Byrna Owners?

My wife refuses a personal CCW since we have three young, exploratory, and constantly hands-on daughters, but I am insisting on some form of protection beyond OC for when I'm not along. My hope is that the LE pistol is a respectful middle ground and an excellent training tool. Anyone with experience have some input?

 

No experience but I have some thoughts.

I think these are a gimmick meant to sucker in those who don't understand what a "lethal force threat" is.

Based on what little I know, Byrna is a CO2 powered paintball gun that launches ("fires" isn't the right word) pepper spray-filled paintballs. Pepper spray is not the response to someone with the means, opportunity, and intent to cause grave bodily harm or death.

10% of the population is immune to the effects of pepper spray. Those with experience can fight through it.

Limited capacity (7 rounds?), how fast is the reload? How much range we talking about? How durable? When pepper spray doesn't work the next step is lead. However, Byrna doesn't offer a "next step." Further, it's a least as big as a full-size 1911, maybe bigger.

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I have a female mowing customer that is fearful of an attack (crackheads be thick these days yo!) and she asked me about it. I went through the above and recommended her to carry a real firearm. WV did away with the tax on the right to carry a weapon. Training is available and there is an indoor gun range in town. I offered to give her what gun safety and lessons I could but recommended she take one of the local courses.

In your case....there are very good pistol safes these days...thumb print biometric even. Buy a few, mount them to things (walls, tables) and practice good weapon storage discipline. "Come home, pistol into safe, lock safe. When you go out, holster on body, open safe, weapon into holster." Teach your kids about guns. Take them shooting (eye and ear protection!). Them shooting removes the curiosity that leads them to learn the deadly way. Teach them gun safety so when they come across a gun at a friend's house, they don't end up with a hole in their head.

I carry a can of Sabre Red 1.4 percent MC as part of my daily loadout. I make sure my wife has it too and not in her purse, but weak side of her body. Every time she goes out.

 

Yeah, I bought one for her and have a bunch of comments about it. She doesn't want lethal force in her purse for the, now, four kids reason. No amount of what you said above will change her mind. For as much pro 2nd amendment one can come up with, there are just as many stats around accidents and misuse. We'll just keep it at that because ultimately you aren't arguing with me, you're arguing with her, and what you've said I already have, too. Our agreed middle ground is I can carry, but I'm obviously not with all the time.

So, back to the Byrna. We practiced using it a bunch and found it to be a reasonable middle ground for her. Bonus was she enjoyed shooting it. She has had a few run-ins where non-lethal would have likely been sufficient if it had come to that, but there has been one where it would not have. Fortunately, evasion was fine since they weren't the target of somebody's poor attempt of being tough.

I had the magazine stacked with alternating OC and solid balls for the 10% immune stat. But where we're at now, it sits near my desk waiting on me to design a 3D printed purse holster. She was using a pistol specific purse but then got a fancy, new purse and started using that one more. Putting the Byrna in the new purse results in it not being accessible, as well as the magazine release being hit or the safety being released. The 3DP purse holster would fix that issue, but what it won't fix was how often the OC balls would micro-crack from temperature differentials. I've had to clean the Byrna, I think, three times now. Let me tell you, I'm not one of the 10%, and that job SUCKS. Even trace powder amounts with nitrile gloves will get me agitated for 30mins or so. For that reason, I haven't pursued it too much more. The smart thing to do would be to knock out that design and stay diligent on swapping the OC balls within the stack, but honestly, it's just one of those things that gets pushed to the back-burner.

The upshot to carrying one of these is that there are a lot of situations in which it would be adequate. Also, the legal ramifications in our small city/county would mean she'd walk away from any usage unscathed. Our local enforcement was glad to hear hers was orange as that's what they use in the jails. The general way I look at it is that it's a means to deter and/or buy time for attention from others. It's by no means perfect, and it by no means replaces lead, but it has its spot. We just haven't made it work for us yet.

 

I wouldn't be "arguing" with her, I'd just be stating what I believe to be the facts of the matter.

I hadn't thought about "cleaning it" and how that might entail a burst or ruptured ball. I do know that if OC is deployed inside a structure, EVERYBODY is leaving the room/building. Local courthouse had it deployed during a trial when the defendant got sporty...HVAC sucked it up and the entire building (which is four or five stories tall) had to be evacuated. I'd like to have been there to see that!

An orange-painted one would be a benefit if she had it in-hand if police saw it in her hand....when the bad guy sees it, he'll be happy too but for different reasons. I'm sorry.

There are decontamination wipes one can get.....you didn't mention those so let me link you some.

Pepper Spray Antidote - Sudecon Wipes (singles) – Redhotpepperspray.com

 

I'm just going to ramble because there's more to all of this than just a pepper ball launcher. It's pretty evident that personal protection is going to be evolving for us.

One thing to note is some of our kids are young. Like, still can't rationalize, young. The idea of teaching them all gun safety isn't possible. Pairing that with parenting 2-on-4 (and a lot of times 1-on-4) is all zone defense, leads to a low confidence level for having a firearm anywhere other than on-body for her.

Which brings me to my next point, IWB holsters are fine for a typical adult's day, but not for someone who has to bend over 500x to grab stuff off the ground, pick up a kid 100x, crawl and play, or have kids constantly climbing over them. I tried it and even bought the supposed "best for comfort" - Tenicor. I tried to get in the habit, but I'm not sedentary, and it just doesn't work. I couldn't ask my wife to torture herself.

All of that led me to trying a man purse/sling, which I really like. I know, I know, it's off-body, but I've zip tied all zippers shut but the one which works for my practiced retrieval and added an extended handle to the open zipper to make the initial grab easy. The draw time is impressive. Where it really shines is making it a great means for family EDC needs. I have all of our vehicles outfitted with first aid but it is comforting now carrying one.

 

Do what you gotta do! Your challenges are different than mine and you have to do what works best for you. Self defense is an intensely personal matter and no one knows what's going to work for someone else or what they should do.

Wife currently carries in a bag she wears on the front of her body. It zips open quickly and has a holster in there for her revolver. I don't like it but women don't have the carry options men do. I have carried various ways over time but my current philosophy is "one hand draw, all the time." My left hand is for flashlight and pepper spray, right hand is for gun. No appendix carry for me as that's a two-handed draw.

I carry these ways: strong side outside-the-waistband, strong side pocket holster, and shoulder holster. All work for doing work since we, um, "do work." LOL We do odd jobs, landscaping, about anything you can imagine hiring a dummy to do.

I bought an IWB holster for that Walther PPQ I bought but need a thicker belt to use it. Its bigger trigger guard works with light gloves, which I have on a good deal each day, especially when weed eating. Right now, I have to notice potential threats approaching, stop, remove my gloves, see what's up.

I'm glad you are doing something (carrying in some manner). As a police friend once told me "the more good people carry guns, the safer the country."