Irrigation experts

My irrigation issue has become larger than expected.. as water continues to leak out slower... it seems to settle at a certain level, but a leak is a leak...

Call me lazy, but I don't really want to raise the bricks laid down... My gardner is probably 2 levels above me in experience, but he rerouted my previous leak to a much slower leak and did mention cutting up some brick sections. Well I found a separate leak on the otherside, closer the house. My assumption is that it follows the water main closely inward before it L's into my current water well. So, my current plan is to dig into that side of the house and add 3 separate cut off valves for the 3 irrigation lines sistered all the way because I'm tired of getting nagged at about shutting the water main off for hours on end because failures tend to delay everything. It's posted on home improvement btw.... a 2 hour job turned to a full 14 hour job with multiple failures and trips to home depot and lowes. Lol

My question, can I theoretically push a 10 foot PVC pipe through a hole in the ground, while pushing out the old PVC pipe? I think I have enough space to push it through at a slight angle. Its about 7 inches deep? Or should I just cut up the ground and do it the professional way??

It is a 15 foot section at the minimum, so my plan would be to add a joint with a 2 foot pipe to the old one while joining it with the 10 footer and pushing it through to the other side and rejoining it with the elbow to the original pipping.. Will probably need to invest in hiring a company to replace the entire system in the near future. Or DIY over the next 3 to 4 years. Will probably more shut off valves, maybe unnecessary. Any thoughts??

 

I been around a lot of PVC.. it’s brittle, and becomes more brittle with age. I think your only chance is attaching the new to the old and pulling vs pushing. But to be honest I don’t see any easy way without some luck! Hopefully it’s the black flexible pipe, then you may be able to pull it with some serious equipment.

If it were me I’d call 811 before you dig, prep/mark the route surfaces and have a pro come in with a Ditch Witch VP30 or similar and drag the new lines. You can then dig down and make the connections, shut offs etc, map it and document the connections for future reference, leaks will occasionally occur at the joints.

 

I was thinking about pulling vs pushing.. My theory of pulling would be like 6 inches at a time, befor clipping at that point and time.
Gas lines were pre-marked and are at the opposite end of the house. RACE communications have been tagging lines as well due to them digging around for their lines. Someone did use conduit PVC to join it over a T-line, and that's what really failed... the PVC is old though.. I'm sure I'll be replacing more pieces with time. Will be pushing through mud. Will post more images tomorrow.

 

Only 15'. I would dig up both ends, cut the pipe. Pull the pipe out (might require a winch) with a bull line attached to the tail end to pull the next pipe thru.. Then hydraulic (using pressurized water to bore its way) a 1-1 1/4" (with bull line attached) Pvc pipe in its place, to use for a sleeve for a 3/4" pipe.

 

That's a good idea, my thought was a block on the PVC end to push out the old line... Like a train, or in this case subway.. or linemen pulling cable, and I've seen the use a reverse winch? Pushing cable through conduit of course...


For ocular pleassure. This is how far I need to go. It's straight across. Water self levels and hasn't risen, making me think that under pressure, sprinklers on, water escapes. It has stayed at this level since yesterday... or, water is going elsewhere... which is worrying..



My thought process is to add shut off valves by the house's water main. In the meantime I will add a shut off valve prior to the elbow, so I could turn the water on in the house. They will need to be staggered because they're on top of each other. Be advised very rough draft

 

Additionally this happened right after a slight quake.. A 3. Something..

 

Damn.. At least it’s pavers vs concrete! Not a lot of room to work!

 

Man... I have a separate flood at the irrigation control valve.. but that's been a while... That is under concrete... valves don't do anything closed or open. Not sure what they're for...

 

The plot thickens.. it's all gonna have to come up.. Any one seen this before?? Googls image search ir's a possible purge valve


Not sure what kind of Mickey mouse bs I'm about to get myself into.. but this line goes up and towards my other water well.. I've drained this a few times and it comes back to about the same level or just below.. it's not refilling right away, but about an hour or more after it's drained.. While I was l digging air bubbles were coming from this direction.

I have a new plan brewing, but figured I'd ask if this was possibly normal?? Water well use to house a rose bush. Got watered 1 to 2x a day, its no longer there, it resides in the backyard.
This other puddle is just there, stable.

 

Well, the plot thickens even more... went from chocolate thickness to full on tar... The black tip on my previous post up there ^^^^^ is actually a sprinkler head that someone closed via cement topping....

