One thing after another

Hang in there, you just eliminated a ton of stuff by doing that swap.

If you were up in there doing the heater core and condenser you were right in there where the ECM lives, you may have even had to remove it? I would double check all the connections and those harnesses.

 

I already looked at it and checked the connections. It was on my shop’s work bench wrapped in an anti static bag and than placed in a padded container incase of being dropped.

 

It would definitely be different diagnosing many problems if you’re deaf. I’m glad your son can work with you.

A short story, about 8 years ago i had an absolutely terrible headache and a really high temperature (i think it was around 105 degrees) for a few days. It was super duper painful and i lost about 95% of my hearing. Like if someone was standing in front of me and talking to me, i could barely hear any noise. Eventually i went to the ER and they gave me some medication so that i could kick whatever i had. The worst part about losing my hearing was that when i was working in my shop, i would never be able to hear when i dropped any small part or tool on the ground. That is what scared me the most. I’m not normally a big talker, so i wasn’t too concerned about not having conversations with people ever again. Eventually i got more and more of my hearing back, but it took probably 3 or 4 months. I didn’t get 100% of it back though. Probably closer to 75~80%. I consider myself fortunate to get that much back. I did loose a few tiny parts on the floor of my shop during those couple months though.

 

If I drop something my service dog ( German wirehair pointer) gets it for me or paws at me to let me know I dropped something. I don’t have anything to compare to with hearing. It’s been a way of life for me. I was very very young when I lost my hearing, so I don’t know what a thing, person, or animal sounds like. I can feel vibrations and feel the sound waves in a sense. I’ve learned to sign, to read lips which I’m not very good at, but it’s great to watch people and snoop! I have overcome my dyslexia and try to read the CC but I’m not the fast.

IM JUST SICK OF TRYING TO DIAGNOSE MY PROBLEM. If I disconnect the maf sensor the truck dies. If everything is hooked up my idle speed is way above normal. It just doesn’t make sense to me

 

When idle abnormality is involved, I’ve nearly always found a leak, or a sensor (for EFI engines specifically!). Sometimes it can be a valve, like some vehicles have IAC valve (idle air control) that’ll fail or crack which I don’t believe our trucks have. Although there is a MAP sensor which, if bad, and sending invalid sensor data to the ECU, could cause high or low idle. We do have the power steering air control valve whose sole purpose is to kick up the idle when engaged, it’s the round valve with two vacuum hoses sticking vertically out the top just above the power steering pump. When the truck is idling high, you can try pinching the vacuum hoses to see if the idle normalizes AND you can try joining the hoses together to see if idle normalizes to test the other direction (since I don’t recall if standard operation is valve-open or valve-closed!! But this valve DOES fail!).

I’ve been locked in on wiring just because you had the connector/wiring issue there and this issue and codes seems to be related.

Just to confirm, 3 pages in so I’ve forgotten, did you replace the MAF in this case?

What’s the part number on your ECU? Should be printed in large numbers, hyphenated, 10 digit, like #####-#####. I suppose there is a possibility it’s the ECU. But realistically, the likelihood is, it’s what I wrote in the first paragraph of this reply or somehow related to the connection you modified (if the problem started immediately after that repair).

 

If you remove the hose from the back of the PSV and fluid drips out, that's a definite fail too and imo easier to check than the pinch test, but doing both is best. Mine had fluid all the way up the hose and combusting out the tail pipe on start ups.
Didn't cause any idle issues for me though.

Removing my engine temp sensor did cause a CRAZY idle where I could barely move the truck.
I had a failed sensor and the truck ran ok despite it. But when I disconnected it entirely (removing any sensor data feeding to computer) the computer really didn't know what to do with itself. I don't think it was a limp mode, more like seizure mode

I think you'd have a code for that, but Idk sounds like we're all tossing shit at the wall too see what sticks


I have nothing else to add, other than to say I'm rooting for ya'll to figure this out
and when you get it, @Moonminer better share where he got those braided hoses from to celebrate

 

shifty Attached is a picture of my computer. also I checked my wire joints and I’m still in limp mode and high idle. I mean it is like -12 degrees today. This is on fresh start!

 

Did you say you had a friend with an early 2000's 2WD Tundra you could pull the ECU from? Can you check if their ECU part number is also 89661-0c131?

I seriously don't think it's the ECU. I think you've got a rogue sensor here that's gone off the reservation and is feeding the ECU bad data OR you have something (hose, valve, or other line) that's loose/cracked/pinching that's causing beef

 

I’ve checked all my hoses and nothing is pinched. I even put my fingers over the plastic nipples on top the power steering pump with no change. I’ve replaced the maf sensor too.

the truck idled for about 35 minutes and this is what the reader showed.

