Starter, battery or something else.

07 5.7 280K+

OK, here goes I'm starting to get an extremely slow and no start on initial start of the day. Teaching my youngest how to drive and he held the key just a little too long. I usually tap and go. Since then I'm having a hard time starting. It does have a loud click then nothing. Will wind up slowly and give loud clicks like the battery is dying, but will ultimately start. Haven't tested the battery yet, but may swap it to my SC to compare if I'm having the same issue. May have a damaged negative post on battery

No engine mods only 18 Sequoia LED headlights.

 

How old is the battery? I’ve been running an AGM in my tundra for 7 or 8 years and it would seem to turn a little slower in the morning, but it was winter and it was cold outside, but for a couple of days, the first start would be a little slower than normal. Last year, I parked the truck and turned off the motor but left the radio on to finish up a phone call. After about 10 minutes, the radio started behaving strangely and then the sound cut out. I turned the key off then back on to start and got nothing but ‘click’. I let it sit for 20 or 30 minutes and it mustered up enough energy for one more VERY SLOW crank to start. Headed to the parts store for another battery and zero issue since.

But a multimeter is your friend here. Measure the voltage at the battery before the first start of the day (or at least a couple hours since the vehicle has been run). Should be around 12v. Have somebody turn the key while you continue to measure the voltage. It will drop to about 11v and start. If it drops to 9v or less, it’s on it’s way out. If it successfully starts, turn it back off and measure voltage. Then wait another hour or so and see if drops. 11v or less resting is a pretty dead battery.

You can also use the same method I used - leave the radio on for a while and see if the battery craps out. You should easily have over 90 minutes reserve energy with a healthy battery, so 30 minute shouldn’t make a dent.

 

That may be the issue... It's been my daily until my rear brake issue, to which I turned my SC into the daily and it has been relegated to back up duties. Negative post was damaged by yours trully about 6 months ago while dealing with the radiator replacement. I was starting to figure I did a shitty job soldering the red wire on the headlights causing the issue.
Damaged post on Optima on the base, it's slighly separated.. Probably the longest serving battery I've ever had, 5 years.

 

That would do it - at least enough for me suspect it. I had a loose post on a vehicle once. The post itself, not just the mount. It would intermittently click but voltage read good most of the time. I popped the hood to make sure the terminals were tight and while jiggling the terminal, I discovered the post itself was moving. Thought it was the weirdest thing, but it would still work most of the time. Then I remembered that I’d jumped the vehicle… a couple times… on purpose… and I didn’t have a battery hood down. Kids these days… I replaced it and all was well.

 

That slightly separated post could cause CCA capacity to decrease.

 

Yeah post has been separated a while. Just pushed it down and was good. Negative clamp is down and tight... But I'll be swapping the battery out.
Thanks for the input

 

Final update on this.... After 5 tries to get this truck to start yesterday morning I decided it was time to let the battery go. I swapped in the 24F standard battery from my SC and dropped the Optima yellow top at my local Costco for an Interstate regular battery, the Optima had calcium build up underneath the negative posts so it was beyond due. Truck starts like a charm first time every time. I only expect to get 2 years from this battery due to previous experience, but I didn't know I needed to order the AGM battery online, so lesson learned, although these batteries have lasted in my Celica and SC through storms as the older batteries just died, along with my Optima.

 

Optima batteries used to be good but many have noted not so much past few years. The only group 27F AGM is the X2 and it’s overpriced. Just get a 24F AGM and be done with it. The have same CCA as 27F flooded batteries.

 

100% Agree... I noticed this back in 2009 when I went through 3 of them, I placed the blame on the truck as I was going through batteries quicker than a xbox gamer's AA batteries. When I talked to the base's auto hobby shop manager, he stated that the Optima's were intolerable to heat, anything excessive to 90 degrees outside temperature their use was greatly reduced, he had a stack of them just sitting in a corner since he was replacing all the golf cart batteries with regular ones.. At the time I went through a red top and 2 yellow tops that the local stealership went halfies with since I couldn't keep a Toyota battery more than 3 weeks before needing a new one.

 

Bringing this topic up. I'm having similar issues with a battery that is maybe 1 yr old. Die Hard 27F-3, 710CCA.
When it's in the low 30s in the morning the car hesitates a lot and slow crank (have not measured voltage drop). The batty voltage dropped to 8.1V this afternoon but it was 55F at lunch time.
Should I replace the battery with warranty and get another one with more CCA? Or is this just a bad battery?

 

8.1 cranking volts - I would replace it.

 

Replace it. It will only get worse, and will probably strand you somewhere you don't want to be in the dark

 

This is what I would like to do. Went to Advance Auto and they tested the battery and said it was good. The battery is less than 1 yr old. It looks like I may need to fight this with them to replace the battery under warranty.
What is the normal voltage drop I should expect during cranking?
The stock battery lasted 5 years and never had this issue in the winter.

 

Do you have a Flex Fuel truck? If so, check the OBD2 for the fuel ethanol level. I just had mine fixed under warranty and they had to update the software and replace the fuel pump. Mine had the specific issue of only the first cold start of the day being difficult.

 

I no longer ask to test it, I usually take it in another car and put it on their counter and be like its dead, I need a new one. I have a difference of opinion on stock batteries, I went through 9 in 18 months and the service department knew me by name.. We went halfies on an Optima and I still killed 2 under warranty and they only do 1 warranty exchange, next one is out of pocket.

 

I will do that. I'm way out of warranty though.

Will go to the store and tell them this is not normal and give me a new one.

 

Optima is not the company they used to be ever since they were bought by Johnson production was moved to Mexico and changes were made in their materials in order to cut costs while increasing their prices

 

Agreed, the red top on my MR2 had been there for about a decade before it died under the hood of my Tundra.

 

With an obd2 reader you can find the fuel alcohol level reading in the computer. If it’s high, like close to 85%, then that’s likely what’s causing the difficult cold start. With Techstream at least the value can be cleared/reset as a periodic/temporary fix.

 

I went to the store today and a guy that had more experience came out and ran the full test on the starting system. He said everything checked out but the "starter" came in as "check".
At first he was saying that it could be bad fuel since the car is cranking but having a hard time starting. When the test finished the scanner showed the starter as not OK and needs attenstion.
Truck is a 2018 with 95k miles. I did some looking today and changing the starter seems very involved.

What are the thoughts that the starter is the issue?
I added the video from this morning. It was 40F

https://eddie98.smugmug.com/Other/Misc-Bike-Pics/i-5tZhgvs/A

 

You were correct, they cleared/calibrated the alcohol density, needed new plugs and induction service and now it's like new.
Thanks for your info.