HELP WITH VIBRATION ISSUE WHILE TRUCK STILL UNDER WARRANTY

Looking for ideas and help while this truck is still under factory warranty

This spring I purchased my first Toyota ever, a 2018 Tundra SR 4x2 quad cab (not full 4 door) with 4.6 V8, barely 11K miles. It has a vibration issue that so far two dealerships can't track down. When I test drove I thought where it may have been where it was sitting on the lot, but apparently not. Originally it had the steel 18x8 steel wheels with 255/70/18 Michelin tires, the original dealership when I took it in did a truck inspection, said tires were cupped and feathered, and the carrier bearing on the drive shaft was a bit off-centered so they re-centered the carrier bearing, and did a spin balance on the tires/wheels.

I took to another dealership for 2nd opinion, they agreed about the tires, so since Michelin were replacing tires I purchased some aftermarket 20x9" alloy rims, the Helo HE901, model HE90129058918 which are hub centric, 110.50 bore, 5.71 backspace, 18MM offset and had initially LT285/5520 Falken Wildpeak AT3 tires mounted. They road force balanced and aligned truck at no charge to me, still has vibration. They thought it may have been heavy LT All Terrain tires, which I disagreed with but to just make sure the dealer then ordered Yokohoma Geolander AT GO15 in 275/55/20 mounted, road forced balanced and re-aligned again, still has vibration. The dealership then took it to the custom shop where the wheels came from, they found 3 of the 4 wheels were on the high spectrum of runout, so they warranted out those three wheels for new ones, remounted and road force balanced the Yokohoma's still has vibration.

One thing I noticed and brought to the dealer's attention was the rear axle seems to stick out a bit further on the right than on the left when looking from the rear at both rear wheels. The Toyota dealership agreed and so did the custom shop where the wheels came from.

Outside of the rear axle issue, is there anything that you would recommend me asking the dealer to specifically focus on?

You can feel the vibration in the steering wheel, seat and floorboard. IT starts around 48 mph, peaks between 58-61 then goes away at 65, comes back a bit at 75 then disappears around 82. It's a left to right shimmy in the steering wheel, I do feel a bit of slack in the steering, and I asked them to check the rack and rack bushings, they say nothing is wrong there, they also stated they checked the wheel hubs, all front steering and suspension components, etc. I asked them to check rotors as I have seen rotors cause vibration even though you don't feel while braking.

I am just at my end here, I have spent so much time taking this truck into the repair shop for something that really should not be that hard to find.

I truly don't believe its wheels and tires because there has been two sets of wheels, three sets of tires and the vibration still occurs at the same speed range.

Please help!!

 

All 2nd and 3rd get Tundras are off centered. It's more noticeable if you have an offset grater than less than 30. As for the vibration at certain higher speeds, there's a lot of different variables. Does the pulsation of the vibration coincide with the tire revolution? Or only with engine RPM? Do you feel it while braking, coasting, neutral? It may be Center carrier bearing since it was off center for a while the rubber bushing my have had the conformed with the old uneven shape and it's fighting the proper alignment. Similar scenario with un even tire wear with a new alignment. The steering will wonder until it gets the new wear to match the alignment.

You might need a new center carrier bearing.

 

Here is the interesting thing...if you stand back about 5' behind the truck and lean right and then lean left, you can blatantly see the axle sticks out at least an inch or two further on the right than the left. The first Toyota dealership said the carrier bearing was off center from factory, they adjusted but did not replace.

You don't feel the vibration at speeds below 45, it starts at 45, peaks at 58-61 then goes away at 65, comes back at 75 then goes away at 80ish

They have aligned it three times and always road force balance the wheels/tires. The dealership wants to take "measurements" and said they may have to use a frame machine, but they placed on an alignment machine and said the thrust is "within spec" but the visual offset of the axle was concerning to the tech

 

It sure could be in the drive line. 2 wheel drive could be a joint or yoke. I'd check everything and make sure the shaft itself is not bent where someone ran over something

 

I have to search my tread on my 2020, I did asked about the offset of the axles when I noticed. Most of the people here who are more invested with their trucks conformed that it's normal.

https://www.tundras.com/threads/202...er-xlk-4x4-off-road-build.56864/#post-1588647

https://www.tundras.com/threads/ps-wheels-stick-out-more-than-ds-answered-thanks.60719/

 

I have asked the dealer to check the front rotors for runout, even though I don't feel it while braking, check the driveshaft runout and balance, u-joints and yokes, they just blow me off and keep wanting to go back to wheels and tires. I even asked about wheel bearings and hubs.

