Cheaper to keep her?

Hello all. I intro'd myself in the New Member thread, but thought I'd get in front of you first gen enthusiasts.

I am now the proud owner of my son's 2003 access cab limited 4x4. Why do I now own it you ask? Well the timing belt decided it had had enough and took the rest of the motor with it. I helped him get a new truck and took this one in exchange. This will be my second first gen, and third tundra (2002 and 2013 previously, to go along with a couple of land cruisers (84 and 89 I used to be around on ih8mud) and a couple 4runners over the years).

I'm trying to decide what to do with this one. It had over 300k miles on it, so needed some stuff even before the engine died (mostly it needed some brake work, a new steering rack and a front suspension refresh). I put it up on CL just to see what the interest was, and it seems like the market thinks it's worth maybe $2k. Fair enough I suppose.

I'd be interested some advice about what it really costs to replace the engine. While I am fully capable of mid level wrenching, I don't think I have the skills for a swap, let alone the space or tools. I really like this truck, but I'm trying to decide if the economics make sense.

Anyway, glad to be here.

 

Yeah, that's a bear. Interference engine. Timing belt is pretty crucial.

How's the frame, as far as rust goes?

 

There’s the green one in SoCal with 100k miles for $10k with a “new engine.”

Here’s a remanned 2UZ for $4k. Delivery and installation extra.

In short, ¯\__(ツ)__/¯

 

$2k with camper shell? Take it off and sell separately for more in your pocket

 

It's always cheaper to keep a vehicle, if you can do the work yourself. If you can't do the work yourself, its always cheaper to buy the tools, and learn the skills, than to pay someone else to do it.

It's simply a matter of how committed you are.

Especially these days, when even an old but running 4WD truck is running $10k minimum.

There is no comparison between a used $10k truck, and a truck that you put $10k in parts into.

 

Are you absolutely sure the engine is toast? This came up recently on the 1st Gen Facebook page and like 5 guys said their timing belt broke but the engine was fine.

@shifty` won't like this but that's what people said. Apparently the VVTI 4.7's are more likely to grenade the engine than the 00-04's.

 

This right here. Check if the engine's actually garbage.

 

Usually not, Oh wait your talking trucks, not women...

 

I'm no expert, but I think the new window in the crankcase where all the oil came out is a pretty good indication that it's done.
The more I look around, it looks like I can get an engine with under 150k for about a grand. Paying for the swap looks like $3k? That's the part that scares me off trying to do it myself. If the pro is charging for 30 hours, it might take me 6 months.

By the way, I was asked about frame rust. This one is surprisingly essentially rust free, which makes me want to keep it.

 

I must have missed something when reading previous posts. If there's a whole in the crankcase, don't bother with fixing the timing belt. I don't think you're giving yourself enough credit for an engine swap. I know a guy who, literally, never worked on a vehicle do an engine swap in his minivan. If he can do it, you can too.

 

Wow, that is a really nice frame. I would definitely do it with a frame like that.

I would just do the math, I don't know what line of work your in....but just figure out how many hours of your work is $3k......and decided if its worth your dollars, or worth your weekends. For me, I get paid crap, so I always do the work myself, in a different job, I'd pay someone.

But just think of what a used truck in any kind of decent condition would cost in comparison....I mean, put $10k in new parts into your truck, and you almost have a new truck....buy a used truck for $10k, and you can easily need to put $10K again into fixing it up.

 

HA! Proved you wrong.

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Maybe the Facebook people were V6. Or they just got REALLY DAMN LUCKY. It happens. People win the lottery every damn day. I'm lucky to be alive today.

I did some hunting here for S&G. Cheapest I can get out the door letting someone else do the work is around $2,800 engine included, for a "guaranteed under-200k mile engine" (their words, not mine) and they're right next to a pull-a-part JY. But the average seems to be around $4k, which is about 1/3 engine, 2/3 labor.

It can't hurt to talk to a couple of reputable Toyota-specific shops and see what the cost is. I wouldn't bother with the stealership, probably would ask north of $8k. Granted, I may be spoiled, we have quite a few Toyo-specific shops who are very familiar with the 2UZ around ATL, so I'd have some choices. Not everyone does.

