Factor55 - Kinetic Recovery vs Winching

I just installed a WARN EVO-12S on the Tundra and am looking at the Facto55 recovery kits. I'm zeroing in on the Sawtooth Large Kit, and an extra SoftLink and Pulley for multi-point winching.

I'm looking at the Sawtooth specifically because it does not include gear for Kinetic recovery. I personally don't like the idea of using snatch force to recover, but before I buy a kit without kinetic recovery straps; I'd like to get some feedback.

Anyone have experience with Kinetic Recovery that can share why I should have both Kinetic and Winching recovery straps?

 

I have all winching gear and no kinetic gear, my truck has always had enough power and weight to either winch someone out or just flat tow them out; my buddies with lighter jeeps have kinetic ropes and they’ve helped them but I’m not a huge fan of them because they can be aggressive on your drive train, if you can just tow someone out I feel like that’s a better scenario

but that’s not saying I might not get a kinetic rope in the future, but I’ll probably always opt for a tow strap or to pull line

 

Also want to add, we wheel in mainly mud and small rocks, pretty much never any sand; I’ve got aggressive mud tires so traction normally isn’t an issue, but I could see the real benefit of a kinetic rope in a sandy environment

 

or 10-12 psi in the tires so you dont need a kinetic rope for sand .

 

Will you be around ice or sand?

I have a winch and gear for both static and dynamic recovery. My preference is always static but you may encounter a situation where getting a running start is beneficial if you can’t keep the recovery vehicle stationary. Obviously that’s where a kinetic rope comes into play…

 

Occasionally will be around sand and snow/ice. It doesn't snow much in the Carolinas, but we do have drivable beaches.

 

We’ve been on drivable beaches in Louisiana, even with mud tires I didn’t have issues on the beach, I’d say just use static recovery gear until you find you need kinetic

 

We use Kinetic all the time, but each recovery method has its use and purpose. As a side note I find traction boards to be the least helpful in most of the situations I've been a part of, though they are on so many rigs. They are big and bulky vs a Bubba rope or static line. If you’ve got the room kinetic ropes are really useful as they can help when you have a vehicle stuck down in something and you need a little pop up to get them out; btw a safe firm tug not a running start to rip off a bumper. They’ve got more grace than a static line pull on your equipment as well.

In snow you need momentum (especially in snow 30” deep) and if your winch can’t reach a tree and you use another vehicle as an anchor sometimes it will dig that car in as well. We actually did use traction boards as ramps to get the Gladiator out of the ruts it made from the pulling the Bronco. We still had another 5 trucks behind these and were forced to turn around given the time of day.

Sand can behave similarly depending upon its moisture content.

This was just 4 days ago-


Flipped Jeep Recovery in Death Valley



This was just cuz

 

With our groups 95% of recovery is kinetic. Usually just need to give a guy a tug or maybe a bigger tug.
Common sense is important, I've seen all the videos of flying tow balls, shackles and things from some really
- politely put - stupid aggressive pulls with inappropriate equipment.
My Tundra has a 30' x 3" snatch strap. I don't have a winch but I can pull someone up out of a ditch or snowbank.
I did tow a 65000lb dump truck once, it was a fairly brutal tow for a tundra but dumbass ran out of fuel literally in
the middle of a 6 lane intersection. That was a static strap and I'll never do that again.
Winching is always preferred for a safe controlled recovery or extraction.
I don't even want to know about that jeep up there ^^^. I see a wheelchair in the background. How in the heck
they got all jacked around on that road, who knows. Getting them back on their wheels is good and lucky, I hope driving
away was okay.

 

As mentioned, there is a place for both and if doing any kind of off roading and you intend on doing any recovery you should carry both. More importantly you need to know how to properly use it, I've seen shackles go through windshields from improper use. I've seen hitches used with just a hitch pin to make a recovery. It worked but that hitch pin got bent inside the hitch and they couldn't get it out, now the rope is stuck inside also.
Think of it this way, you're stuck in the mud, not deep but just need a little tug, there's nowhere to hook a winch cable to. You get lucky and a Jeep comes by but has no recovery gear. Not a big deal, right? You can just hook your winch cable to them. Well you hook up and start pulling only to find out the winch is pulling the jeep backwards because it's lighter than you. What's your option without a kinetic rope? Oh, lets just have the jeep give a tug using the winch line that's already attached! It might work and in worse case scenario if that's your only option then go for it. Most likely it'll work but at what cost? At the least you've probably jammed that winch cable in the drum, at the worst you've damaged the brake drum in the winch. In reality if you had one, great time for a kinetic rope, quick, simple, uses stored energy to get you out.

 

To me it looks like the Jeep was going downhill, hit the brakes and the trailer pushed the Jeep towards the edge, driver turned away from drop off, classic jacknife.

 

Pretty good guess. The Jeep was a very experienced off roader who has been paralyzed for many years after a street bike accident. He lifts himself up into his lifted Jeep, then hauls up and disassembles his chair and uses hand controls to drive. Really cool guy. We were on the border with Death Valley in between the Salt Tram and Cerro Gordo at about 7000 feet going down The Descents (that road is much steeper than it looks) and it was one quick mistake. He’s done the move a thousand times but with hand controls his left hand is gas and brake and his right hand steers. To down shift he quickly left go of the wheel to slap the gear shift down lower and the left front wheel hit a rock on the turn and spun the wheel uphill and the trailer pushed it over. We got him out without any injuries and the trailer’s lock and roll hitch helped us get his Jeep off the roof to the side, and then we winched it back onto its tires.

We had to pinch one broken brake line with a vice grip, took off the front of the roof, laid the broken windshield down and I drove it 10 miles down the steep mountain with a rig in front of me as a stopper in case the brakes gave out. Got a nasty sunburn too that day.

This was more of an extreme day but without the right gear it’s often the quick little trip where you get stuck that turns into an all day slog.

not too bad

 

I’m on my phone so I can’t cut the one comment out. Never, yes Never tug on a winch line for recovery. Unless you don’t own the winch. Not designed for that.

 

A bunch of us went out to Cruise Moab in 2012, one of our members was paraplegic and used hand controls like you describe, he was driving a lifted FJ Cruiser on 35's. Ironically he became paralyzed from a motorcycle accident also. We all signed up for Pritchett Canyon and waited an hour for our trail guide to show up. When he did he apologized and explained that the original guide bailed because he saw we were all east coasters and with full bodied rigs. He warned us that the trail was "tight" and to expect body damage, possible roll overs, definite breakage and after looking at our rigs to not complete the trail till after dark. When he saw the guy in the wheelchair he asked us to the side if we really wanted him going on the trail, we assured him things would be fine. Needless to say the only breakage was a motor mount, they don't know the meaning of "tight" and when we got out he told us we were the fastest group he's ever led. Almost got in a fight with a Jeep tour because they wanted to pass our group of 8 when the motor mount broke, told them it would be a 10 minute fix. While waiting one of their Jeeps broke the front R&P catching up to their group, never saw them again.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/n6Pm1DHx5FRUXPJN8

 

Good Points here..............Doesnt hurt to have both; except initially in the pocket book.

 

For the amount of money we all spend doing this, $200 for a Yankum shouldn’t be a deal breaker. Mine came with a nice bag at least.