19-20 Discussion on Missing Ambient Cooler

On my 2010, the gauge moved around 240 and the light came on around 250.

 

I've never met an engineer that didnt go out of his way to tell me he was an engineer. They were usually pretty smart too... right up until you handed them tools.

 

It is subtle, but the buttons on my old one were a little larger and the rectangular imprint around the top four buttons were different. Here is the new one. I couldn't find a pic of my old one.

 

Now I have to look at mine lol. I wouldnt have noticed it. Let me know if you try the tire pressure at some point.

 

yep, those memes exist for a reason.

 

Ah, that sentiment plays well on the internet where no one gets any respect, but it's stereotypical baloney in many cases. I had already lost my Craftsman 1/2" socket at least once by time I graduated high school. In the dissipation of my youth, I specialized in swapping out Ford three-speed manual transmissions as necessary. I think it took five to get me through high school.

 

I wasn't going to be the first to speak up about this because frankly, I have known quite a few engineers that fit this stereotype. And some engineers don't know when to shut up - even when they are right. Then there are some who have no clue about statistics, as in when a design is "good enough."

And worst of all are the engineers who will argue data all day long when the real world observations just don't match that data.

Somebody PLEASE tell me if I start doing these things!

 

I assume the Toyota Engineers discovered the cooler was minimally effective for a sliver of the buyers as they were developing the new Tundra for a market that apparently will leave towing Tundras the option to go buy a truck designed for towing. It's not a big market for Toyota. Transmission cooler threads have replaced the poor-gas-mileage threads.2022 Tundra towing will be a thing of the past. Next month it will be something else.

I did order a thermostat from @Roman this morning for future use.

 

Kubotas hydros are always obnoxiously loud

 

Alright, alright.
Look, my posts are not for you or the guy claiming to be smarter than the Toyota engineer, and there are several of those brilliant weekend warriors who post nonsense.
My posts are for the guests and unknowledgable people who read this crap and think "gosh, should I be worried Toyota took away the trans cooler?" They read but rarely post. My posts are for those guys because it's easy to sound smart and be absolutely wrong on the internet.
So, my posts don't add any value to you. Sorry, but you sound like the typical guy who only listens to opinions that match their own.
As far as not knowing my way around a wrench, woodworking is my hobby. I was a bodyman (frame repair) from 16yo to 23yo when I had saved enough to go to college. Four and a half years later I was designing stuff for a living. That was 34 years ago so I have a bit of experience.
Again, the ignore button is there for you to push when people like me post and the concepts and words do not match your thoughts.
To close, I have repeatedly asked for some documentation or cited article on specifically why Toyota did away with the cooler. I have gotten nothing except "I heard..." or "I read..." and gotten crickets on a link to an article or some message from Toyota.
Good luck and FWIW, my truck does fine pulling 7K. That's my one little data point lol.

 

LOL, so @Dragracer_Art was correct. You just tooted your horn a bit and confirmed engineer. Rest of us are dummys

The other engineer did same thing haha

 

So let me get this straight... you guys get to talk shit (train driver, no wrenching talent, etc) and yet when I defend with fact, I am bragging and calling you dummies? That's fair. I will kindly bow out of this website. Good luck.

 

Ha, snowflake lol. Two maybe three posts got you butt hurt for being arrogant and condescending?

 

He will be fine, says he’s leaving if things don’t go his way, but doesn’t.

 

My previous post was first thing in the morning still half asleep. Was just trying to add some humor. I agree with you that it seems to be a sky is falling type of issue and that we haven’t heard of any failing transmissions. Just a few that got the overheat light. But if it was me I’d add a cooler for piece of mind. Maybe some have failed and they didn’t post here or maybe they haven’t reached that many miles yet.

This and the now locked thread had some good info in it. But all we really know for sure is the 19/20s are running hotter than 07-18s. Is it too hot? Did Toyota really test higher temps? I don’t think we will ever know.

 

I might have missed it somewhere in all the foofaraw, but I don't think anyone here has mentioned querying the maker of the WS transmission fluid concerning the longevity of their product at the high temps discussed here. That's the real reason for keeping the temps down. It doesn't matter if its an Aisin transmission or a Chrysler 300. Temperatures in the 300°+ range would never hurt the transmission itself, except indirectly by burning the fluid and destroying the properties necessary to properly lubricate and work the hydraulics of the machine.

 

If this is still the same thread, the OP was trying to get the info from ExxonMobil who (rightfully so) indicated that it's proprietary.

 

I seem to remember a stalwart soul bombarding the manufacturer of WS with questions aplenty in the search for the ever elusive Rock Solid evidence.

 

Thanks, Olav. I was apparently blinded by the briliance of the engineer.

 

That was in the now locked thread.

There was a now removed video that stated Toyota’s response was it can handle up to 280. Overheat light comes on at 302.

What temp do seals break down? I’m not a mechanic so I don’t know. But can seals in a transmission handle 300+?

 

I’m trying to get technical information from Mobil on atf 3324 which looks to be either identical or the same as WS fluid. It’s taking forever...

I also have worked extensively with a Mobil competitor through my day job and found out that group 3 oils (base oils for WS fluid) have been tested well past 300F for oxidation stability. They have high confidence that a group 3 could sustain 300F. With additives it could go higher. Their comfort limit was 320F.

group 4 oils can sustain up to 370-390F for oxidation stability.

i am trying to see if Ws has any sort of blend with group 4.

 

10 years from now there will be posts saying 500 is too high and we need to keep it under 350. And we will all have flying cars.

 

You guys are funny, "misleading".

There is nothing misleading about what they wrote, zero - IMHO.

There is a transmission cooler, its called the puck.
The puck acts as a heat exchange for both heating and cooling.
The cooling circuit diagrams show this.

Once a delta is reached, the trans oil flowing through the puck will be warmer than that of the coolant temp.
At this point, the puck will be completing a heat exchange in the form of heat removal.

Nothing misleading here.

 

Well, I'm not a mechanic either, but the link below will give you an idea. Once you get beyond about 300-350 degrees, or need extreme chemical resistance, you will need silicone or fluorocarbon compounds.

No doubt, you'd never pry Toyota's seal material from their proprietary knowledge cache, but their seal material is likely Viton which usually the slightly more expensive, go-to seal material. It's petroleum resistant and heat resistant to maximum of 400 degrees.

Edit: Note the disclaimer at the top of the page: "This chart depicts the maximum temperature range for each elastomer. The temperature range for a specific compound may not reach these maximum limits. High temperatures may be considered if exposure is short term or intermittent."

https://www.sealmaster.com/engineering/temperature-range-charts/

 

Not saying I agree or disagree, but if I said the truck came with a USB port when I was referring to the port for the radio that isn’t strong enough to charge a phone, would that be misleading when everyone assumes they can charge their phone? Yes it has a “cooler”, just not what most would call a cooler.

 

So we should start torching down for the lack of charging ability, because my phone loses a charge when plugged in...



So Toyota should be held responsible for "misleading" information when in fact they are not misleading in any sense?

From a technical standpoint, it has a cooler.
The fact that not everyone has the same definition of what a cooler is, is not Toyotas fault.

 

Personally... I dont understand the pissing match and purse swinging going on over this.

If someone is concerned about the transmission temps... put a cooler on it.

If someone is not concerned about the temps or is concerned about warranty issues... then DONT put a cooler on it.

It doesn't mean a bit of difference who is right or wrong here... either put the fu**ing cooler on or don't... and get on with life instead of bickering about it like a bunch of cranky old ladies with soggy diapers.

 

Just changed mine so they aren't sog………………………………………………………………………………………. nevermind.