 

I don't get it either. For an interference engine it should be cut and dry. I wonder if it has to do with the RPM the engine is at. I mentioned this before but we've had 1-2 members report having theirs break and not have damage. That was years ago.

My friend had his timing belt break on his Xterra and the engine was fine. When I looked it up the info I found said it was an interference engine too.

 

I was just talking to my son who was driving it when it died and I think he may have thrown out a winning lottery ticket. Apparently he was off road going really slow when he went through a big puddle and the truck stalled. When he tried to restart it, it first made a noise like the starter was slipping on the flywheel, then sputtered a bit, followed by a loud "clunk" . Sounds like if he hadn't tried to keep cranking it over, it "might" have been salvageable. Hard to say I guess. But here we are anyway.

So, I think you guys have given me what I came for.... an excuse to start a project! The more I think about it, I think maybe this is my chance to learn how to r/r a tundra engine. I'm sure there are youtube videos (if anybody knows a good one let me know), and probably a thread on here and hopefully you guys will chime in with answers to questions I have. This should be fun. Maybe I'll start a new thread of "Newbie gets in over his head" lol

 

Through a puddle?!

Uh, more like he hydrolocked it? That sounds like the bigger culprit after hearing the damage and what led up to it.

Anyway, do it. Seriously. At worst, you may need a hoist, they're cheap enough at Harbor Freight.

 

Yep. That actually makes more sense than the belt breaking. He sucked in water.

 

Was skeptical when I heard 'window'. Not saying a tossed timing belt couldn't create a hole, but the pressure from uncompressable liquid in cylinders definitely will.

 

If no one has said it yet, I believe you need an engine from an 00 - 04 truck, preferably 03 - 04. 05 - 06 is off the table because the VVTI engine uses a different ECU. Someone more knowledgeable may chime in.

 

Do it!!!!

 

FWIW, I did a swap in my subie and just did a lot of engine work to my LB7 Duramax. I was hesitant at first also, and had to collect the tools and parts as I went, but I would suggest that if you want a tundra from this generation you do the swap. You will learn loads about the truck and as someone said earlier, a truck that you put money and labor into is not comparable to a truck you went out and bought. Just a suggestion from someone that has done similar projects, fix it while it's out.

 

I want to hear more detail how a guy with decades of experience with Toyota's had a timing belt failure. How many miles and years on the belt? Was it a $99 eBay kit that failed?

 

Consider it a great opportunity to replace your motor mounts.

I would find someone willing to do it and hire it out. Then assist them and learn. Win win and fun times too.

 

@remington351 - Well, (insert deep sigh here) this was my son's truck. He bought it about 12 months ago and the PO "claimed" that the timing belt had been done around 220k. No idea about either the truth of that statement or what was used in the replacement (if it was actually done. there was no sticker anywhere and I wasn't actually involved in the deal) Truck had 295k on it then. We talked about needing to get it done pretty soon, but he is young and short on cash, so he gambled. And here we are....

 

Hydrolock, timing belt, or combination of both this seems like a clear case of youthful exuberance at work...

 

And to remove the original exhaust manifold while the replacement engine is out and install aftermarket headers.

 

$3-4k into a “free” truck ain’t bad at all. I’d be all over something like that, just take your time looking for the right motor and have work done when installed, and you can be golden for another 300k

 

So in the next month or so I think I will be ready to get started on this project. Figured I share my budget and what it ends up actually costing me. So far, I'm at about $6400 for what I think I need (this includes paying someone to r/r the engine. I might still this myself, but I'm kinda limited on space in my driveway). I'm sure there will be more. Here is the budget as it stands.


With the engine, I plan to get one from a local junkyard. They seem to be around with less than 200k miles for around a grand. As it will be a mystery, and I try to learn from mistakes, I plan to do the timing belt and water pump while it is out of the truck for ease of access. There were a couple of suggestions for other things to do "while I'm in there" above. Besides new headers (unlikely due to being in CA) anything else I should do?

 

I have multiple coworkers, much older, that told me it’s cheaper to keep her.

Now they are 40 years into their career, are still married, haven’t seen their wife in 20+ years and have grown adult kids with their girlfriend.

When I found out she wasn’t going to the gym she was going to Jim’s, it was time to file.