Anything else that anyone could think I am missing in regards to this? I have heard the rack and pinion steering on these Tundras are not the best after doing some research, but don't know how true that is

 

Tundra's not perfect. They have flaws, I had an '05, '16 and '20 Tundra and '12 Sequoia. Each of them have their own short comings. Some, I just swept under the rug once I research and learned more about the vehicle's engineering. But, have them run a fine tooth comb in to it to make sure that nothing was missed. Maybe, test drive another Tundra on the lot to see a comparison and have them put your wheels and tires on it to make sure.

I know when I transferred my wheels and tire from my Tundra to the Sequoia, the Sequoia felt different and vice versa.

 

This makes me wonder if I made a mistake getting this truck... It was a one owner, clean carfax, only had 12,100 miles on it, clean as a tack and I got it for the famous Toyota reliability, as I have one friend whose dad has a T100 with almost 400K miles, and many of my friends dads and them have Tacomas with 350+k miles... I just wonder if the import companies have not quite got the hang of full size trucks? Nissan Titans are nice but you read of random crap with them too.

I have had Chevy/GMC's in the past, one Dodge that this Yota replaced, and the other trucks rode and performed good, just got tired of all the crap coming up after 150K of replace this, replace that, fix this, where you don't see that a lot with the imports until double the miles.

I am meticulous about my vehicles and taking care of them and with a kid in college and three in elementary school, money is tight and this is quite disappointing to say the least with this experience

 

My ‘19 needed a new rear axle assembly at 500 miles - apparently a known issue with Tacoma’s for rear axles “being out of spec”. Mine was the first tundra they saw and even brought in the regional tech to diagnose. Maybe mention that and see what they say

 

I am sorry to hear that. I am a Toyota loyalist my opinion may be biased at times, but I had high mileage trucks and the overall cost of ownership is really inexpensive. My '05 had 250+K when I traded it in. I did not get nothing for it, I should have kept it. My '12 Sequoia currently have 207K and runs like a champ. My 16 had 115k when I traded it in with the 20. I put 18K on my 20 in 8 months before I sold it to Carvana.

Driveline vibrations make me paranoid too since I practice performance driving events. I witnessed a few wheels, tires and driveline breaking off in and off the track. And having kids myself, their safety is my first priority. But LT tires and 20's are heavier and have a greater rotating mass compared to the Steel 18x8 or 20x8 alloys with p-metric tires. Shocks may be blown as well and the wheels starts bouncing at the speeds to mentioned. I see them all the time on the freeways.

The Tundras community have a pool of knowledge combined and someone here may have experienced the same as you, and have a fix for it. Don't lose hope in your Tundra just yet. Overall it's a good reliable vehicle.

 

Feel the wheels after running with the vibration. If one or two rear are hot, you might look into a stuck ebrake. Check if the ebrake mechanism under the driver’s side passenger seat under the truck. If it is corroded and stuck, it can cause vibration at certain speeds.

On my 2010 it started shaking at about 40 up to 55. Pumping the ebrake sometimes made it stop. I cleaned and lubricated the ebrake mechanism and the shaking stopped. Just an idea. Dealer couldn’t figure it out, I found it myself. Hot wheel was the clue.

 

I know you said 2wd, but is it lifted or modified in anyway other than the different tires and wheels? I also saw you said clean carfax, but still look under it for signs of repair. I think if it’s damaged and not reported to insurance, then the carfax will be clean. Look for any new parts or anything bent.

 

truck is bone stock, no mods at all. Just different wheels and tires, 4.6V8 SR model

I will check e-brake, but this truck although a 2018, it just hit 15K last week and I am in the South, don't get much corrosion here.

 

OK Tundras fam, just an update on the vibration issue that you guessed it, still ongoing. Haven't been able to post in a while, I lost my brother and my mother in law near each other and a couple other family members sick with the CHICOVID virus so it's been a tiring time. Additionally, the dealer had two separate shutdowns that happened due to CHICOVID which has stretched this out for awhile. So at this point of my last posting the following had been done:

-18x8" steel factory wheels and Michelin LTX M+S2 tires which were feathered, flat-spotted and cupped replaced with Helo 901 20x9 Alloys. model HE90129058918 which are hub centric, 110.50 bore, 5.71 backspace, 18MM offset. Vibration was present with factory steel wheels and Michelin tires, although different and not as bad as it is now.

-Beaman Toyota in Nashville has been the primary dealer who has been working on this issue

-They mounted, road forced balanced 4 LT275/55/20 10 ply E rated Falken Wildpeak AT tires. Vibration was still present and in some ways worse, so being they thought it was the LT 10 ply tires, they changed them out to 4 Yokohoma P275/55/20 XL rated tires, mounted and road forced, vibration was still present.

