ADS shocks

I wanted to add some thoughts here about the ICON delta joint that are installed on my UCA's. Matt offers this as an upgrade from the standard uniball. I chose the delta joint with the thought that I wanted a grease-able, sealed ball joint with better articulation than the stock unit. I've heard complaints of uni balls being less than ideal with regard to maintenance in wet/snowy/icy/muddy conditions so I thought I'd try out these delta joints. I didnt think to ask if the delta joints came with any kind of a dust cover or boot on them, and they do not. The MCM UCA's do have zirk fittings for the bushings where the UCA mounts to the frame and the delta joint also has a zirk fitting on top. The delta joints are sealed units and Matt says to just squeeze some more grease into the zirk every 3k miles or so. I suppose time will tell if the absence of a dust cover or boot around the ball joint spindle will make an actual difference in the performance and maintenance of the unit.

All in all, they seem like a nice piece of gear. They fit into the stock spindles well and were easy to torque to the proper spec.

As an added bonus, all it took to separate the spindle and stock ball joint was a few good whacks of a hammer on the flat spot of the spindle. No pickle fork surgery needed!

 

Agreed. Those little wings are essentially gussets that transfer load to the solid(ish) sides of your leaf packs. Keeps the tabs from bending when you go full tilt.

 

Are you talking about potentially having dust boots on the underside of the joints? I'd think that this area should stay pretty good due to gravity, but I've been wrong before... I've got my Delta Joint retro-fit parts sitting here. They'll get installed next month when I do some other upgrades.

 

Yea, the underside of the joints were my concern. Basically I had a picture in my head of something like the stock ball joints which have that rubber boot that is wedged in between the bottom of the UCA and the top of the spindle. Like I said, time will tell if it's actually an issue or if I'm just being OCD. If anything builds up on the joint a fresh squeeze of grease will push it out and then a wipe with some shop towels takes care of the rest.

Let me know how you like the delta joints when you get them in. Do you have a press to install those yourself? I was glad MCM shipped them out ready to install!

I can't wait to go smash more trails soon. I need to keep an eye on my speedo so I have a better sense of what the suspension can handle. When I'm getting into a fun section I usually keep the truck in S2 and run in the 3k-4k rpm range. On stock gears I think that keeps me in the 35-50 mph territory. Way faster than stock is capable of handling. When I was seeing big bumps or ruts coming I was still thinking "BRAKE!" in my mind but just hammering through it was pretty smooth. It'll take some getting used to it to find my best happy place. I ran my tires at 20 psi this weekend and that seems like a happy medium for handling and cushion on smaller bumps.

 

I am having a few things done at a friend’s brake/alignment shop. Only so many hours in a day, and I’m just not as excited to do all of the little things like I used to be! I did everything on my truck so far, but he’s doing the following in a couple weeks:

Install all new brakes. I went all out and ordered a full Alcon kit.
Replace lug studs with longer ones.
Replace Uni-Balls with Delta Joints. He’s got the tools…
Alignment with max caster that will keep me in specs. I’m bumping up to a 35” tire and want as much body mount clearance as I can get.

 

I removed the stock bump stop brackets today and got the ADS hydro bumps in there. The rivets holding the stock brackets to the frame were a little bit of a pain, but not the worst job I’ve ever undertaken. Had to trim the inner fender liner a bit to make access for the Schrader valve on the bump. Strike plates slipped under the u bolts no problem. Bump stop brackets lined up with the holes in the frame no problem. ADS even put a relief cut in the drivers side bracket to accommodate that bolt that sticks through the frame and holds some plastic box inside the frame rail.

While I was in there I tightened the top nut on the rear shocks all the way down as ADS recommended. Seems unlikely that they could twist under this kind of torque now.

