If you're a Gen 3 owner, what do you do?

It's really a shame about the RAM because it really is a beautiful truck. Test drove one last year as well and it was very nice. For the amount of money they wanted, though, I wasn't willing to gamble on it knowing their history as well as my own experience.

Not giving up on Toyota any time soon though. Going this weekend to test drive the new 2025 Camry for the Mrs - her current one has been indestructible and we're ready to see what the new model looks like.

 

It is interesting... Once on a business trip they didn't have a standard mid size so gave me a brand new RAM truck. It drove great, felt solid, was nicely appointed. I liked it. Then a couple years later my Tacoma got rear ended and while it was in the shop getting a new bumper Enterprise gave me a RAM truck. It felt like a bucket o' bolts POS. Not sure what was different except for a few more miles.

 

>> A couple of people have mentioned some connection between Nissan Titans and Dodge. Is that just an "inspired by" or "looks like".........or is it same components, head design or something major?

>> It would be cool if Toyota said, well, for 4 years we'll fall back to offering the 5.7 V-8 engine version + the TT V-6: the Classic Coke and the New Coke! I bet they'd sell the shit out of the retro ones!

 

Titan HD had a Cummins. Dodge used Cummins otherwise totally different trucks.

 

Wow…I said those same things and got torched! And I had an F150 with a long block replacement and multiple leaking plastic oil pans.

 

I wonder if it has anything to do with streamlining the frames and engines somewhat across multiple lines that allows them to save money.

 

After I saw my brand-new truck in complete disarray at the dealership, my confidence in the rebuild dropped drastically

 

It makes no sense why they don’t just send out a crate engine for the replacements and instead do a full teardown and rebuild. The labor and time to repair is so much higher. The downtime for the owner goes way up, their loaner costs go way up, the chance of something getting damaged goes up, and you have to figure the likelihood of future problems goes way up as well.

 

The bean counters would have looked at the numbers and rebuild is cheaper. Remember the labor rate Toyota pays its dealers isn’t what customers pay.

 

I don’t doubt it. The bean counters never look at the big picture, like future costs of shoddy repairs, loss of pissed off customers, the opportunity cost of making customers wait 3x longer for repairs, etc. Or the cost to their reputation by dragging this out for years.

I know we’re all dealing in mass speculation, but if this turns out to be a fundamental design flaw affecting every gen 3, I'm not sure the Tundra’s reputation can be salvaged.

 

Yeah, if they decide to literally rebuild all these engines at local dealers it will be a real mess. Might take years to work through the backlog and as mentioned already, lots of potential for mistakes by poorly trained mechs and numerous callbacks to fix issues. Talk about making a boatload of unhappy customers. If it comes to that I hope they give us an option to sign a safety waiver and just take a lifetime warranty on our well running engines.

But at the end of the day, we will be relegated to what Toyota decides to do for (to?) us. Unless there is maybe a class action lawsuit. But is too early for me to even think about that possibility.

 

I’m with Toyota for the resale value as well as the reliability. If both go away so will I.

 

That was the case for the relatively few warranty repairs but if now they need to do 100,000 motors? IDK that that is feasible or that the math would still work for the bean counters. Nor would it work for the dealers having so many mechs tied up on low profit warranty work.

 

Toyota says: you fucked up, you trusted us.

 

Sure as hell don’t want a class action lawsuit. Toyota will dig in and let the lawyers handle it. Then it drags out for years, the plaintiff lawyers suck most of the settlement $$$ off, and we get a check for $200 and a poke in the eye.

 

If it’s really a design flaw, it’s worse than that. They sold about 102,000 in 2022, and 125,000 in 2023. We don’t know 2024 sales yet. But certainly that puts well over a quarter million engines at risk. Since the NHTSA flags it as a safety issue, they have to fix them and not just extend the warranty.

 

I know that. Just saying that if the remedy Toyota proposes seems to me to risk coming out of the process with a less reliable engine than what I seem to have... i.e. if they insist on rebuilding them all at the yahoo dealers... I might be willing to sign a waiver for the safety concern and keep my engine. Maybe. Depending on the proposed remedy.

 

It’s probably not going to end up good for us.

 

I did No 4 and am doing No 5. I'll add No 9. - Changed the oil and cut the filter and sent the oil in to be analyzed at 1000/5000/10000, and No. 10 - Added a magnetic oil drain plug for inspection purposes.

No. 7 happens anyway.

