2WD AC V8 Leveling Options

Hey guys,

after reading the sticky I wanted to see if there was any real world usage of any of the “leveling” kits some of the sponsors sell. I’ve seen OME 2883’s and 5100’s say it should raise me about 3 inches, I’ve also seen people say it was like 1.5. The truck is totally a pavement princess and I use it more for hauling work stuff (medical field, nothing serious) and staying high and dry here in Houston more than anything. I’ve seen spacer lifts which I’m not against either. I ran OME/5100’s in my first Gen Tacoma with no issues, I’m ASSuming it’s the same in a first Gen tundra as well? Tire of choice will be a 255/75r17 and stock wheels.

 

Did you really read the sticky? I feel like it explains discrepancy in lifts. A lot has to do with cab type, whether 2WD/4WD, and if there's any added weight (armor/winch/camper/etc.)

I've never heard of 2883s lifting anyone's truck 3", the actual amounts of lift we've typically seen by cab and drivetrain are also in the sticky.

You've put zero truck info in your "Vehicle one line description" detail of your profile which will show for us under your username on all your posts once entered. What we need to see with that is also discussed in the sticky, what we want to see. We can't help you if you can't help us understand what you're driving, what drivetrain, what cab type, etc.

May want to go back and read over the sticky again, then pop in here.

I'm running similar tire diameter to what you're listing (275/70r17) and eat mudflaps and sometimes grab inner fender with over 2" lift front and rear.

 

Some extra weight in the bed will help level the truck and have the benefit of smoothing the ride over those houston roads.

 

One of you said 255 the other said 275 - no wonder it doesn't add up.

 

The truck description is in the title, I figured that would be all I need? It’s a 2004 Access Cab with a V8 and RWD. See that’s the problem Shifty, talk to a sponsor and they’ll tell you 2883 will level it, I just wanted some actual real world feedback.

 

In what world?

255/75r17 = 32.1" diameter (and 10" width)
275/70r17 = 32.2" diameter (and 10.8" width)

Of course, it'll vary by tire manuf'er, my Mickeys are closer to 32.5, pretty aggressive, but ... you get the gist.

 

So you want us to scroll up to the top of the thread or screen every time we need to remind ourselves when we could just look under your avatar? Extra work for us makes you happy, got it.

Anyway... It's in the sticky. A few of us sat down and collected information from dozens of lifts on here (and two other forums) to put out the info in the "Suspension, wheel and tires ..." section of that thread. It's one of the main reasons that thread exists today, actually. Because vendors are quite often full of shit and people weren't getting what was advertised. The "Measure Up" sticky is another reference thread for lifts before/after stuff.

There's also a hefty note or two about listening to vendors in the sticky. Our trucks are not that popular and they don't sell nearly as much for 1st gens. Many are catering to and/or listening to 2nd or 3rd hand advice for people with DC V8/4WD and have nfc what will happen with an AC or RC. I went through it with my lift. Several others did too. It's the whole reason that bulleted section for suspension exists.

Suspension, wheel and tires ...

