Carrier bearing - odd wearing of rubber

Just wondering if anybody has seen anything that looked like this.

And a little background

When I first put my new tires and wheels on in February, it drove smooth as silk. There was a driveshaft related clunk at that time (ujoints/carrier bearing), but the truck drove smoothly at all speeds. Then I started developing some vibration and the carrier bearing needed to be replaced however, the previous machine shop had mangled the drive shaft. So I went with a reputable aftermarket driveshaft company that has been in business for 30 years that uses Spicer or equal quality U joints, and carrier bearings. 3 year warranty.

This took care of the clunk and most of the vibration. I assumed the rest was likely the tires just needing to be rebalanced, but they have rebalanced with only modest improvement

The driveshaft company has no problem warranting the carrier bearing but I feel like there's something else that play here

I should've put the driveshaft on myself, but I did let the shop do it because they were balancing the tires. Supposedly, they lined up the driveshaft appropriately using the alignment marks. However, I've lost so much confidence in automotive shops. I cannot guarantee it.


When I was under there yesterday, I noticed this odd wear pattern on the rubber portion around the carrier bearing. Noticed the top part has some discoloration. The bottom part is black, but the rubber appears to be being worn away

From what I've read A vibration can cause that rubber to wear out however, it's only on the bottom portion

and yes, the transmission bolts are secured

 

If you’re still noticing vibration on the truck it’s a possibility that they didn’t press the u joint properly/all the way evenly. This can cause vibration and uneven carrier bearing wear.

 

do you think that could cause the chafing of the rubber at the bottom? The vibration is only like a tire slightly out of balance

 

Axle wrap i would suspect, axle wrap pushing the pinion up, and driveshaft forward, which is making that rubber a sammich between the metal pieces.

 

that makes entirely too much sense.

also explains a clunk that I would occasionally get and a few other oddities

Still probably not the source of the vibration but something I need to address

i'll check the torque on the U-bolts and if they're all OK it's time for new springs anyway and to get rid of the 1 inch block

 

If you have lift blocks then you may need a carrier bearing drop:

https://www.tundras.com/threads/carrier-bearing-drop-question.99651/

 

I had wondered about the carrier bearing drop, but my block is only 1 inch. Is that still necessary for that small amount? I was hoping to postpone new leaf springs until I get new tires and decide if I am going with more lift in the front

I may be losing my mind, but I thought I remembered @shifty` or someone else saying they weren't necessary for that little bit of lift

also thinking back I believe this problem precedes using that block. so could the leaf springs have weakened that much over the years?

it probably explains why the carrier bearing has been replaced three times now over the last two years. I thought it was just that they use cheap parts or did yet get another job incorrectly

I had multiple sources of play, including the transmission mount bolts, U joints, and the carrier bearing, but once all those were corrected it, corrected most of the problem but there was still a clunk if you totally let off the gas at about 40-60mph for a second or two, and then hit the gas again

the response I got from one of the shops is well it is an 18-year-old truck. That really chapped my ass because that just meant they weren't willing to find the source of the play or looseness. But with all the other work I had done. I knew it had to be in the rear end. That's all that was left

 

He doesnt recommend blocks, ever, and usually tells people to pound sand when they ask about blocks, so i doubt he gave you anything positive to say about them.

Absolutely boss man, i have seen TONS of older toyotas have axle wrap, all the way down to 4cyl no power 2wd and 2wd pickups.

Now we're getting somewhere. You cant really see axle wrap on your own unless you are really good, but mounting a camera under your vehicle and taking a drive is the easiest way to make it happen. You might be surprised, the pinion can likely, and is most likely picking up 4+" when you get in the throttle and holding itself in an upward position until you reduce the load / get off the throttle.

Meh.... They dont know, they dont care, they fix the obvious sometimes, the rest of the time they are just guessing.

 

all answers on point and I agree. And thanks for all the feedback. It helps immensely.

yes, I know how shifty feels about blocks. He wasn't as vocal with me, but just pointed out if I was gonna tow a trailer I damn sure didn't need to use one because of axle wrap

 

I typically recommend ditching blocks out back, or as an interim solution, bullet below is from the megathread.

• For rear lifting, try to avoid using blocks (esp. if towing, axle wrap is bad mmmkay), consider an AAL (add-a-leaf) kit to get an extra 0.75" - 2.0" lift instead (*if* you don't need your overload leaf!), or many members have found a new ATS "HD" leaf pack was a very wallet-friendly way to get a solid, no-brainer 1.5" - 2" lift, part# 90-221HD for 4WD, 90-287HD for 2WD and it includes an overload leaf. WARNING: The Icon 51100
  $190 add-a-leaf kit for 1999-2021 toyota tundra - 21.5" short AAL set with isolator pads and square bend u-bolts
  add-a-leaf kit ONLY gives 1st Gen Tundras between 0.5" - 0.75" of lift IRL! The Wheeler's offroad kit is a better option for 1.5" (ish) of lift. NOTE: You should look into buying an LSPV relocation bracket unless you want a lesser braking experience after lifting.

The reality is, bigger packs are doing effectively what the blocks are doing, pushing the axle downward and/or the frame upward. The big difference being, you currently still have the old OEM packs out there which were probably already laying a little flat, and when you put them up on a pedestal like that, they can't handle the torsion of that rear end when you gun it.

Is that truly what's happening here? You're the first I've seen to have that weird wear on the carrier donut, though, so I hold an ounce of skepticism. Only way to know 100% would be watching it dyno while someone is cranking it, or to slap a GoPro or similar underneath to record the relationship between the driveshaft and carrier, bonus if it catches at least one side of the axle.

I don't think this is pinion angle related at all, you'd be feeling vibrations if it was. Axle wrap would make the most sense.

