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Replace Pads not Rotors

Discussion in '2.5 Gen Tundras (2014-2021)' started by GreatAvalon, Jul 30, 2018.

  1. Jul 30, 2018 at 7:43 PM
    #1
    GreatAvalon

    GreatAvalon [OP] New Member

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    Guys, quick question. I have about 4k miles on my new brake setup, which is StopTech slotted rotors and Hawk LTS pads. I am not happy with how I lost my initial bite when comparing this new setup to the warped factory setup. Tried to give it time for the pads to come in, but they just aren't to my satisfaction. I've used this setup on many other vehicles, including other Tundras, and had good results, but I'm just not happy with how its performing on my 2016. Bought a set of the TRD brake pads to try...almost bought them instead of the LTS, and it's TBD if I should have or not (depending on how they turn out).

    Anyways - the point of this post is: do I need to do anything special to my rotors when I'm swapping out the LTS pads for the TRD brake pads? Scuff them with sandpaper or anything? Again, only 4k miles on the rotors. You can still see the cross-hatch marks some from when they were brand new.
     
  2. Jul 30, 2018 at 7:47 PM
    #2
    15whtrd

    15whtrd Mr. Blonde

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    Did you go and bed them in properly? I do something like 35 mph to 10 mph 4 times hard, and then from around 45 to 50 mph down to 15 mph 4 times hard. Then park it without the brakes on and let them cool off. Needs to leave a layer of pad material down on the rotors as well as bake the pads.
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2018
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  3. Jul 31, 2018 at 7:35 AM
    #3
    B737

    B737 Throbbing Member

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    what are the hawk lts, are they ceramic?

    i would just stick in your new pads, bed them, and see how they feel. Did you do a flush and bleed when you did your brake job? if not, might be worth doing that. This is the toyota adapter for Motive, it works great.
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2018
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  4. Jul 31, 2018 at 8:30 AM
    #4
    daylorb

    daylorb New Member

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    +1 bleed for certain and properly bed them. Sounds like you went with a great setup, the initial bite could be the fluid in the lines. I've never used Hawk but sure seems like folks report great initial bite on the LTS, and those are the exact rotors I know many, many people use for all sorts of setups.
     
  5. Jul 31, 2018 at 8:38 AM
    #5
    GreatAvalon

    GreatAvalon [OP] New Member

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    Thanks for the replies, guys.

    Yep, sure did. Bed them exactly like Hawk prescribes. They never really came in, thought it was just fade. Let them do a cool cycle and they still felt like they were slipping. Thought maybe they needed some miles on them, so said whatever. After all these miles, they still never came in and give the sensation of "slipping" for the first bit of pedal then they softly come in, vs the initial bite of the stock pads. Really bummed about it, but tired of the "slip", so going with the pads I almost bought.

    Hawk says the LTS is ferro-carbon or something like that, not ceramic. They *should* dust pretty bad. That's another indication I have that something is up with mine - they are dusting less than the OEM pads. I don't care about high-dust pads, I just want really good brakes. On every other application I've used them on, they dust a good bit. However, they aren't dusting that much at all for me. That's just another question mark in this whole deal for me lol.

    Sounds good, that's what I'll do. I'll bed them in exactly like TRD says to and hope they are better. I did not do a bleed and flush...I was only in the 20k mile range. I was also thinking that it may be worth doing the bleed and flush if the new pads don't fix the issue. Thanks for confirming that as my next step if it doesn't fix it. It's all small potatoes...I'm really just not liking the characteristics of the LTS pads on my setup...I believe they'll stop in an emergency situation no problem, I just don't like having to go through so much pedal to get to stopping power when with the stock pads it was right at the press of the pedal.
     
  6. Jul 31, 2018 at 8:40 AM
    #6
    15whtrd

    15whtrd Mr. Blonde

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    Call them maybe you got a bunk set.
     
  7. Jul 31, 2018 at 8:41 AM
    #7
    GreatAvalon

    GreatAvalon [OP] New Member

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    Right! I'm literally scratching my head over the whole situation. I've used this exact setup on so many vehicles...Rams, Jeeps, even other Tundras and never experienced the "slip" I'm feeling in place of the bite that I felt with the OEM pads and the LTS pads on every other setup. I've always bed them in according to Hawk's instructions and had great results. I'm like...did I do something to contaminate the pads or something? I know I didn't, but still - that's what I'm sorting out in my head. Can't believe I'm not in love with it!
     
  8. Jul 31, 2018 at 8:49 AM
    #8
    daylorb

    daylorb New Member

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    There is definitely the chance to add problems to the system when you are compressing the pistons to get the pads out. I'd start there - super easy job - before redoing them!
     
  9. Jul 31, 2018 at 10:10 AM
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    B737

    B737 Throbbing Member

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    can you get into ABS if you panic stop?
     