-The truck was taken to Titan Motoring in Nashville which is a customization shop that does a lot of work for stars, athletes, etc., in the Nashville area, well known and this is where the wheels came from. They went thru the truck, and dismounted the tires, checked the wheels and found 3 of the 4 wheels were higher in runout than what they liked so they involved Wheel Pros, the distributor for Helo and other major wheel manufacturers, and they replaced those 3 wheels. The Yokohoma's were re-mounted and road forced by Titan, when I picked up still had vibration issues

-Beaman Toyota then placed the wheels on their road force Hunter balancer, found 2 of the 4 Yokohoma's were out of round. Have no idea why they didn't catch this the first time they mounted/road forced, or why Titan didn't pick it up on their Hunter balancer either but they put the 2 good tires on the front and the 2 out of round on the back. For the 1st time I had no shimmy in the steering wheel. Due to COVID, there was no Yoko Geolander AT GO15's available in my size, so they went with Toyo and the only thing they could get was the Open Country M/T tires. Yeah I know a Mud Terrain, but I have ran them on my GMC's, and my Dodge, primarily the Mastercraft Courser MXT's and when Pep Boys Carried the Futura MT, which both the Mastercraft and Futura are both Cooper made, and NEVER had any vibration or ride issues. From everything I read the Toyo's are the BEST MT's on the market and were known for their quiet hum, smooth ride and most people got 45-55K out of them. So on went 4 LT275/55/20 D rated 8 ply and they were Road Forced and at this point the ride was the best it's ever been but vibration still present. I had to play with the air pressure daily from 35PSI to 55PSI and found 50.5PSI gave the best ride. I only adjusted air pressure on COLD tires when outside temp was between 55-60 degrees.

-Beaman Toyota then went thru the truck a 3rd time, checking suspension components, rack and pinion steering unit, shocks, steering components, driveline and transmission, one mechanic when he drove it stated he thought he felt the torque converter not letting go correctly between gear changes but the transmission didn't give off any codes. He dismissed that afterwards. They aligned the truck every time and the interesting thing is the right front was always a bit out which struck me as odd, and that feels like the main source of the vibration, although the dealer said everything is fine with that side of the front end. They put the truck on a frame rack and said frame is good.

-Beaman Toyota then decided to swap tires once again, and put a set of Goodyear Wrangler Trailrunner AT, P275/55/20 which were absolutely horrible and the shaking was the worse it has ever been, they sent the truck back to Titan Motoring and they found one tire had a bad hop in it, which makes me wonder why Beaman didn't see this when mounting the tires, but they replaced that one tire, road forced it and the vibration still the worse it has ever been. They stated to me they pulled a set of factory Toyota wheels and tires from a 2021 Tundra and put them on my truck and there was virtually no vibration at all, but I didn't get to drive to verify. Additionally there has been some question as to what they really done compared to what the dealer actually said. I have reasons and just things I seen along with recorded mileage that didn't match up to the amount of troubleshooting they said they did.

-Another interesting side note the Goodyear's used more weight to balance than ANY of the other tires, including the Toyo MT tires. So Beaman Toyota then remounted and road forced the Toyo Open Country MT's and once again, best ride but vibration still present.

-I then decided to take Toyota out of the picture for a minute and since we have been thru tires like cupcakes, which I felt wasn't the way to go, but played the game, I involved Toyo. Will have to say Michelin/BFG has the absolute best customer service I have ever dealt with followed by Bridgestone/ Firestone, but Toyo was a definite tie with Michelin/BFG. Wonderful service and follow up. SO the customer service agent set up for me to go to Discount Tire who she stated has the absolute best balance equipment of anyone, AND their techs are highly trained in tires and only tires.

-They did a rebalance and check of road force and found all 4 of the Toyo Open Country MT's were out of balance, all by 1.5-2.5 ounces on each tire, but here is the interesting thing...the road force

RF - 7 road force, almost unheard of in truck tires, especially a mud tire
RR - 15 road force, also excellent
LF - 63 road force, and the machine stated if the tire was matched on the rim would only lower to 62
LR - 35 road force, and the machine stated nothing would change if the tire was moved

-Discount Tire's cut off on out of round for truck tires is anything 35 and over. Toyota dealer told me their cut off was 25 and over on road force. They called Toyo and once again due to CHICOVID, tires are in short supply and the primary tires they are making are street tread tires, mild AT tires and LT rated street and AT heavy duty tires like Firestone Transforce tires. This was Toyo and Discount both saying this is priority supply for now. So, the only tires I had a choice of were Nitto Ridge Grappler's or Nitto Terra Grappler G2's. Toyo requested me go with the Terra Grappler G2's which both the Ridge Grappler's and Terra Grappler's are P metric tires, not LT, but was told the Terra Grappler's would ride better. This also begs the question as to why the out of round wasn't detected when Beaman Toyota mounted and road forced balanced these Toyo's two different occasions!!!