One more thing - No 11. Not really bother with this site anymore since "they" eliminated all the posts and the best information for coming here in the first place. Really, really sad I think.

Corporate lawyers win again.

 

Wonder how many affected Gen3 owners have an extended warranty and what they may receive if part of the "fix" is to provide a 100k PT warranty in addition to engine replacement/repair? Will those owners recevive a refund for a portion of their extended warranty purchase?

Are the prices for extended warranties rising, falling or holding steady?

Should a Gen3 owner go out and purchase an extended warranty or wait until the Mother Ship clarifies their solution?

 

I'm not sure if a safety waiver works. That covers you, but what about the other people injured when they run into your stalled truck?

Toyota will make it right, or they won't. If they don't and this engine is in their flagship vehicles too, it will be a major black eye for them, and they know it.

Toyota has become the largest automaker, and of course that will come with hiccups. If they don't or can't maintain the quality that defines them, someone will fill that vacuum.

From an efficiency and customer relations standpoint, short block replacements do not make sense.

I also think new Tundra sales are going to nosedive, so they should cut production and move updated longblocks to the dealers for install.

TBH, when I bought by 23, I had no idea the engine would be so expensive to replace. That, coupled with poor quality, will be a sure fire way to lose loyal customers.

Why should a consumer risk a lower quality repaired short block, with higher risk of failure, knowing their future out of pocket cost will be more than the truck will likely be worth?

 

I got one and it just made sense to spend 1500 to protect myself for 10 years/100k miles. But you have to do it before your 36 months expires.

 

No way they’re replacing 300k engines. Long block or short block. Just not logistically or financially feasible. They’re going to put out some BS test to satisfy the safety recall. That test will allow them to say the majority of the trucks are not a safety hazard and send you on your way. My guess is they’re probably working on some kind of permanent fix by redesigning a part of the engine and will update production once they do. And they’ll just keep replacing short blocks as engines continue to kaplooey.

 

I have 28,000 miles on my 22 with no issues, so far. I now stay in the slow lane and watch my speed…until I get to the dealership on 17 May. I recommend not having a knee jerk reaction. They’ll fix it properly or buy it back.

4. I would extend the warranty if still eligible. Who knows what else might happen down the road.

7. Toyota has a reputation for standing behind its products and fixing things when they are not right. Although they have been slipping a little since COVID.

I don’t think the trucks will take much of a hit in value. Many vehicles over the years have had serious recalls but retained resale value.

All vehicles put together in the COVID era have been sub-par, regardless of manufacturer. Even Honda is having issues.

Do you think the big 3 automakers would step up, voluntarily identify an issue and then commit to a majorly expensive repair?

 

I agree... if they give us new long blocks, I'll have a little more confidence in the outcome... although the R&R still leaves a lot of opportunities for problems to arise. What I really don't want to see is these yahoos disassembling my motor and installing new main bearings and flushing the block. I will have very little confidence in that. And yes, the cost to replace these motors as people have shown on the warranty receipts is stunning. My GF's entire Honda CRV cost less.

 

If the remedy doesn’t stop engines they deem as not a safety hazard from dying on the highway, the NHTSA ain’t gonna sign off on that. All it will take is one causing a serious crash with a dashcam video of it and they’re toast. Tundra will synonymous with Pinto.

 

Yup, Toyota is in a "safety recall" box and the only way out I see is to fix or replace the suspect motors. There is no magic way to discern which in the recall range might or might not seize. At least without fully disassembling them to inspect, measure, flush, and reassemble. I don't see that happening. At least I hope they don't go there and instead send new short, or better yet, long blocks.

 

The wrench monkeys at my dealership couldn't even remember to put the oil fill cap back on after an oil change. The thought of those same people replacing the short block, or even installing a complete crate engine, in my truck makes my skin crawl.

My truck was made 3 months later than the recall range, so it's not included. But I fully expect them to expand the range of the recall when the majority of newer trucks reach the 20-30K mileage range when these failures typically happen.

I love my Gen 3, but I'm starting to wish I would have driven the wheels off of my 2015 Tundra that I traded in.

 

I hope it is that easy, but it is hard to imagine a test that is accurate and sensitive enough to catch the ones that have the most minimal bearing problems and take 40,000 miles to fail and NHTSA accepting such.

 

Yes I have. And I am still not totally convinced about this debris theory. But getting samples from the whole affected range would certainly provide some insight, even if not definitively identifying all problem engines.