Gas tank roll-over valve stuck causes hard fuelling - anyone else?

I am not getting anywhere with Toyota about an issue with my Tundra, so I thought I would post about it, and hopefully get some opinions.

I bought my 2016 SR5 TRD with 66,000kms (41K miles) a year ago, and its always been hard to fuel. I now have 75,000 kms ( 46.6K miles), Sometimes it's literally seconds between having the pump click and starting over and over again, extremely frustrating and it leads to lots of overflows.

Due to the constant over-filling of fuel, the carbon canister failed and I replaced it, but the filling problem continued. It took several cycles, but I finally found that the roll-over value in the fill spout of the fuel tank itself gets stuck closed when the tank is fully filled, and then blocks the flow of fuel after that while fuelling. It took several months (and several tank fulls) to isolate the exact problem. I can manually open the value with a pick after removing the filler hose, and then it fills up fine.

On this forum, I found this issue is not isolated, and found a thread where 6 separate Tundra owners (3rd Gen trucks) had filling issues that were diagnosed as a problem with filling due to the rollover valve being blocked. Out of those, it appears 4 had tanks replaced under warranty, and the remaining two did not provide an update as of yet. One owner was told they see at least 2 trucks a year with this issue.

The issue is not just inconvenient and unsafe (given it often leads to fuel overflows), it impacts the emissions system on the truck.

Oh, the roll-over valve cannot be purchased separately, it requires a new tank (the 38 gallon one), which is $$$$ - which is why I am pursuing Toyota.

Ok, so I contacted Toyota service and their support lines several times, the conversations go like this:

Conversation 1:
ME -> Hi, I have an issue with my Tundra, it appears the tank on my truck has an issue and was defective, is there any warranty support?
TOTOTA -> We totally support our customers, offer a substantial warranty, and are very sympathetic to your issue. You are beyond the warranty period, go away.

Conversation 2:
ME -> Hi, I have found a defect with my tank that is impacting my ability to fuel the truck, and it's been this way since I bought it. Given this also ruined the carbon canister which I replaced at my own cost, it's probably been overflowing since new, I cannot prove it but you can if you contact the previous customer. What support can I get from Toyota?
TOYOTA -> We totally support our customers, offer a substantial warranty, and are very sympathetic to your issue. You are beyond the warranty period, go away.

Conversation 3:
ME -> Hi, we talked about my defective tank. I suggest this will impact my emissions system again. and I know there is a fair amount of discretion and good will available with warranty claims, and given the evidence that this issue is not isolated, can cause fuel overflows which are unsafe, and directly impacts the emissions system, I continue to ask to replace the fuel tank under warranty, in this case the emissions warranty. To do my part, I will absorb the cost of replacing the carbon canister.
TOYOTA -> We totally support our customers, offer a substantial warranty, and are very sympathetic to your issue. However, you are beyond the warranty period, we will not offer any support. Go away.

This is my first Toyota truck, and while I acknowledge that I am beyond the standard warranty, they are offering me zero support, I mean nothing. Maybe I was under the illusion they support their customers and care about their reputation, but I guess not.

I have more steps planned to take it much higher in the organization, it's clear that the support people are just told to say no, and they do it well.

I think this fuelling problem is a lot wider than I initially thought, and while searching through the net this issue keeps coming up, but it usually blamed on the carbon canister being plugged. I am suggesting that a defective roll-over value can both cause hard fuelling and eventually ruin the carbon canister.

While Toyota will not own up the problem given the potential liabilities, you figure they would offer to help in some way, not just state the warranty is up.

What do you guys think?

Cheers

Mike

 

You are out of your warranty period, please go away.

 

Exactly ... and I would agree that I am on the hook for most items on the truck, but now I need to pay for a new gas tank because Toyota screwed up on manufacturing the tank? It looks like it's a $1000 bill just for the parts before shipping. I have had other brands of trucks, and bought into the Tundra due to its reputation of quality, pretty disappointed so far.

 

My 2016 GMC was a PITA to fuel, constantly clicking, stopping, starting...you had to fiddle with it the entire time, everytime you got gas. Never bothered to figure out why, it was the least of that trucks many issues. Traded it and moved on. I am not a fan of these "sealed nonservicable" systems in new vehicles. 2015 Rav4 has a sealed transmission....componet fails (like TQ converter) entire $5k unit is replaced. Its becoming the norm across all manufactures unfortunately.

 

Truth is most Tundras fill up with no drama. Good luck and I hope you fix it but when you buy used you get the good with the bad.

 

Not sure if this will help but it might be worth a call... https://www.partrequest.com/auto-pa...lon-fits-2007-2016-tundra-243681-263881407509

 

Feel entitled much?

 

I would comb the forums for some kind of alternate/cheaper fix...maybe somebody has figured it out. Lot of smart yota folks on the forums.

