Wheel and Tire Weights

Quick question as I am building my wheel and tire setup. 18” wheels with 35 by 12.5 tires. What do you think the limit is as far as weight goes for the combo per corner? Thanks.

 

There not a limit on weights. If a tire doesn't balance, reindex it on the wheel and rebalance.

 

What I meant was ideal for fuel economy/size. These wheels are 41lbs plus 75lbs for a tire. Any one know what a stock 18 with tire weighs for comparison?

 

The factory wheels are 31lb each (TRD Off Road) or 27 lb each (BBS forged TRD Pro). I don't know about the other 18" OEM Tundra wheels.

The stock Michelin tires are 41 lbs each. So you're looking at 72 lb for the stock tire on the stock TRD Off Road rim.

Your truck is going to be noticeably more sluggish off the line, and you'll take a substantial MPG hit if you go to 116 lb per corner.

I went from 72 lb per corner to 92 lb (forged BBS wheel @ 27 lb and 285/75R18 Duratrac @ 65 lb). I notice a bit of a loss of acceleration.

 

Gotcha. As mention, your mpgs are about to take a big hit with that much weight.

 

Yes stock steel 18” is 38lbs, 31lbs alloy, 28lbs forged. 17” Rock warriors without the ring is 21lbs. FN BFDs 18” 22-24lbs. Most 18” wheels though are on the high 30s though due to having more bling on them/not forged.

Then stock tires at size 255/70r18 is 38lbs while the 275 variant is 41lbs as stated above. So a normal SR5 was usually 76lbs a corner and higher trims low 70s.

A jump to 116lbs a corner would feel like having half a pallet of concrete bags in the bed constantly. That’s why people will use lower weight wheels like FN BFD or BBS to offset some weight. Avoiding load E will keep the tire weight down, like there are 35s (315/70r17 for example) that are 60lbs, thus when paired with light wheels are very close to stock weight. Vehicles like the TRX and Bronco use new lightweight load D or C 35s to retain performance which are about 55lbs.

 

very good insight. I am going to look to shave weight with the tires for sure as you mentioned. The wheels I am looking at now are about 34lbs. So adding a lighter weight 35” or 315 tire in the 60lbs would put me at 94ish lbs. that’s roughly 18-20lbs more per corner.

 

Going to 35s you aren't going to get anything that resembles good fuel economy. Not just for the weight of the wheels/tires, but also because of the aerodynamics. If you mod anything related to wheels, tires, or suspension on the Tundra you will be paying for it at the pump.

 

point taken. I did find the Nitto Terra grappler g2 tires that are 295/70/18 that are about 34.3” diameter. They weight 51lbs. With the fuel covert wheel that is 34lbs that comes to 85lbs total. Thoughts?

 

Lighter will most likely be better, but if you want a rabbit hole you can look into the rolling resistance of tires. I've not gone down that rabbit hole, but it will have an impact as well.

 

I read about rolling resistance on tire rack for a bit. Seems like the smaller/lighter the tire (less ply) the less rolling resistance it has. So this Terra grappler g2 should be a good fit since it is more of a highway tire that looks like an a/t tire.

 

He'll be more sluggish because it's geared higher. The weight increase will contribute a little but not much.

Mpg will depend on what he's taking off and putting on. Thick AT tread, beefy sidewalls, and weight will tend to make it worse, but... rolling resistance due to hysteresis is the biggest factor... and that is a crap shoot. My tires actually do better than the stock Bridgestones, which is great. Others that look and weigh about the same could do a lot worse.

 

I've spent some time researching that... and I used to test bicycle tires for rolling resistance. Hysteresis (the energy absorbed by the tire when it deforms) is the main factor, and can vary widely between tires that have the similar specs. Unfortunately no one tests truck tires for this. One of the better proxies when looking at similar tires is the speed rating. This is how fast the tire can go with a full load before it overheats... and they heat up because of hysteresis.

These are 325/65r18 (fat 35s) and are D load, T speed rated, only 65 lbs... and I bet they get better MPG than any AT of similar size. I don't need tires yet, but since the ones I have are no longer made, I want to see some feedback on these.

https://www.discounttire.com/buy-tires/goodyear-wrangler-territory-at/p/101610

The photos are wrong BTW, this size looks like this:

 

The TSS 20" wheels weigh 41 lbs each

 

Interesting. I hadn't thought to try and gauge hysteresis by speed rating; I alway assumed that had to do with rubber compound and ply construction being able to deal with and/or dissipate the heat generated by speed. But you may be on to something.