 

PS - I don't really think/know that a carrier drop would help in this case either. It may reduce the amount of rubbing, but if it is axle wrap as core issue, the only thing that'll correct that is swapping the block for AAL or new leaf packs. Anything to stiffen up the pack so they can't twist.

 

I am getting vibrations that I've been tracking down for months. It is just like a tire balance issue. It is fine from 0 to 40. From somewhere in the 40s up to about 65 to 70MPH you can almost always feel a vibration like classic tires out of balance. Above 70 it is very smooth again. I am/was prepared to do the road force balancing if needed



I bought a camera specifically for these types of issues. I just haven't had to use it yet but here's the perfect case

however it just makes too much sense with my history. I feel like the camera is only going to confirm

that clunk has been there for a long while. After multiple carrier bearing replacements, securing the transmission mount, etc. there was still a clunk between 40 and 70 mph. If you let off the gas for a few seconds then hit the gas again.

then there's the fact that I've had three different carrier bearings in three years The rubber was torn in the first two in the same place where this one is starting to wear


and the carrier bearing replacement 2 to 3 years ago was not the first. I believe it also got replaced somewhere around 200,000 miles And that was about the time when I first noticed the clunk

that's the good part about being the original owner. You know the history.

I guess all of this is to say, after what you posted, it sounds like even add a leaf is not the way I need to go. That is if I confirm Axle wrap is the culprit for my multiple issues. Which would most likely also confirm that that was the original cause of the big clunk that I've been dealing with for several years

 

that's what I was thinking as well. There appears to be plenty of clearance other than the source of the flex which I think will be axle wrap

sidenote: I use voice to text a lot on my phone, and it keeps wanting to put Axel Rap. I didn't think he ever rapped

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qx2gvHjNhQ0​

 

OK back on it after another medical hiatus

I finally got a video with my GoPro knock off. I'm sure I can get a better video with a different angle but if you watch the short clip, it's easier to see when I let off the gas after a hard acceleration.

I'm just focusing on the driveshaft and the pinion. I have to mount it on a different location to actually check for the axle wrap, but you can see the movement in the leaf spring toward the cab

I know there's gonna be some movement but does this seem excessive?

From my quick reading it seems like it could be and it would certainly explain the clunk if the timing is just right when you let off the accelerator on the interstate or around 50 and then get back on the gas


https://youtu.be/uysPj8RetQE?si=QWMv8VA2Amd4SIba

 

Axle definitely wrapping, and pay close attention to the driver leaf pack i nthe video when you gun it, see how it's flexing beyond horizontal to the ground?

If you're seeing wear where the rubber donut on your carrier is making contact, that's likely the cause. Remind me, original leaf packs? How many miles if so?

I was taught anything under 4-5° with leaf packs is tolerable but half that or less is ideal. I don't have any experience with the 1st gen Tundra on the topic though.

 

original leaf packs and now I'm up to almost 318,000 miles. And it's an 06 so it's soon going to hit its 19th birthday

yes I noticed that on the leaf springs, but didn't realize it was going beyond horizontal. That can't be good

if it's for sure those leaf springs I've got no problem for replacing them because I wanted to get rid of the 1 inch block. I had that was never supposed to be permanent. That was just temporary until I was certain how much lift I needed

I think you mentioned a good leaf pack that wasn't add a leaf.

i'm still a little bit torn on ultimately how much lift I want. It's perfect for my 32s right now but I might go with aftermarket UCA's when I get new tires so that I can get a little bit more beef with a higher profile tire


I guess if I had to choose right now I would say I want at least an inch and a half of lift overstock.

 

the majority of axle wrap i've seen in the past is at take-off, like 1-2mph tipping into the throttle. There is more torque applied thru the driveline in 1st gear, and to get the vehicle moving takes the most power to change and increase the inertia of the vehicle thats standing still. Almost always, you see axle wrap the worst at take-off and tipping into the throttle at slow speeds.

 

That makes me think this is probably excessive then because I was going about 45 so I could cause it to downshift hard and then I let off before I hit 55


So if what you say is true, then it probably has excessive wrap from a dead stop

i'll probably try to go back and get better videos now that I'm getting a little familiar with this camera

 

Recently bought my truck, has a rough country lift with 2" blocks in rear and 300k miles.
I replaced the OEM center support bearing a few weeks ago, it had similar wear on the rubber. I replaced it with an oreillys one with a bunch of 1 star ratings, and it's already gone to shreds, worse than the OEM. (Pictures r upside down. Wear is on bottom, not top.)
Put on a replacement oreillys one again last night, but have a Spicer coming next week when I'll also delete the lift kit.
I'm hoping just removing the lift kit and new shocks will keep it from wearing out again. But it'd be cool to see what's going on under there.
What did you use to film that?

 

A poor man's Gopro off of Amazon

Apexcam or Hiicam. I think they're the same thing with different branding About 50 bucks

 

I needed a carrier bearing drop on my 2016 when I lifted the rear one inch. It is pretty common that a Tundra needs a carrier bearing drop with any lift in the rear.

 

Ultimately I did the same, I got this Brave combo pack with everything you need to get recording (SD card, mounts, etc) that's supposed to be the closest you can get to the GoPro for $139 during Black Friday a year or two ago. But I see at www.camelcamelcamel.com (scAmazon historical price tracker) that it regularly dips to $139 for this specific package.

$180 AKASO Brave 7 Action Camera 4K30FPS 20MP with 64GB U3 MicroSDXC Memory Card, Waterproof Camera with Touch Screen IPX8 33FT EIS 2.0 Zoom Support External Mic Voice Control with 2X 1350mAh Batteries

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CD6WNBGQ

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