Rack and Pinion

Morning,

Gotten to the point where I have a lot of play in the steering wheel & my bellows are getting full of fluid, so it's time to get a new rack and pinion.

Anyone have any suggestions for which one off rockauto? And while I'm there should I change the lines?

Here's the choices.



I know some of you will say go OEM, but it's about 2.5-3x the price vs rockauto.

Thank you guys.

Here's a picture of my truck in exchange.

 

I have used Cardone new not their reman version and it was great, looked and performed like oem. I believe it is a lifetime warranty as well.

 

Appreciate that. I'll look into it.

Additionally, I guess I should have looked around a bit more before posting this thread, as I found this link on this forum:
https://fr33lancefab.com/products/first-gen-tundra-sequoia-steering-rack
$550 is not as bad as the other OEM prices I was seeing. Then again, a few hundred bucks extra by buying one on rockauto would be nice too.

 

Most racks are the same it all comes down to New or Reman, That one just seems to have poly bushings installed and seems like a steep price for just that. You can even get a price on toyota remans but even those are not the same quality they use to be.

 

Nice to know, thanks for the heads up. Do you recommend changing the lines while I'm there, or is that being overly cautious?

 

If they are pretty rusty I would. The nut tends to seize to the lines at the rack. I usually will cut the lines and replace them at the same time. But if you can try and get a 17mm wrench on them first and see if the nuts spins separate. If it does your in good shape.

 

"Lot of play in steering" -> This is a typical symptom we've heard from people just before LBJ failure. When was the last time you replaced your LBJs, and did you make the big mistake of using aftermarket LBJ?

What condition are your rack bushings in? Sluggish/sloppy steering is indicative of rack bushing fail as well.

Looking at the list, I don't see a single brand that has done me well in the last few decades. But folks have had solid luck with Detroit on here. At those prices, I almost feel like buying OEM non-reman is a better option. At least you know you won't be doing the job again for another 15-20yrs.

 

I haven't had any trouble out of my Detroit Axle steering rack I put on my truck.

 

I did the rack on my 4Runner 5 years back. Looked at all the options. $650 for a Toyota piece, made the most sense. It came with new inner tie rods, everything else would have needed those. Zero problems since.

 

Hey,
I've had the truck for a little over a year but spent a lot of time on YouTube and this forum learning about it. LBJs were done with all OEM hardware and thread locker not too long ago.

Here's a short list of the maintenance in that time. Went with Bilstein 4600 & Dobinson springs, more or less stock height. Only issue I'm having now is a very small water leak on A pillar, trickling down near the fuse box and onto the carpet. And of course the steering rack.

Noted about the brands. I'll check out Detroit axle. Thanks.

 

A+ on maintenance list.

That A-Pillar leak ... typical. If you don't have insight on where that's coming from, holler. We've a lot of experience with that one, and have plenty of threads showing what happens if you don't fix it (pics & pics & pics of the end result). Get it taken care of before you become of those three people.

Couple of questions on the steering thing.

When you say the steering feels "sloppy", what do you mean? Do you mean there's a delay in engagement? Or it physically feels "spongey" or loose if you jerk the wheel back and forth while driving under 30mph? Or maybe it feels "wandery" when you jerk the wheel back and forth at speeds above 45-55mph? Just curious.

On the bellows leak, do you just see the bottom half of the bellows is stained? Or do you see literal fluid pooling up and drilling out of the bellows? Are you losing fluid at a notable rate? Seals are old if you have a factory rack, and if you haven't applied new fluid in a minute, I doubt there's any seal conditioners remaining in the fluid.

I had a leak in my driver side bellows, bottom half was stained. I applied some

$15 AT-205 Re-Seal Stops Leaks, 8 Ounce Bottle

AT-205 in the power steering reservoir. I can't tell if it worked, but the staining seems to be less-fresh looking.

 

The issue of steering is minor, truck still drives fine, I just want to tackle the problem before it gets worse. By play I'm referring to a lot of looseness in the wheel, but maybe that's common to these trucks. It's most noticeable at low speeds. An alignment shop told me there's a slight delay when moving steering wheel vs the wheels turning, but I haven't noticed that.
The bellows become wet within the last few months. Driver side has significantly less, but it is very slowly dripping whereas I don't see any drip on the passenger side. I've kept an eye on the PS fluid while cold and haven't noticed any reduction as of yet. I could try a stop leak fluid, my concern was moreso giving the truck what it needs vs a temporary fix.