  10. Jul 31, 2018 at 11:08 AM
    #10
    GreatAvalon

    GreatAvalon [OP] New Member

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    No, not anymore since the pad swap. Should I be able to? I have flat out stomped this new brake setup with 100% pressure and no ABS.
     
  11. Jul 31, 2018 at 11:11 AM
    #11
    15whtrd

    15whtrd Mr. Blonde

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    Hell yeah I think you should be able to. That don’t sound right. How about breaking hard over bumps? Can you get the ABS to kick in then? Maybe just as a test put your old set up back on and see if the problem is still there.
     
  12. Jul 31, 2018 at 11:21 AM
    #12
    GreatAvalon

    GreatAvalon [OP] New Member

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    They gone...thinking through this...when I panic brake, my pedal goes really deep. I'm telling you, I remember that brake pedal not moving very much to quickly come to a stop. Not the pedal has a lot of movement in it. Maybe I should get it flushed.
     
  13. Jul 31, 2018 at 11:24 AM
    #13
    15whtrd

    15whtrd Mr. Blonde

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    Not sure if this is the same issue but on my 2003 sequoia it acted very similar. But it was also showing the brake light and ABS light. I replaced all the brakes and it still did the same thing. Ended up changing the master cylinder and it changed everything. I want to say it was because the previous owner had the brakes bled and they depressed the pedal Beyond its standard stroke. Now whenever I bleed brakes I put something underneath the pedal to limit the travel.

    Not trying to get you to spend money on unneeded parts. but just sharing my experience.
     
  14. Jul 31, 2018 at 11:25 AM
    #14
    GreatAvalon

    GreatAvalon [OP] New Member

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    When I get close to my house, there is a spot I'll be able to do a panic brake on my way home from work today.
     
  15. Jul 31, 2018 at 11:26 AM
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    GreatAvalon

    GreatAvalon [OP] New Member

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    Interesting. I'm within warranty still and will have the dealer do the bleed, if needed. But if changing pads and a bleed doesn't work and I don't like it, I'll just trade it in tbh. But I'll really be surprised if pads or pads + bleed doesn't get it sorted out.
     
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  16. Jul 31, 2018 at 11:28 AM
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    B737

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    GreatAvalon[OP] and 15whtrd like this.
  17. Jul 31, 2018 at 11:38 AM
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    GreatAvalon

    GreatAvalon [OP] New Member

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    That's neat, thanks for the link showing how-to. Doesn't look too bad of a process at all. Is your Motive canister that builds the pressure the 0090?
     
  18. Jul 31, 2018 at 11:40 AM
    #18
    15whtrd

    15whtrd Mr. Blonde

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    Last time on my wife’s car I did a gravity bleed. Then I did it the conventional way with my wife helping me. Just a few pumps on each corner.
     
  19. Aug 3, 2018 at 2:47 PM
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    GreatAvalon

    GreatAvalon [OP] New Member

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    Just wanted to update. Got my TRD front pads from Roman in the mail yesterday and went ahead and threw them in. When I took off the Hawk LTS, I noticed a lip on the outside of the pad where it appeared the pad surface was wider than the rotor surface. Does this translate into the "slip" I was feeling while braking, not sure. But that was the only strange thing that I noticed on the pads. All 4 pads had the lip.

    I scuffed the rotors lightly with like 150 grit sandpaper or something...just barely. I IMMEDIATELY felt a difference, from the first stop out of the garage on my way to the bed-in road I use, it was already braking better than the LTS. Got to the bed-in road, TRD calls for 10 stops from 60MPH to 5-10 MPH. Did that and then drove around for a while on a bypass without stop lights to let everything cool off. Got home and parked it for a few hours. Then, according to TRD, they need another heat cycle. So later last night I went out and ran another heat cycle on them. I'm not hammering on them now quite yet, but already a tremendous difference. Much, much better. The LTS felt like they were brake faded the whole time...the TRD bite initially and throughout the stop like they should. Halfway through a stop from 60mph and I increase the brake pressure for a quick second, LTS had no affect. TRD the truck about stops when I do that. I'll update again as I get some use on them and start using them 100% normally, but so far, worlds better. Makes me want to replace the LTS rear pads just because.

    Thanks for everybody's feedback and discussion. It's still TBD if I think they need a flush or not, as I get more use on them with normal braking I'll be able to tell me. I'm thinking they won't need the bleed, but I should know more by next weekend. Thanks again, all! I'm back to being happy :D
     
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  20. Sep 27, 2019 at 7:48 PM
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    Philcam

    Philcam New Member

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    GreatAvalon,

    I have the Hawk pads and Hawk rotors. I noticed on my last tire rotation the same lip you’re describing. I couldn’t decide if the rotor was undersized or the pad oversized. I’ve ordered new pads and should do a replacement next week. I meant to take a picture to email Hawk, but forgot. I will certainly take a picture when I swap them out.
     

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