It is nice to see the advancements in tire tech over the last 10 or 15 years. I recall reading an article in an off-road magazine years ago about macro vs micro-keying on tread blocks. They used the example of an AT vs MT from the same tire MFG on some granite and slick rock, noting that the AT excelled at visually smoother rocks due to it's ability to micro-key with it's smaller sipes and grooves rather than the big clumsy paddles of the MT. Thinking an AT would do better than an MT in the rocks sounded like blasphemy at the time.

I also happened across a similar article about siping and how it was formerly mostly used for winter tires to create more biting edges in the snow an ice, but that it is now being used by some MFG's to combat hysteresis. The article showed that allowing smaller tread blocks to deform by small amounts could create a better rolling resistance profile than larger tread blocks deforming the carcass. The smaller deformities allowed for a the heat to be dissipated by the tread, which was constantly exposed to the air, rather than by the carcass which seemed to hold the heat longer; as well, the smaller deformations created less heat overall due to the smaller deflection. I might have to look for the article but I think it was published in a print magazine - the kind that you held with your hands and fingers and never ran out of batteries.

 

I have not had much luck with Goodyear tires but these Goodyear A/T tires look great. The lugs on them look perfect for digging through mud. I will check them out when I wear out the A/T tires I have on my Tundra now.

 

The Territory AT and MT (MT stands for maximum traction, not "mud terrain") are pretty new. They might not be very good... user reviews are mixed. In the 325/65r18 size the AT has the same tread as the MT; really everything looks identical. In other sizes the AT has a very mild tread. The MT comes in a 315/70r17 size that is only C load rated and 52 lbs which is pretty crazy for a tire this size (34.4" tall).

$255+ Goodyear Wrangler Territory MT Tires

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tire...wcB:G:s&s_kwcid=AL!3756!3!!!!x!!&gclsrc=aw.ds

Here is a review on the MT:
https://youtu.be/1QPVzwmjmAU

 

I just got my wheels balanced and aligned and it stii vibrates at around 65 70 mph .they tell me it was off by 2 oz. I want to go back and have them redo it

 

In addition to the weight, you are also going taller and wider... all of those are going to have a negative impact on performance and fuel economy.

 

Nope.

 

Weight is just one piece of many in this puzzle. Turning a larger wheel, aero on a larger tire, increased ride height, more aggressive tread are just some of the factors.

 

Larger diameter and width both tend to reduce rolling resistance. Aero drag probably goes up, though.

 

Went from the stock Platinum setup 20x8 wheel (38lbs) and 265/60R20 tire (38lbs) to Weld 20x9 +20 wheels (33lbs) and SL285/60R20 Toyo AT3 tires (48lbs). Basically I went with a super light 20" wheel and the biggest AT tire I could find in standard load to keep the weight down.

So stock 76lbs --> 81lbs per corner... and the effects are much more than I anticipated. It does feel slightly sluggish accelerating and decelerating compared to stock but MPG took a big hit from 18.3MPG --> 16.5MPG. That was more of a drop than I expected for only adding 5lbs per corner. I think going from 265 to 285 is the main culprit - there's a lot more rubber in contact with the road.

All that said, it looks awesome and rides smooth and if I had to do it all over again I'd do the exact same thing.

 

How did you determine this, and when was the lift done? What was the original tire?

A wider tire has a shorter contact patch, resulting in less casing distortion and lower rolling resistance. So it ain't that...

 

^ 2" RC N3 leveling struts were installed at the same time as the wheels and tires.

 

^Answer to the other 2 questions?

 

Original tire was the stock Yoko Geolander 265/60R20. MPG on the trip computer went from 18.3 down to 16.5 after the wheels, tires, and level install.

Check out my posts (there are 2 in a row) in the Wheels and Tire thread for full details.
https://www.tundras.com/threads/gen...res-photo-thread.101215/page-180#post-3863462
https://www.tundras.com/threads/gen...res-photo-thread.101215/page-180#post-3863463

 

^If you didn't correct for tire size, then 16.5 is really 17.0.

It's tough to tell with any accuracy just driving around, since conditions can change quite a bit. If it's the same route, traffic, idling time, etc... then it should be a good ballpark, but I'd give it more time I think. Your new tires should be pretty good for MPG. I think the speed rating is the best proxy we have for rolling resistance, when comparing similar tires.

BTW, you said in another post that you were running 42psi, but that seems high to me. The new tires would need less than the old ones.

 

Road tripping from Sarasota, FL to Duck, NC and back in a few weeks and mpg will be one thing to keep my eye on. It's been 95% city driving with the new shoes over the last 3 months.

 

I think I'm going to go SL for now. About to pull the trigger on the 285/60R20 Toyo AT3s in SL... however... anyone have any thoughts on these? Toyo Open Country A/T III EV ... these are SL as well in a 275/65R20. so 34"s ... slighly taller, slightly thinner, slightly lighter. Does anyone have an explanation as to what the EV really means or pros/cons of one vs. the other?