 

"Temporary fix". Let's get into that for a sec.

All oils, whether it's the ATF transmission fluid our power steering rack uses or the motor oil we put in the crankcase, include some form of additive package. Those additives are formulated for different purposes, some add lubricity/slipperiness, some add rubber conditioners to replenish your seals, some add detergents to help breakdown buildup of deposits, there are tons of different types of additives, and all additive 'packages' bundled with various oils are different. All oils have a lifespan, and they only have so much additive to give over time, before the additive package is depleted. If this were not the case, and oils didn't breakdown and lose their properties/additives, we'd never change our oils.

To that point, if you don't know the last time the ATF in your power steering pump/rack/reservoir was changed - and mind you, the answer to when it was last changed may be "NEVER" - then you may've gone years now, or even more than a decade, without the additives your seals need to avoid shrinking up. Rubbers shrink. It's a fact of life. If the seals aren't physically damaged, i.e. torn or shredded, then why replace the entire rack that's leaking due to diminished additives not conditioning your seals, when the solution is as simple as introducing a non-swelling seal conditioner that is essentially what oil companies include in their additive package, and letting it cycle through the system, and rejuvenate the seals in the rack?

Don't get me wrong. I don't advocate for 'fix in a bottle' solutions. I know they'll get you by and all. And there are a LOT of products on the market that are intended as stop-gap fixes and contain stuff that will over-swell seals and gaskets as a means to shore up significant leaks until you can, say, replace a faulty/leaky part. People abuse them. There are also products, like ATP's

$15 AT-205 Re-Seal Stops Leaks, 8 Ounce Bottle

AT-205 which is sold at many/most local chain auto parts stores that, when added in the amounts shown (I think it's 1oz of product per quart of oil?), will refresh the seal conditioning additives and help restore the seals to their original size/shape/state, without over-swelling.

Ultimately, if it were me, before I spent $300+ on a new rack and a couple hours to install it, I'd rather ...

• Pick up a jug of quality ATF, I prefer Valvoline Maxlife, and a bottle of AT-205
• Flush the power steering system using a known-good process
• Apply the new ATF, should be around 3qts total
• Apply 3oz of AT-205 (if it was 3qts of ATF)
• Clean the bellows thoroughly with degreaser
• Drive around for a few hundred miles, clean the bellows again (if oil still showing)
• Drive around for a few hundred more miles

If you find there is still oil dripping from the bellows after that, then sure, change the rack. If not, the problem was just the seals inside the rack weren't getting the nutrition they needed.

 

Noted! I had heard bad things about using stop leak fluid and as a result of that, got a preconceived notion that it was a bandaid fix. I was jumping the gun on replacing the steering rack, I appreciate the advice, this is the first vehicle I'm working on myself so I'm learning as I go.

Will do on flushing the power steering system and applying a bit of

$15 AT-205 Re-Seal Stops Leaks, 8 Ounce Bottle

AT-205. Thanks again.

 

In general, avoid "stop leak" stuff. There's a time and a place.

Like, I wouldn't want to use any stop-leak product you put into your coolant system to stop leaks. Typically speaking, those products are acting as a clotting agent. Sometimes, like with head gasket sealers for example, they're formulated in a certain way to make sure they only solidify in conditions that would occur in the vicinity of a head gasket leak, i.e. where they interact with oil and/or combustion, and 'should' only solidify in those cases. But in general, who is to say that's the only place they'll solidify? Last thing you want, especially with coolant passage or oil passage, is to risk blocking up a critical artery passing fluids around because the product you used reacted exactly how it was engineered, but in the wrong place, you know?

ATP, as a product, claims it's a basic, gentle seal reconditioner that won't overswell. I've had good experience with it shoring up a cam seal leak. I've seen plenty of people talk it up elsewhere over the last 20 years of internet forums being pretty popular, for fixing guide seals, rear main seals, rack seals, and other seals. My personal first-hand experience with the product has been good. Others haven't had the positive results I have with the same product. but as of yet, nobody has reported catastrophic results.

Granted, this is just my 2¢. I'm sure someone out there has an argument to be made against what I'm saying.

 

DIY. https://www.directv.com/guide/EPISO...-Rebuild-225eceb0-f186-cb43-ebb3-b6d790d646f5

 

I'd go with what shifty said