• NO, you probably won't be cleanly tucking 35s on a 1GT w/o rub unless you're prepared to drop a significant chunk of money on a proper 6" lift, to tub your firewall, cut or hammer pinch welds, remove your mud flaps, add wheel spacers up front, and still potentially rub somewhere. Yes, it's possible to do, it's just not cheap. You should realistically be prepared to drop more than the insured value of your truck to get there, between lifting, wheels, tires, and alignments. Buy extra insurance!
• YES, 33s are very do-able with minimal rubbing on a quality 2"-2.5" lift. Look at the end of this section for specific brands and situations to avoid. Do you and your truck a favor, buy from a known, reputable vendor like Toytec, Icon, Fox, Elka, Eibach, or similar 'quality' name brand, any of their 'stage 1' lift kits are sufficient. After installing one of those kits, many members here with AC and DC trucks are tucking ~33s (either skinny 33 proper, or "near-33" with 285/70r17) and minor rub, if any. Seems the DC trucks tend to rub more/worse than AC/RC trucks.
• MOREOVER, understand something: 2" of lift with oversized tires is a significant lift! I have roughly 2" lift with my Toytec coilovers, and I'm running 275/70r17 tires (32.2") and my double-digit aged kids have trouble getting in and out, it sits about 4" higher off the ground in reality. I'm over 6ft tall and need to use the OEM steps to get in. Most people with road queens or mild offroad, fire roads, etc. will be perfectly happy with a 1" lift and upsizing 1" on tires to 265/70r17 (31.6").
• We also have members with no "real" lift, i.e. just a basic strut spacer (puck) providing 1.5" or so of lift and clearing 275/70r17 (~32.2") with minimal rubbing. Of course, spacer lifts aren't recommended for heavy off-road (collapse/crack risk), they're find if you just want a little extra added meat for on-road driving.
• Wheel fitment (backspacing/offset info) ... backspacing/offset plays an important role in whether or not you're gonna rub when choosing larger-than-OEM tires. If you need help with understanding what ballpark you should be aiming in, this is a good thread to read. Gist: The best put year near the fender edge w/o rub on 8½" wide wheel is ~4¾" backspace, at 9" wide ~4.5" backspace. Popular OEM 7½" wide wheels had 5" backspace. You can run oversize 275/70r17 tires on 17x8.5" wheels @ 0 offset (i.e. 4.75" backspace) leveling up front w/minor rub.
• Wheel fitment (caliper rub): If your truck has larger 13WL calipers, beware of caliper rub! 13WL is std on 2003+
• Wheel fitment (from other Tundras): 2007-2022 Tundras use 5-lug wheels. In 2023, Tundras started using 6-lug axles again, but the hub bore is smaller (95mm on 3rd gen vs. 106mm on 1st gen), so they technically won't work unless you spend a couple hundo on custom-made spacers.
• Wheel fitment (from other Toyota models): Anything from Tacomas, 4Runners, Land Cruiser, LX470 and GX models that are 6-lug will typically fit. Someone here is probably running it already, and pics of it are in the OEM wheels thread.
• If you're new to suspension, and all the words people are using sound Greek, or you need help to evaluate what you've got, this series of replies may help to understand what parts are involved.
• There are two basic types of lift: Adjustable and Static. "Static" is either non-adjustable, or it requires some disassembly to adjust (example: struts with variable circlips like the Bilstein 5100). "Adjustable" is typically a coilover, which can be adjusted any time, on the fly, to truly dial-in height as needed. Obviously, after adjusting your suspension, go get re-aligned. Suspensions typically settle after install, you may want to wait a bit before alignment, or get realigned again later.
• Virtually every lift kit you see online is going to be geared towards DOUBLE CAB 4WD, its specific weight and geometry. DC 4WD (/Seqoia) is the heaviest of all 1st Gen trucks. If you have an AC or RC truck, and/or you are 2WD instead of 4WD, be forewarned, you'll get more lift than advertised on pre-packaged lifts! This is a painfully pre-purchase warning for any V6 and 2WD folks driving AC/RC trucks out there!
• Extras... At 1.5" of lift or higher, you'll want extended swaybar links, Suspension Maxx sells, to avoid travel limitations. As you approach 2.5" of lift with 1GT trucks, you're closing in on thresholds of OEM travel and should consider extras to compensate. Examples: You'll want new upper control arms (UCA) to more easily hit alignment numbers. At 3" and beyond, you may need to snug up your OEM CV boots or get ORS extended boots or similar to avoid grease-sling or ripping, and probably add bumpstops, etc. There are a lot of considerations - think about it, or ask questions in the forum if you need a sanity check!
• When buying new upper control arms, There are a few types, know what you're getting, read more here to help you decide.
• For rear lifting, try to avoid using blocks (esp. if towing, axle wrap is bad mmmkay), consider an AAL (add-a-leaf) kit to get an extra 0.75" - 2.0" lift instead (*if* you don't need your overload leaf!), or many members have found a new ATS "HD" leaf pack was a very wallet-friendly way to get a solid, no-brainer 1.5" - 2" lift, part# 90-221HD for 4WD, 90-287HD for 2WD and it includes an overload leaf. WARNING: The Icon 51100 add-a-leaf kit ONLY gives 1st Gen Tundras between 0.5" - 0.75" of lift IRL! The Wheeler's offroad kit is a better option for 1.5" (ish) of lift. NOTE: You should look into buying an LSPV relocation bracket unless you want a lesser braking experience after lifting.
• One OEM suspension upgrade Toyota offered for the 1GT was Bilstein, others got KYB. For "leveling" a truck and lifting up to 3" or more while keeping factory-ish ride, many people therefore opt for Bilstein. The Bilstein 5100s are a very popular choice because you can adjust the spring cup to different heights using circlips/notches to get more or less lift *if*using non-lifted springs. You could also get a bit deeper into the Bilstein line for more money, and go with the 5160 or 6110 line.