 

Find out if the PO took it in for this issue during warranty. That’s probably your only chance. If not, I’m not really sure what you want. When the warranty ends... it ends. My wife’s car does this and I know how frustrating it is.

 

If you feel that this is a safety issue then you should contact NHTSA - National Highway Traffic Safety Administration and discuss it with them. If they agree that there is a safety issue then they will work with you and Toyota and possibly have Toyota issue a TSB or even a recall. Your chances of this happening are slim, but I have seen it happen for a motorcycle wiring issue that was pursued this way. You have nothing to lose by trying.

 

Is this valve right inside the filler neck? If you can easily open it with a pick with no other problems this is what my cheap ass would do if it's out of warranty. Is this part defective from the factory or is this something that can happen at anytime?

 

I think this isssue is so remote Toyota won’t even touch it. Things go wrong on vehicles. They are mechanical devices after all.
If you think this diminishes Toyota’s “reliability” rep then trade that bad boy in and see how trouble free the big 3 will be.
Not trying to be a jerk but what’s with people thinking Toyota should stand by every problem that arises when youre out of warranty? Do you think Ford would help you out when your turbo smokes after warranty? Even if they issued a TSB for this you’re still screwed as once the warranty is up they don’t honor TSBs.
Good luck. I hope you are able to find a solution but I’m pretty sure it won’t be free from Toyota.

 

I agree with you that the chance of Toyota fixing this for free is slim, but I think you are wrong about TSBs. My wife's Highlander has been repaired for TSB issues for free long after the normal warranty had expired. The TSBs themselves each have an expiration, but that expiration is not the same as the normal warranty expiration.

 

Ok. I’ve been wrong many times before.

 

But, I’m not wrong this time @Geezer. You must have just had a good dealer.

http://toyota.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/7656

 

Holy mother of narratives.

 

How many large corporations are going to fix a single, isoloted problem after the warranty has expired? What exactly are you expecting? Did you say anything to the dealer at which you bought the truck? Did you buy it with at least a 30 day warranty from whomever sold it or "as-is"? If this disappoints you, so will every other manufacturer...

 

Yeah, I'm thinking I would use a little tight-azz squarehead ingenuity to discover the perfect tool to do a "laparoscopic hemorrhoidectomy" on that sumbeach...Sawsall on a stick?. Government is supposed to HELP people...Ha!

 

@baguafan
is it only on the 38 gln tanks that it's an issue? i upgraded to a 38 gln last year and now i'm having fueling issues. no check light, no warning. just went to fill the other day and can't.

 

Nuclear, I am going through this right now. I am currently 1100 miles from home and sitting at Toyota right now. The service tech told me the filler tube is bent (not sure how that happens). First Toyota said that it’s not covered under warranty but I raised hell since I have 26k miles on the truck and Toyota is doing the right thing and replacing the entire tank. I went back to grab some stuff from the truck since the family is on Vaca and I talk to the guy working on the issue and he said that there is no way to bend the filler neck. And this is the 3rd tank he has replaced and it only seems to happen on the 38 gln tank.

if your truck is still under warranty I would definitely have mr Toyota check it out.

 

i can guarantee it's not a bend filler neck as my old 26 gallon tank works just fine. no warranty for me..my truck is a 2012 that i modified to add the 38 gallon tank sucks that yours happened on a trip, but glad they are taking care of it.

 

Yeah it was not a bent filler neck!

it sure added to the adventure of the trip .

 

This same thing happened to me. I am a second owner and was 2 months out of warranty. I went to about 6 different gas stations and same thing. I could only trickle gas in.

I took it to a dealership and low and behold, they had no problem filling the tank. Something must have been stuck, but knock on wood, this hasn’t happened since.

I can’t really see by your receipt, but what did they end up replacing? Is that the whole tank?

 

Yes they replaced the whole thing, apparently the filler neck and tank are one sealed unit. Kinda crazy since the tank and all is $1400, all said and done with labor I would have been charged $2250 ;( thank god I was under warranty.

 

Usually this is caused by the tube inside the filler neck. Yes, a vent tube inside the neck. I have replaced or repaired many fuel tanks. 99 percent of the time a hard fueling issue is the tube is kinked or collapsed or trash in it. I would pull the filler neck out and check it for a tube to allow the vapors to escape while fueling.

 

the filler neck is not part of the tank. there's a hose connecting it to the tank. the fuel vent valve is part of the tank and that's what sticks on these tanks.

 

That makes sense, i did find it odd that Toyota said it was one sealed unit. I did ask if they could change just the fill neck and they said no.

 

Witch one is the fuel vent valve?

 

Is the transfer flow 46 gallon tank less expensive than the 38 OEM? I think if this happened to mine, i might look in to that.

 

they end up being about the same price by the time you figure adding the strap and crossmember for the oem