck is the same thing Nissan ran into. It cost as much or only a couple thousand less than a full 3/4 ton. We all have to realize that Toyota was trying to please the 90%. The people on this forum make up the 10% that want more. If Toyota made a truck that met all of our wants, we would be looking at a $100,000 truck. They also don't have the volume to offer all of those options to the 10% that actually want them. They are much better off producing a truck that meets 90% of our needs and then the other 10% can mod them like they want. I don't think Toyota was the one saying they were going to blow the door off anyone, that was a dealer that used the term world beater. The 07 tundra was really the only Toyota I'm aware of that was a world beater, that's just not their motto. We are now much closer to the limits right now so no one will be a world beater anymore.

 

Every chevy goes off road eventually.... like off -road into the shoulder to wait for the tow truck

 

Probably didn't do it due to all of the production issues these days. It is super odd that Sienna gets 1.5kW and Tundra gets rinky-dink watts