I also opened up all the bypass valves to see how soft I could get the rear. I had already opened the ride zone bypass all the way last time I was messing around. The bump zone bypass was probably about halfway open and I opened it fully. The rebound valve was already full open, as well. The ride is pretty soft around town like this, it’s nice. When I hit a dip hard it sort of feels like it bottoms out (but it’s definitely not). I hit some trails later in the day to see how it felt off-road. It ride s pretty plush, especially at higher speeds. I hit a section of whoop-ish potholes and the rear started bucking a bit so I probably need to decrease bypass on a few tubes to firm things up. Learning as I go on these things!

Seems like the front 2.5’s may have trouble keeping up with this rear setup. Wondering if I should have spent the extra money for 3.0’s and forgone the bump stops. I suppose I could always upgrade in the future! Why do I get the feeling I’m headed for LT at some point?…

 

The 2.5 would be fine up front with a bypass. I’d play with those tubes in the rear a bit more. What leaf pack do you have? How much weight in the rear? Also how much pressure in the shocks and bump stop?

 

Deaver 748. Only thing in the back is a husky tool box, no more than 200 pounds there. Not sure on shock pressure (assuming you are talking about coil overs?). Also not sure on bump stop pressure but Tyler at ADS says they ship with about 150 psi in them. I don’t have any N2 gear for checking/adjusting shock pressures. Probably need to do something about that. So far, bumps haven’t even made contact with the strike plates but I’ve only had them on for like 6 hours at this point.

I was probably a little rash with the 3.0 comment. I’m sure I can get a 2.5” system working really well. I don’t really want to, but could probably go down the rabbit hole of revalving and changing shims in the coil overs. I’ve read some on it and it sounds like you can really change the way shocks perform if you start playing with internals! Adding a front bypass may be an option, too.

 

I was out again this weekend and got a chance to hit a trail with large bumps, big water bar type features, washboards, soft sand, choppy little rocks, and even some "crawling". I would say this is the type of trail that epitomizes the terrain I want the suspension to perform on. Here's what I found:

• On the large bumps the rear definitely seems to have more ability than the fronts. For reference, the larger bumps I'm talking about are basically water bar/water diversion type humps in a two track trail that are probably anywhere from 18"-30" in height. They are sometimes found in multiples and sometimes just singles. They're fairly steep, but not to the point where approach and departure angles are a concern. These are some pretty big bumps and I can definitely go over them faster than in stock configuration, but I was hoping the 2.5" remote resi coilovers would handle stuff like this better than they currently seem to. When I go over these features with a little speed (maybe 10-15mph? need to check speedo next time) the compression stroke seems pretty good and smooth, but then I get to the "top" of the bump and it feels like the C/O's rebound quickly and I get this bang where I assume the C/O's reach rebound stroke limit. After that the weight of the truck comes back down (on the "down" side of the bump) and compression stroke is quickly used up and I bottom out a bit. Front Durobumps definitely help a lot, those things are pretty slick for $150 or whatever they cost. Waaaaay better than factory bumps! Anyway, maybe I'm expecting too much from stock LCA's and other inherent limitations of a "mid travel" truck but that's the best way I can describe the experience from the front end when hitting those types of features. Seems like the rear has more to give on these features. Not sure if it's the amount of travel or the valving in the shocks, but the rear (trip bypass, U748's, and hydro bumps) seems to be handling these features better than the fronts. I did touch my rear bump stops in a few places and got a little less than an inch of compression somewhere along my travels. Photo of rear bump attached for reference on how much of the bump stroke I got into.
• On the soft sand, this feels like a Cadillac. Not much to tell here. I run aired down to about 20psi and it feels like driving on marshmallows. Wish everything was this smooth! These were higher speed areas (maybe hitting 45mph at spots?) and I didnt hit any large features in the sand.
• Choppy little rocks are Buuuuuummmmmmpppppppyyyyyyy. This trail had sections where the bedrock is still kind of exposed so it's just choppy as hell. This stuff is approximately 3"-6" in height. Front and rear seem to just bounce through this type of stuff and it's not enjoyable at all. It's basically the complete opposite of the soft sand experience (shocking, I know!).
• Washboards are about the same as the choppy rocky sections. Very bumpy and I just feels like the suspension isnt really working at all. The vibration in the steering column and throughout the truck is just rough as hell. Hoping something can be done about this via tuning or valving.
• As far as "crawling" the truck did great. The front and rear both have much better articulation and are able to keep wheels on the ground way better than before. This is especially true of the rear with those Deaver's. It was only a small section where I had to navigate a couple small obstacles so I didnt even get a chance to bash my sliders, though