• If you go with the more popular option, the Bilstein 5100, you have two spring options, either stick with your stock springs, or go with a lifted spring. If you go with a lifted spring, some online vendors will pre-assemble the spring into the strut at an extra charge to make it a bolt-in experience. However, whichever spring option you choose, there are limitations, like, if you plan to re-use your OEM springs, different cabs & drivetrains have set limits that aren't recommended to exceed (see chart here for OEM springs and notch allowances). If you choose to install taller aftermarket springs to get lift, such as any of the spring offerings from ARB/OldManEmu/OME, Dobinsons or Eibach, Bilstein suggests to only use the bottom notch/circlip on the 5100 strut to avoid issues (will probably offer a smoother overall ride). For a true-to-OEM-stock-replacement without lifting, either go with the Bilstein 4600, or get a 5100 and use your stock springs at the bottom circlip/notch.
• If choosing a lifted spring on Bilstein 5100s, here's some selection guidance. A popular option is 5100s paired with OME (Old Man Emu, not 'OEM') springs. It can be daunting which spring to pick, between the 2883, 2884, 2885, 2886, 2887. From ample user experiences here on the forum, we know what you can expect: For AC/RC with 2WD, If you want to get near-level, go OME 2883, and if you plan to also lift the rear, go OME 2884. For AC/RC with 4WD, go 2883 for a sport rake, use the 2884 to get level, or if you plan to lift the rear 1.5" - 2" after, then go with the 2885. For nearly all DC applications, you'll get "sport" rake with the 2884, near level with the 2885, or if you plan to lift the rear, OME 2887 is probably your jam. With any suggestion given here, expect it'll take at least a few dozen miles of driving before your suspension settles. We've seen a couple of AC/RC people ignore or miss this advice, they wound up with Carolina Squat because they expected OME 2885s would be right for their AC/RC 2WD truck - it's just not the case, and a lot of vendors don't bother to inform their customers any of this, so learn from their mistakes.
• Know many companies, like OME/Old Man Emu don't actually make kits for the 1st Gen Tundras, most kits are adapted from 4Runners and Tacomas therefore, depending on your cab type & drivetrain, you can really screw yourself w/too much lift, travel issues, or damage. It's especially true for AC/RC trucks - If a vendor says their 1st gen OME kit is good for 2"-3" of lift, that number is more for DC/4WD trucks, AC/RC 4WD owners can expect to exceed 3" lift ... and if AC/RC 2WD owners can expect 4" or more. Yes, 100% serious, we've seen it happen, folks here had to replace their brand new lift after. DC 4WD owners probably won't see this problem. DC 2WD owners may get more than advertised, but not nearly as bad as the RC/AC guys do, and you may not screw anything up, but be prepared. Note: OME is a great company. I suspect they're only doing this to avoid the DC/4WD and Sequoia owners from getting pissed if they didn't get a full 2.5"-3" from an OME lift kit.
• Alignment numbers after lifting: This is important, if you want a roadworthy driving experience without eating tires after your lift, there's a sweet spot for the 1GT that's been road-tested and proven. Specifically ask the shop to aim for the following, per our resident expert:
  • For 'normal' or 'mostly freeway': -0.3 camber, 2.6 - 2.8 caster, 0.1 - 0.2 total toe (0.05 - 0.10 per side).
  • For those who like to corner faster: -0.5 camber, 2.6 - 2.8 caster, 0.1 - 0.2 total toe (0.05 - 0.10 per side).
  • Basically, get that camber closer to -0.1 if you're mostly driving freeway, but aiming closer to -0.3 may help offset outside-edge tire wear.
  • IF you are running SPC upper control arms: Some shops may be unfamiliar with this product, it allows camber/caster to be set from both lower and upper control arm, versus OEM, which only allows setting from below. My advice? Consider pre-clocking your SPC uppers at "C" before going in for alignment, or tell the shop that's installing to clock at "C" instead of "D" so you can max out the caster later. Possibly the easiest way to get there would be to max out the cams with the LCA as far forward as possible (front cams pointing inward, rear cams pointed outward). Use the SPC balljoint slot to get things in the ballpark, lock down the balljoint, then fine-tune with the cams on the lower control arms. On mine, with my alignment already good, I found clocking the UBJ at "D" puts you in the OEM ballpark, "C" puts you close to the numbers above. When you get it home, make sure the UBJ shim is properly in its slot, then confirm the nut is torqued to spec (150ftlb)!
• This was said earlier, some lifts to avoid: Avoid Rancho struts, and maybe all of their stuff, the lower bushings on their 1GT truck kits blow out, fast. Avoid Rough Country kits. They're cheap as hell, and too many people have come here with damage or issues from the kits, which is unfortunate when you can pay a hundred or two more for a solid Bilstein 5100 kit.
• Other things to avoid for moderate offroading: Strut spacers --- talk with a pro before mixing spacers with a lift kit. Skip lifting blocks, add-a-leaf is a better option, while a new leaf spring pack is ideal. As mentioned above, the "HD" springs from ATS are well-proven by forum members. If using blocks or strut spacers, and even wheel spacers, aim for steel vs. alloy parts if possible.

 

Honestly my guy, I went through the builds and looked for DC's (since that's what I got) I just did a bunch of comparisons.

I eventually ended up on my suspension setup and I was spot on when it came to how much lift/height gain I was going to get.