Since water started creeping through a brick I have started chiseling at the mortar to lift up these bricks, I'm thinking 6x6 should be enough, but it's all probably gonna have to come up, but I'll start with 1 and follow the lines from there and replace pretty much all of them once there and remove the non-operational ones while mapping my new maze. Gardner swung by Saturday after I texted him 3 weeks ago about adding a shutoff valve so I could work without turning off the water from the street. I even bought all kinds of parts and left them out, so that he could add them but nothing was done and everything was left untouched. I incorrectly assumed that this dude would do the work, since I'm 2 months into I'll pull the plant and plug the leak. Either way, gardener swung by Saturday and assisted me in finding the water main and we traced it to the 1st irrigation station. We found the junction from the 1in copper line to the 3/4in PVC line. Once he found a shut off valve he turned it 'off' and said to let it dry up and was done and dipped.... I let it be as well and when I walked out about an hour later water had filled up all trenches. I sent him a text and as of yet has not responded, now I do understand this is my responsibility and problem not his, but he should mind that I may just follow Cali guidelines and go full desert planting and he be out of a job, which may end up being the case anyway.

After doing some DIY youtube research I gave in and called a plumber yesterday and had them come out to install a shut off valve. Since I have water seeping pretty much out of everywhere, plumber ignored my explanation and stated the shut off valve that was previously 'closed' is now rusted open...
Now, I have 2 explanations, and I did explain what was done, but plumber came really unprepared and just visually inspected and set me up with another appointment.
1) Per Gardener which is probably the one cuz I was standing there while we were digging, 2 water mains comes out by the house 1 to the house and a 2nd one 90's out toward the front irrigation station. No shut off valve just straight up approx 10ft copper pipe into PVC pipping.
2) Per Plumber, I had a second water main that comes directly up from the ground into the 1st irrigation station and T's to multiple stations.

Plumber and gardener will be back Wednesday at different times... Plumber will vacuum up water and give me a better estimate on what needs to be done. I just need a shut off valve so I can isolate the yard from the house in case of a leak I can always turn that main on for irrigation purposes and close it once it's complete instead of leaking for months on end as I am now. I will add some ocular pleasure once I'm out of work.

 

So, I have questions...




I took a coworker's advise and went the DIY shut off valve route, but I may have a problem...
As pictured above, I added a shut iff valve sharkbute type as a bandaid to my sprinkler problem. Soldering a copper pipe is better, but I'll learn how then do.

Well I turned off the sharkbite shut off in orange, house shut off valve in green on, water main on.

No leaks no issues, cool, fantastic. Went to turn on the faucets outside the garage to clean up, no water.. Asked my kid to check the house faucets, same, no water.
Turned on the sharkbite, water comes on???

 

Sharkbites are a great way to fix plumping in a hurry. The problem is they are only allowed in areas of direct access. Any copper joint in direct burial needs to be brazed or silver soldered. Also, burial pipes need to be encapsulated in 6" of sand on all sides to prevent stress during compaction. Poly pipe is the best underground piping due to its resistance to whatever might happen, except digging. Copper will break down with certain chemicals in the soil.

 

Did your sprinklers work with orange valve closed? This will tell you if the system is tied in before or after the valve. I see your pressure regulator right there. You sure there isn't a T buried under there that feeds the irrigation system?

 

Sorry, i thought this was waterhose enthusiast chatter, not water wasting tomfoolery.

 

Either way none of this is good.

 

Gotta dig deeper to find that T- off... when I turned the orange shutnoff valve off the house water was off the irrigation was still on, so this is tied back in to the house..
Plumber came out and shut off the sprinklers, but the water keeps coming... so, I'm assuming the line goes to the kitchen. Reason being overnight water builds up at the front. Only thing that runs at night is the dishwasher. Only time I see a bigger puddle is in the morning when I leave for work. All other times it appears to remain still and leveled. Checked the water meter and it appears to not move.

 

It's starting to appear that its not my leak, but the real question is where is my main??

I'm still leaking with the water closed at the city meter... I'll call it drainage, but it consistently fills up to the same spot every 2 hours or so, meter states 0.00gpm water is crystal clear.

My gardener and I picked up about 6 inches by 2 feet of porch pavement this weekend. We Thought it would be about 4 inches of concrete, well we found ourselves with a full on 8 inches, but we found more pipes, but most importantly no leak nor air hissing...

Not sure what Mickey Mouse was done prior, but water comes from the backyard to the house. We figured the T line was under the path, so my gardener added a shut off valve to the 3/4 line going out to what appeared to be the backyard irrigation line. While we sat and consider our currently life choices, we couldn't help but notice how crystal clear the water was that was refilling the current water wells we have open, but the city line was shut off. At this moment he asked if the neighbor had a pool and I said yeah, they do. So this may be his pool leaking into the front of my property.