All in all, a MAJOR improvement from my previous setup. I hit the trails harder than I ever have and this setup took it pretty well, nothing broken, and definitely went faster than I could have previously. I had a friend along this trip and he drove his stock 2017 on 33" Falkens part way up this trial and then jumped in my truck. He was blown away at how much better my truck handled the terrain so maybe I just have a short memory and have already forgotten just how much better this system is compared to my previous setup.

As I discussed in other threads, my benchmark for performance on a full size, street driven truck is the 3rd gen raptor (stock on 35's). That thing is freakin impressive in my opinion. Also in my opinion, my current setup is not handling the terrain as well as the raptor. Granted, I have only had these new shocks/components for about a month and have done almost zero tuning (besides messing with the bypass tubes a little bit) so I'm looking forward to getting more out of this setup.

One thing is for sure, I need new tires. These E rated coopers are freaking stiff on the street AND they're getting to be about useless in muddy or slick conditions. I think I'm gonna try the C rated Toyo OC AT3 in a 35" flavor. Also plan to drop to a 17" wheel to get a bit more sidewall working for me.

Feedback on adjustments of equipment (or my performance expectations!) are welcome. Tell me how I can make this thing go faster and get smoother, guys!

 

I can tell you that small bump compliance like washboards is difficult even with my long travel. Try opening the bypass tubes all the way and the rebound and start feeling that out both front and rear. I slowed my rebound down and it made a significant difference

 

Thanks for the input, Rey. My front C/O's do not have any adjusters so if I wanted to retune those my only option would be a tear down and rework the internals.

My rear bypass valves are currently all fully open, 2 comp and 1 rebound circuit on these ADS triples. Are you suggesting to leave the compression valves all the way open and start to incrementally close the rebound?

 

I have the delta joints in my MCM arms, and they've been trouble free for almost 15k miles. I thought is was weird they didn't come with boots too, but supposedly they're not needed. I clean them off and grease them at every oil change.

 

Correct on the rear compression tube and rebound. You can then begin to close to each tube as you see fit. For example if you're hitting the bump stop try turning the upper most compression tube a few turns in etc. I'm by far an expert at this but you can see quick results in areas. I leave these bypass tubes in the truck incase I notice something I want to try or a section of trail I want to experiment in.

 

Nice. They appear to be good pieces of gear and I expect them to give me good service. I like that there are zirk fittings at all the moving joints on the UCA. Makes me wish I would have installed greaseable zirk bolts in the rear shackles, too!

 

Roger that. Yea I have been keeping the little wrenches for adjustments in my center console so I can make adjustments on the fly. I'll play with that rebound first and see what happens.

I actually don't mind hitting the bump stop as long as I'm not killing it. My thought would be I'd rather keep the compression zones as soft as possible and rely on the hydro bumps for the bigger hits that go beyond the capabilities of the shock and leaf pack. I can't imagine hitting the rear too much harder than I did this weekend and I only got into the bump a little bit. Am I thinking of that correctly or am I missing something else with regard to stiffening up the compression zones?

 

Yep that’s correct. The bump stop is the “last line of defense”

 

Far from an expert also but that is how I tune stuff too. You can "quickly" narrow down where you want stuff by adjusting one tube at a time from full open to full closed and see how the limits feel (or do the halfway mark also for three points of comparison). Then I like to drive one stretch over and over and over and adjust one tube at a time so you're scientific about it. And once it's feeling good you can bump your speed or try other terrain and adjust it further if needed. That's what I've done in the past, and afterwards talking to ADS and showing them videos their feedback was they didn't think they could do better themselves In regards to bumps, I like to run the bumps at a really high pressure since as Rey said, they are the last line of defense. There is lots of tuning in bump stops alone (valving, pressure, fluid volume), but for basic stuff if you have a nitrogen tank (can get at a home brewing website or store) then that allows plenty of adjusting.