 

You understand the abbreviations, right? Like when you see "B1" or "B2" that's bank1 (driver side), bank2 (passenger side), and "S1" or "S2" is sensor1 (upstream) and sensor2 (downstream).

I always have a tough time just looking at results like this and making sense of them, a lot of times I need to dig to look up what expected responses are, or reference my own, latter of which I can't do.

The one thing that jumps out to me is the SHRTFT (short term fuel trim) @ B1S2 is "N/A". Why is the driver side downstream sensor not reporting back, nothing is set? I feel like I'd expect that to have a value if you've made it to Closed Loop (which I assume is what the "CL" is in that last pic under FUELSYS1 and FUELSYS2, you've evntered Closed Loop, but doesn't that require all 4 oxygen/air-fuel sensors to report back?)

Additionally, the short term fuel trim reported for B2S2 is 90%+? What the hell?

The other thing I notice, and I'll echo what @BroHon already told you to do. Are those numbers in the scanner dynamic? Like, they are "live"? I ask because you can tell (1st two pics you posted) if the O2 sensors are good/bad based on how/if they fluctuate. Those are the numbers with "(V)" at the end for VOLTAGE. Again, we are using "O2" prefix on those values with B and S. Like...

O2B1S1 = upstream driver, should fluctuate especially with gas pedal
O2B1S2 = downstream driver, shouldn't fluctuate much at all, except maybe a hair
O2B2S1 = upstream passenger, same as above
O2B2S2 = downstream passenger, same as above

One fun test maybe you can do. Because they're easy to get to. Try unplugging both downstream sensors with the truck OFF. Yes, you'll throw a code when you start the engine. But see if it runs more-normal. If not, turn the truck OFF, unplug the upstream. Try again.

Also, can you get someone to listen for a sucking sound around the top end of the engine (bad intake manifold gasket), or to spray brake cleaner around the top of the engine while it's cold, check for surging? (again, may need good hearing)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNes9oRlC2M
​

Good example of testing O2 sensor voltage, see this video: https://www.tundras.com/threads/code-p0420.148084/#post-3707170

From Toyota's FSM, note the values on O2 sensors.

 

Ok, I can't find the damn FSM charts. But ...

Upstream should, IIRC, fluctuate around 3.3v average, going up and down depending on load.
Downstream should stay flat around 0.7v

I've got some stills from my truck. Here.

​

 

2007rpm/MAF 0.03 lb/s! It's getting air from somewhere, and it aint running across the MAF sensor (assuming the MAF is good, and it's wiring as well)
Closed loop at 98deg (100 shy of warmed up) doesn't seem right either, but I'll have to check that.
Brake clean all around your intake seal (because you've had it off and reinstalled), have someone watch the Idle (edit- RPM) on the OBD2 reader live data.

 

IF the ECT of 136 F is after 35 min, I would be concerned about coolant system....thermostat, burp needed etc. Realizing your ambient temperature is like us....colder than hell showing IAT of 39 F.

Won't comment on other readings unless it was a proper warmed engine at normal idle.

As for the SHRTFT B1S2 of N/A, I want call it useless nor normal. Some readers don't even report it, some report it but choose to show 99% or there about.

portion of live data from my 04 DC LTD from 2 of my readers....

 

I’m at a loss with what has been said. I can read but I’m dyslexic too. So it takes me awhile to read, I have my son read it to me and then help me troubleshoot it out in the car. I took off the manifold to get to the knock sensors, and the starter. I torqued the bolts down to fsm specs. Is there fuses or relays I’m not seeing or need to test? I’m about to sell this thing for scrap. Is brake cleaner the only thing you can use to test the manifold or hoses with?

 

Butane or propane from an unlit torch will work to. Or ether. Anything flammable really.

 

Let me jump in and recommend OP fabricate a smoke test setup and check for an air leak that way. It will definitely either show the system is air tight or it isn’t.

 

Did you replace the intake gaskets with new OEM ones?

 

Perhaps mis-understanding but 0.03 lb/s is 13 g/s. The 00-03 FSM shows that @ 2500 RPM's, one should see 13-20 g/s MAF reading.

Just as an aside, interpreting much from scan tool screenshots is difficult and/or useless given each screen shot does not show what other parameters readings are. One has to input other parameters then take a screen shot with phone of entered parameters at that point in time....if RPM for example, was not part of that latest screenshot, what could actually be derived.