We both figured I'd bring the plumber back to get an official/professional word on where the water may be coming from since this is nothing to play around with. We left the shut off valve closed turned on the water at the city and he left for the day. As I spoke to the wife about everything, she convinced me to go and talk to the neighbors about the issue. While I considered it, I decided to go. Well long story short while I spoke to them about the issue my newly repaired water line burst... While we walked back to my property I didn't have a case since my water was erupting from 1 area, they had a contractor working for them and they chalked it up to solely my problem. I accepted my fate at that time and apologized for the unnecessary stress on them. Well I decided to repair the water line with a new piping similar to what the gardener did. I waited 30 minutes before turning on the water, once I did, it burst immediately, so I decided to cap the line and deal with it later. Once I walked inside, there was no water. So I decided to S curve it into the line so it wouldn't stress it as much. Well it worked for about and hour with full water pressure. Took the kids for a city drive to clear our minds, came back turned the water on and went inside the house. Washed my hands in the bathroom and sat with my kid for a minute when my wife said there is no water. I walked outside and sure enough it had burst again. Called the gardener this time and he came out to verify his repair had failed, again. Well he reapplied concrete and drilled a small hole, coated the screw with blue glue and screwed it on again. He stated it's an emergency repair and so far has held for 2 days, but I've only opened the water line at the halfway point. I'm bringing the plumber back out to find both the main and the leak. Since I can't get right at this point.

That main line to the house now has 3 shut off valves by trial and error. This morning the water was disturbed, it was murky and muddied, I had showered probably 30 minutes prior to me leaving the house, which leads me to believe it is my problem again. I took a sample in a jar and will be taking it to Leslie's Pool Supply to test the water.

 

TLDR ^^^^^ w pics
Water cometh with city water off
Neighbor has pool, may be leaking, he sits higher than me by about 5 feet. Pool water pump and pool aligned with where water issue is.
Talked to neighbor waterline burst. Total 4 times. Gardener assisted in screwing in a screw for retention. Will call plumber for verification.


appears to be residue in water here, this is new, after talking to neighbor they shut off pool water pump

 

Additionally, Saturday night their pump was shut off and my water was turned off and I had 0 fill in water. There was some water towards the bottom once I emptied all wells, but once they were convinced on Sunday that it wasn't their problem their water pump was turned back on and now, I have water again. I turned on my water on Sunday morning and a few hours later it was refilled as the last pictures shows. Once my pipes are pressurized my meter still states 0.00gpm and water continues to come in with either water on or off. I don't understand what is really going on, my only place to point at is the neighbors at the moment.

Testing things, I ran my washer machine and stood by the door and watched these puddles not do anything, once the machine was done with the fill sequence, I waited for the drain sequence, and I once again stood by the door until the rinse and drain was complete. Water didn't move or do anything whatsoever. No surge, no burp no nothing.

 

It's my water main.. 2 weeks ago I cut off all irrigation plumbing and water kept rising. 4 days ago water started streaming out alot faster and is now detecting 1.1gpm.. I started digging trying to intercept this main and have had 0 luck in finding this main. Dug a trench 2 feet deep and about 3 feet wide about the size of the water meter..... Nothing here.. As the guy said, no se ve ni verga.. lol


Began digging outside the water meter and it twists right outside the box towards the driveway. Assuming the big ass tree, I eradicated last year, had burst the original line so it was rerouted. The wife didn't want more holes so I hired some people. Told them everything I knew and wanted so that they wouldn't be blindsided when they couldn't find the pipe.

Dirt is hard packed, and I've had a couple convos with them about the hard packed dirt which I was upfront about... The trenchbI dug took me a good 4 hours since I had a variety of thick ass roots to cut off..

I was going to rent a trencher cuz fuck this right here... And I've had multiple failures in repairing this leak... So, the wife said hire people.

Plumbers were between 6 to 12 grand. Trencher is about 300 a day for a 2 foot trencher plus my time. Guy named a price at a grand... I said sold... so another gardener swung by andnsaid work is double.... So I'm like a deal is a deal, or you can work until you want, but I'm not paying what we agreed... plus side, found the sewer line... lol.. never knew where it was since in Nor Cal it was right next to the water meter, but not this one.
Never liked micromanaging, but gotta make sure my well isn't poisoned.

 

Lmao, So much shit going on when something goes sideways I just laugh at this point... The wife is super annoyed that I do, but I mean it's my turn to eat shit and die. Lol..

 

Water main was replaced and I was so close to it, literally about an inch and a half from digging it up, but I gave in and brought people out.. Water has stopped leaking out and everything appears to be functioning properly. My gardener is tying up older irrigation pipes, cuz he wants to keep his job, after I told him, it wasn't my priority at the moment due to fall and winter coming. Instead of opening new trenches, we're using older pipes, for now.

 

"no se ve ni verga"