 

Thanks man, appreciate the input. I just saw you updated your buggy build, too. That thing is neat! Glad it's rolling and you're getting some enjoyment out of it!

 

You wanna be careful not to rely on the bumps too much. If you hit the bumps too hard you risk bending an axle housing

 

Thanks man, appreciate it! I was thinking this thread was fitting since the buggy has all ADS stuff too!

 

Haha, sounds like you know a guy who did that or something. Poor bastard! The strike plates on my kit mounted on top of the leaf pack and it seems like they would have trouble contacting the axle housing outside of some pretty extreme force. Is yours the same or do the bumps contact the axle housing directly?

 

Different as I'm' spring under. The bumps contact a strike pad welded to the housing. Yours is basically hitting a semi solid block on top of the housing You can put an O-ring on the shaft of your bump stop and it'll move upward, indicating how much you're getting into the bump. It's my opinion that you don't wanna be bottoming out the bump.
Though it was a bummer having to replace the housing I learned a ton. I got to fit a Ford 9" backbone brace to new housing and weld it up w/o warping the new housing. Break it....build it back stronger... rinse and repeat. LOL
Also, the nitrogen fill kit can be really helpful with the bumps, not to mention shocks. Too much nitrogen and the rear will donkey kick, at least this is what I found on my truck. I usually check the nitrogen before heading out on a several day trip and usually find a little top off is necessary. IIRC I ran the coil overs, when I had the same set up as you, at 200psi.

 

Great info, thanks for your input! I had forgotten that you went SUA, makes sense about the bumps in that config.

I don’t have an O ring on the bump shaft but I was able to see how far it travelled by the mud/dust that was wiped off when I hit them. Looks like I’m only getting into them about an inch, probably less, right now.


I think I’ll need an N2 setup at some point if I want to tune this at all on my own. I’ll be looking into that.

looking forward to learning more and dialing things in.

On another note, the new leaf springs and suspension handled towing really well last weekend. I haven’t adjusted my WDH yet for the slightly different ride height with the Deavers but man, what a difference. So much smoother and firmer than the stock setup with airbags.

 

might want to cut that tailpipe, at full droop my Deaver leaf pack was sitting over it. I too have the ADS bypasses.

 

Yea I thought I would have problems with that as well, but so far there's been no contact between the leaf and the tailpipe. I even jacked the rear of the truck up by the hitch receiver and let the springs go to full droop and it doesn't seem to be an issue with mine. I'm definitely going to keep an eye out for any rubbing!

 

are you using aftermarket shackles as well ? but yeah keep an eye on it.
Same for the brake lines. I had my truck on a lift to see how far it would go.

 

Yep. Using the MCM shackles that they provide with the Deaver springs.

 

Weird they didn't come with o rings on the shafts. Could always put a rubber band on it if you wanted, but obviously not totally needed as you noted.

For the nitrogen setup, all you need is a tank and a nitrogen regulator for like $40 off Amazon, and then a hose and chuck rated to like 600psi. There's lots of fancier things people do, but you should be able to put one together for like $150-$200. There's "no loss" chucks and stuff, but I just have a normal shrader chuck and that works fine in my experience if you pop it off fast. I got my tank from a home brewing website online and just traded it in at the welding store, but if they're anal about that just get the smallest nitrogen tank you can.

One of those tools that's kind of useless but you buy once and don't need to refill it for years and will end up using it on your truck and friends and random stuff. Definitely worth it if you plan on messing with your shocks much.

 

Any tips to remove minor pitting and rust from the shock shafts?

 

Boots to prevent pitting