If the original problem of bucking bronco(goes up and down on the rpm’s to 2500 then to 1500 then back to 2500 to 1500 ) is still present, following the FSM procedure for checking the continuity for the 4 conductors of the TPS harness back to the ECU. Also checking the output of the ECU for the 5vdc(VC and E2) that is the voltage control(VC) signal for the TPS....connector E6, pin 13 Grn/Blk(VC) and E2(gnd), pin 18 Grn/Wh(E2)

 

No more up and down RPM, just high idle. Seems to be lower just under 1500 but as truck idles for a time (30-45 minutes) it goes above 2000 rpm. I wish I could post a video on what it is doing and sounds like. All parts and gaskets that have been replaced have come from my Toyota dealer.

 

That would be good news indeed and also nice to know for sure.

"I mean it is like -12 degrees today"....wouldn't want to be in your shoes if still that cold.

Way out in left field thought but is heater on and in defrost position during 2000 RPM's.

 

Internal combustion engines are just one big vacuum, an glorified air pump with controlled explosions.

Any product that’ll ignite while under pressure will work to test. Brake cleaner is popular because it’s not very volatile. But it splatters, so some folks like to use butane or propane.

The concept is simple:

• Engine is one big air vacuum
• Spray product around the engine
• If there’s a leak, the vacuum effect of the motor will pull the product in, you’ll get more combustion/idle change

This is also why, if you have anything cracked after the MAF, the engine’s naturally vacuum would be sucking in more air. But if it was something obvious, like you had an intake gasket leak, it should be audible.

The other option is to smoke test. You’d probably want to smoke test at the throttle body. Then, make a point to smoke test the intake tube to the airbox.

I'm going to look back over vacuum hose pics. Maybe you got something backwards. But I don’t remember seeing anything out of whack.

There are some vacuum activated valves like the power steering air control valve whose main purpose is to increase the idle, it’s why I mentioned where to find it and how to bypass earlier.

 

No heater is not on, also I can’t seem to remember if anybody gave me a link to the fsm for these trucks but would like to be able to refer to that

 

https://www.tundras.com/posts/3082070

 

As for an FSM, be advised that the 00-03 FSM you'll find around here for instance is actually an 03 FSM. The 00 and 03 do have a number of differences and one being the ECM of an 03 uses E7 connector for TPS and an 00 ECM uses E6 for TPS....just one example. Any electrical diagrams you wish to use, suggest downloading the 2000 EWD linked to in the "So ... you wanna buy" megathread.

Thought on 2000 RPM, after battery reset, it can take numerous drive cycles for the ECU to relearn. With your extreme cold wx, I'd definetly attempt to drive it around for awhile to see if things re-learn and settle down.

 

EWD link: https://www.tundras.com/threads/ultimate-tundra-wiring-diagrams-collection.81448/

 

Just commenting on the air flow.... I totally got that wrong . Thx for correcting me Bubba
Not sure what conversion table I ran into b4 but it wasnt the right one.

 

When I pondered that the other day, there was one I definitely questioned and indeed had to do with the power steering control valve. The ones on drivers side all appear to be fine when looking at @Sirfive and his 2000.

Project Double Gnar : P0441 and some missing hoses | Toyota Tundra Forum




The passenger side caught my attention. IMHO the circled one below should go to power steering(PS) control valve and another vacuum hose comes from PS control valve up to that spot, at least any 02-06 I've run across.



A picture taken above the engine showing the whole engine bay would be assume !!

 

That is exactly what I'm talking about, and I think you're correct.

The vacuum delivered when PS ACV is actuated causes idle to kick up, although I think it's only a couple hundred RPM, I assume the valve itself may be "limiting", in that it doesn't allow FULL vacuum, and with you giving it full, unadulterated vacuum, I can see that causing the major idle surge. But that's Ultimately why I asked @Moonminer to test unplugging the valve, and bridging the two lines.

@Moonminer I believe Bubba is correct here! That line he circled is not routed properly. The valve it should go to is the power steering air control valve ("PS ACV"), it looks like this and it's screwed in above the top of the power steering pump:

​

I don't believe it's a one-way valve. But that hose Bubba circled is supposed to plug into one nipple, and then you should have a hose going from the other nipple up to the bib Bubba circled.

Give that a try. If idle doesn't improve, try swapping the orientation of the vacuum lines on the ears of that valve.

I think you're getting that extra idle because that valve STOPS vacuum, and when you turn power steering, it opens the valve, causing a surge in idle (due too extra air being sucked in from the intake tube. Or at least that's the purpose of the valve, to prevent your idle from bogging while the PS pump is actively leeching power.

A lot of times the valve will fail and cause PS fluid to get sucked into the intake, which results in a puff of smoke at startup.

OH - if you have any hoses plugged into that valve, get us pics of where they're going - since that could cause issues too!

 

And if it helps to put that into picture format versus words - maybe someone else with a 2000 Tundra on here can confirm, one of these would be correct:

​

 

This is from a 2000 that clearly shows PS air hoses going downward toward valve....