General Supercharger Thread

It was. But when I went to put things together, there were slight differences between his list and what I ended up with not fitting right.

His list didn't provide part numbers, just descriptions. So I ordered what I thought was right at the time.

 

Ordered both, ty

 

You don't need both...the first was if you were to change over to dual feel/dual return using fuel injection hose, the second was if you're replacing the stock feed/return hardlines with braided lines and connecting directly to the fuel basket top hat.

Honestly, the AN braided lines are a PITA to make if you don't have the correct tools, try the y-adapter and fuel injection hose method and check results. That way you can return all the other stuff, and not be out a bunch of $$.

As far as the fuel pump wiring, I did it for three reasons:
1. To bypass the fuel pump ECU that adjusts voltage based on engine load % (my theory on why fuel pressure drops at high RPM, not confirmed by anyone)
2. To change my fuel pump trigger-on to another source to prevent extended cranking (helped, but not ideal)
3. To ensure the pump has dedicated wiring that doesn't limit it's abilities (probably overkill, but more for peace of mind)

 

I found a voltage drop calculator and put in some basic numbers:
http://wiresizecalculator.net/calculators/voltagedrop.htm

Voltage drop for 25amp load on 10 feet of 10ga dedicated wiring (My setup)


Voltage drop for 25amp load on 10 feet of 14ga wiring (If wiring was dedicated)


But wiring from the relay goes past the fuel basket to the Fuel pump ECU, then back to the basket so it’s more like 14-ish feet (stock wiring length)

 

If this is near correct it's significant.

 

That's what I thought as well, but it's also interesting how it's grounded. Not sure why Toyota didn't just ground it to the frame near the Fuel pump ECU, but it runs back to the engine bay. The fuel pump grounds to the Fuel pump ECU, which grounds to A4, which is the passenger-side inner fender of the engine bay!

 

Looking at the data chart, I think the Walbro 450 only draws 17 amps at 60psi, not 25 is one difference in the calculation. The output voltage when running is also closer to 14v than 12v, and the higher the voltage the less voltage drop is a concern. Are we also 100% sure the stock wiring is 14 gauge, as that’s really only good for 15 amps and can’t safely support a 450.

Electric Motors don’t do less work (less flow) with less voltage, they always try to do the same amount of work. They are rated in Watts, 746 watts = 1HP, and watts is Volts X Amps. (Power factor and efficiency left out for simplicity). If the voltage drops, the motor still does the same work but it will draw higher amps to do so (which in turn also increases heat).

Take the DW340 for example, at 50 psi it draws 12.3 amps at 13.5V. Say there is a 10% voltage drop to 12.15volts. It is a 166 watt pump. 166 watts / 12.15 volts = 13.66amps after the voltage drop. Same flow, but a higher amp draw.

Edit: One thing worth nothing also with at least regular motors (these fuel pumps don’t seem to follow the exact same rules as regular motors) if voltage is above nameplate rating and not below, that can also cause the amp draw to go up just like voltage below nameplate does. In that scenario it’s not higher voltage leading to lower amp draw, it’s too high of voltage leading to higher amp draw. One difference with these pumps seems to be they have a huge nameplate operating range that is acceptable for voltage of 6 to 18v in the case of the DW pump. Normally motors are +\- 10% of nameplate is acceptable. Things don’t track with conventional knowledge it seems. I guess bottom line is as long as you’re getting the flow you need at a given voltage and PSI, and are below the amp rating of the wire and rest of the circuit then you’re good.

 

I need to measure the wires to be certain, but here is the connector and required terminals/seals:

https://www.bmotorsports.com/shop/product_info.php/xrf/gshp/products_id/4285

 

Evening gents, here is what I have. No loose, leaking nor burst hoses. All looks close to as it was when I put it together as I remember.

 

I was thinking, what if I used both pumps? Is that possible and if so how & also since I got the Aeromotive filter do I leave the sock off?

 

You wouldn't want both running at the same time all the time, it would heat up the fuel, so you would need to stage them. That, and you would need to decide how to get them connected together (y-adapter in tank, or out of tank), whether you need a check valve to prevent backflow into the staged pump, how to get it out of the tank to the rails. The fuel basket top connections are limited to 5/16" and will be a restriction, as well as the stock hard lines, but you already have enough braided line to replace them. What I did is overkill, but I like modding/tinkering and coming up with over the top solutions.

Twin TiAuto 267 pumps mounted together:


Top -6AN feeds and -6AN return as well as wiring:

 

Ok, that's out, I'm pushing it as far as I currently am. So, based on the lack of burst/loose hoses do I put back the possibly defective 450 or use the 300? I am going to run the wire, the Walbro electrical connector seems to have larger gauge wire, am I wrong?

 

If you are running the dedicated wiring, stick with the 450. Larger than the stock pump in-tank wiring? It looks slightly larger on the bench, definitely stiffer, need to bust out the micrometer and see what's what. Could be a difference in the insulation thickness as well, so would need to strip and measure the strands to be sure.

 

So you don't think it's bad? Dropping the tank was easier this time, I see how M3 got it down but I really don't want to go for a third.

Thanks

 

I don't think so, I think it's a power supply issue. One thing I noticed, looking at your pictures...you have a ptfe hose connected to another ptfe hose going to the radium venturi? It doesn't need to be at the bottom of the basket, might be losing return pressure there affecting the venturi's efficiency.

 

But I've been wrong before...

 

I'm replacing the PTFE with rubber. I did that to use the oem hose, but it's coming out.

 

Boost and cats don't go well together. Less than 800 miles on the setup and I left the front two at an intersection.

 

Wow, how many miles since SC install? Any damage/exhaust holes, or did it all just come down the pipe and out?

 

Only ~800 miles since the install. No damage to the exhaust and the secondary cats looked good inside despite all that coming out the tail pipes

 

Does it sound better now? Was thinking I’d like to delete my rear cats and save them for when the front eventually blow out. I bet it would liven up the TRD duals.

Sorry they’re shot already, that’s unbelievable they went that quickly. Do you do a lot of long hard pulls? I’m at 60k on the truck and 13k boosted at this point, a good percentage of which is pulling my TT.

 

That's insane!!! And I run my tune at 10.5:1 AFR and have enrichment kick in right when the truck makes any boost and it's been fine for tens of thousands of miles. Wonder if those cats were lemons to begin with?

 

I think your issue is the corrugated weird stock tubing with the clamps. That's my theory. Course kind of hard to prove that, but I think you have pressure escaping there and it's not creating a good seal.

 

2 of these are here & going in.

 

It sounds a little louder now.. think I'm gonna get headers, delete cats, and get some kinda muffler that has a deep low rumble and keep the trd duals. My obnoxiously loud exhaust days are over and that's why I attempted to keep the oem exhaust. No DEQ in my area. Usually for pulls, I'll play around from 20-80. Haven't put it into the triple digits yet

I'll see high 9's occasionally, but usually low to mid 10's similar to you. My luck I guess!!

 

Along with the venturi input, I made two ball check valves to allow more fuel to get into the basket, with minimal leakage.

 

Rebuilt the pump basket with Gates submersible hose. Am I ok? & how long do I want the hose coming out of the Radium Venturi?

 

I started to build a full system, I have a 450 pump and 750 injectors already, I think I'm just going to order the Pro speed system with fuel rails.

 

Looks good, the radium just needs enough hose to get out of the bucket