-Discount Tire unmounted the Toyo's, checked the wheels and said they spun absolutely true, mounted the Terra Grappler G2 P275/55/20's and road forced, and started with the yellow dot aligned with the valve stem (which was done every time on every set of tires listed above) and then all 4 had to be spun on the wheel when they forced matched them, then they got repeatability with both having a hub centric ring on the balancer and not. This resulted in the following

-RF 32 road force, 1oz of lead to balance
-RR 27 road force, 2.75oz of lead to balance
-LF 26 road force, .5oz of lead to balance
-LR 17 road force, 1oz of lead to balance

Drove the truck and guess what...ride was worse than with mud tires AGAIN!!!. Notified Toyo and Discount Tire, they have ordered a set of Toyo Open Country HT2's from a warehouse in Ohio, the only place within 1500 miles of the Discount Tire that had them due to the shortages, and that is Toyo and Discount Tire's last effort.

-The Discount Tire regional manager did state to me that Michelin tires are absolutely the best riding tire and typically the truest followed very closely by Continental and Pirelli, but typically with minor ride issues a set of Michelin's solve that. He said Toyo/Nitto, Bridgestone/Firestone, Cooper, BFG and Goodyear (hit or miss depending on model) all fall in together just below the other three. That is from his experience across managing multiple stores seeing ride issues, tire returns, etc.

-Regional manager of Discount Tire also stated Toyota Tundra's, Tacoma's Camry's are all very precise and very sensitive to road issues, and he has seen MANY MANY times if you take the truck out of factory configuration and using factory wheels and replacing with aftermarket, vibration and ride issues come up when installing the aftermarket wheels or changing tire sizes.

-Beaman Toyota has now refused to do anything further saying they can't keep assigning techs to look at it paying them without Toyota helping out covering their labor cost, even though the truck is under factory warranty AND said I must call Toyota and have a case opened.

So this is where everything is at. If anyone out there has any ideas, things to check, I would love to hear them. I am at a loss and just overly frustrated now. I am married with 4 kids from the oldest in college down to my 3 year old and this has taken a ton of time away from my family and I just want it fixed. My wife and I don't get a lot of nice things for us as we make that parental sacrifice for our kids, so when I finally saved enough to upgrade my 03 Dodge to this 18 Toyota, I was hoping for a very good, reliable truck that would last me awhile, but this has been a headache and nightmare to say the least.

Hope someone has ideas or thoughts!!

 

One thing I forgot to say above, Beaman Toyota did turn all 4 rotors on the axles to get the truest machining (according to them)

 

Tell Toyota what you've done and your finished wasting your time and want a different truck or your money back.

 

Man that’s frustrating and heartbreaking. I believe in Toyota wholeheartedly. But the fact is anything mechanical is prone to break or not work as intended regardless of brand. There is obviously a cause and fix. It isn’t unheard of to have lemon either. It wasn’t clear
To me if this was a used purchase from Toyota dealership, certified Toyota purchase, or random used car lot, or private party. If you don’t have the will to see it through, and I don’t blame you , there may be recourse depending on where purchased. At the least maybe even a trade in for a different model. Prices are good right now for sellers.

 

Just a thought.....not entirely sure it could be related. I had a similar feeling right after I took delivery of my 2019. And then started a metal noise from the rear wheel hub......turns out that my rear axle was “out of spec” from the factory. Apparently Toyota had a small bad batch of tundra rear axles (similar to the Tacoma issues). They brought in a regional field tech to diagnose, had calipers on it and laser measurements, etc. It was very involved but finally determined the rear axle was defective and replaced it under warranty. Absolutely no issues since

 

Here is one other tid bit of info...when you are traveling at low speeds, or in traffic and you slightly accelerate and then let off your gas or gently hit the brake, there is a "slap" noise like someone takes a ball peen hammer and taps the driveshaft, almost like the shaft is engaged, there is a brief moment of slack and it rengages again

 

That sounds like a TC or a transmission issue - and if I'm not mistaken you even said Toyota looked @ the TC but said "naah" because no codes showed up.

 

Like @Kung said, it could be a driveline issue. Have any of the mechanics tried putting the truck on a lift and in drive to see if it shakes? That would rule out tires, suspension, bearings if it did still shake off the ground.

 

I'd be taking a close look at the driveline. Condition of u-joints, driveshaft balance, and with what you just said I'm suspect of the rear diff too.

 

Do they have a lemon law in your state?, keep your paperwork and dates and tell them you want a new truck