Saga for Finding a 4x4 First Gen with Low Miles in Florida

Also, thoughts on public auctions? I know you can be shit out of luck sometimes and it’s a gamble, but I’ve seen some trucks with very minimal damage and miles for less than 10. Just curious!

 

Auctions are just that: A gamble.

 

Not sure what your need for 4wd are for or if your native Floridian. I’m 34 and spent most of my life in western Ma up by VT and have only “needed” to use 4wd I can count on less than one hand. Most of those times I shouldn’t have been where I was anyway. I know people will deny like crazy but unless you’re doing serious wheeling I’ve never needed it.

My DC 2wd with a lift and bigger tires works great everywhere I take my dirtbikes and no need to service transfer cases or axle shafts.

plus I was vehemently against 2wd until last year when I drove my 2wd transit van all over to ride and then realized I never used it. I’m actually relieved I don’t have all that extra moving parts haha

 

Also where’s, the truck at in IL? If it’s near St. Louis maybe I can take a look at it for you

 

We’ve got a few cats here with 2wd that take their trucks up stuff that almost all of the 4wd “needers” would never do.
I specifically bought a 4R in 2wd for some of the reasons you listed, and it’s been very capable on trails with driver mods. I’ve crawled up rocky inclines with no issue, and watched a v8 4R awd spin tires on the same climb.

 

agreed I’m not anti or pro either one but I know with my truck at 150k miles and an absolutely spotless frame and underneath with full service history as well as no accidents, all that was worth much more to me than two more axle shafts. Plus it’s a great bargaining chip!

 

Well the 4wd comment is sure to stir debate.

I test drove a 2wd by mistake and liked it so much I tried to convince myself I could make do without 4wd. Searched and read comments on forums. There's always a small, very small percentage of people who swear by 2wd, even in snowy states. They're either very fair-weather, only go out when roads are plowed, never venture far from flat ground, or they go through all sorts of mitigation measures. Tons of weight in the back, limited slip differential, the best snow tires possible, and they really know how to drive it.

I really tried to convince myself I could make it work. But I have legitimately been stuck in a flat parking lot in my Tacoma. Stuck at a traffic light on flat ground. Had to throw it in 4wd to get moving. I have multiple friends who live miles down dirt roads, up steep hills. Most of the winter and any time it rained heavily in the summer, I wouldn't be able to make it to their house. 2wd is a serious liability too many of the places I go. