Crank and No Start: Facts and Assumptions (with vid)

Hello all-

I'm sorry to sign up just to ask a question but after spending countless time on the web, talking to a few shops and other stuff I figured to stop by here.

Issue: crank and no start

Facts (may or may not apply):

- 2016 Tundra, 88k miles, owned for 3 years
- Battery replaced along with alternator about 2 months ago
- regular service always performed at 5k miles
- Aftermarket AFE filter (not oiled), regular maintenance completed
- will crank and not start between 1-3 times before finally turning over
- frequency of this has increased from non-existent (first 2.5 years) to occasional to quite often
- this has only happened at my house (8500 ft) or higher elevations (high country, 9-10k feet)
- this happens on the first start attempt in the morning, or if sitting all day in a lot (while on the slopes)
- this DOES NOT happen in town (Denver) at lower elevations. I have left the truck sitting at the airport in freezing or subzero temps for days or even 2 weeks at a time, it has always fired up with no hesitation the very first time.
- I have tried using different keys to start it (I read something about the chip going bad), same result

Assumptions:

- Elevation has something to do with it? I have no idea

At this point I'm ready to make an appointment with the dealer but wondered if anyone had any insight.

Thanks in advance

 

Yea it was an impulse move on my part, had it tested at an OReilly and the guy said alt showed bad. I'm like ok then, so I bought an alternator and battery and tossed it on. Battery was one from OReilly, even had it tested after at a Napa and the CCA's were good to go.

The puzzle to me is why it won't start at higher elevations but down in town it never has an issue, even after sitting for days.

 

I have a 2015 and have experienced this about 6 times in 4 years. Its unnerving when it happens. There seems to be no rhyme or reason. It will crank, and crank and crank, and not start. As if it's not getting spark or fuel. It will sometimes happen 2 or 3 times in a row during each of these events and then all is fine for many months.

The only thing I can suspect, is that it is the anti theft system, possibly not getting a good signal from the ignition key or something.

I used to think it was my remote start transponder until i read on this forum of other people having identical issue, that is nearly impossible to nail down. It doesnt happen with nearly enough frequency to bring it to the dealer.

When this happens i check for codes, there have never been any stored or pending codes. If it is happening to you more often, travel with your second key. When this happens, switch to your second key as a test.

 

Exactly what I was thinking. Try throwing in a gel based battery like an Optima may help...

 

It's not battery related. The vehicle cranks completely normal, very strong. It behaves like its not getting ignition or fuel. A weak or dying battery would be obvious (imo).

 

Have you verified that spark, and fuel pressure and volume are present during the no start?
I don't want to assume you have...

 

Are you Flex fuel?

 

My issue with not starting was barely corroded battery terminals. Seems this truck must be very finicky with the slightest corrosion.

 

I have not, good idea. I think I'll try to upload a video

 

THIS^^^^

 

All three Toyotas that I have, have problems with the battery terminals corroding quickly. Battery terminal protectant or any type of grease did not stop it. I installed those $2 red and green felt washers in combination with battery terminal grease. The corrosion has never come back. I always thought they were a gimmick, but they freaking work.

 

Ok I uploaded this vid my 'tube channel, unlisted so it's not out there on blast.



The first section: you'll see me remote start my truck in the airport parking garage after sitting for like 6 days in the cold. Fires right up.
Second: The next morning at the house, around 8300 ft....self explanatory. This (today) morning it took 4 tries to get it going.

And yes...I live in the mountains off a few miles of dirt roads. The truck stays nasty, interior covered in German Shepherd hair. I do get it fully detailed once a year. LOL

**again, this happens NEVER in town, only at higher elevations** So weird

 

Hows the MAF sensor? Air is thinner at elevation, might have something to do with it.

 

Have you checked the fuel pressure? Maybe the fuel pump is going bad.

 

That’s exactly what my truck does. It isn’t the battery. It’s intermittent. It has to be security cutting off spark or fuel.

 

Here is what I would do.

Carry spare key - check spare key.
Check all connections around air intake for leaks.
Clean MAF sensor.
Carry portable jump-box, after first no-start, hookup jump box to confirm it’s not battery related.

All of those are very easy.

You can check fuel pump by having someone hammer on gas tank while trying to start.

I’m honestly leaning towards battery. Which even though I know is new, can still be shit and give issues. Intermittently. I went through 2 new Optimas that were shit.
I know it sounds like it cranks strong, I just wouldn’t weed this out because of that reason.
And exactly what @15whtrd said, throughout all my Toyota’s connection can be an issue. I do the same as him, the red/green discs along with gel.
Subscribed for outcome. Hope you figure it out OP.

When I had the 2 Optima battery issues in my 4runner, it started exactly like yours did. I didn’t think twice about a shit Optima. That fucker was $300 and brand new - good as gold.
Yea, NO. After countless hours of chasing shit down I kicked myself in the ass.
3rd Optima worked like a charm.

 

Does it ever not crank when you are using your remote starter? This has a bypass for the anti theft so could help you narrow it down.

 

^ It has happened using both for mine.

 

Just to see what similarities you guys have. Are either of you flex fuel?

 

Is this a flex fuel truck?

There have been cases that the truck engine thinks its running E85, but regular is in the tank. Causes some weird issues with starting and running

 

Do you unplug the battery before you unplug ear MAF sensor to clean it? Do you also clean the throttlebody at the same time? And is there any relearn procedure after pushing the in the throttlebody butterfly around after cleaning?

 

Thank you kind sir. Im at 25k and thinking its time for a little preventive maintenance on the MAF. I always trust your judgment as you have a great track record lol.

 

Updates.

I had my battery tested yesterday, over 700 CCA's and good to go (apparently). Yesterday morning, took 3 tries to start it. Yesterday afternoon at Loveland ski area after sitting around 5 hours...took 4 tries to start it.

This morning I pulled the MAF Sensor and cleaned it with some air sensor spray. Fired up first time, it did briefly stumble but it was good to go with no big smoke coming from the exhaust. Will monitor over the next few days and keep everyone posted.

 

Was this at the elevation you've previously had trouble with?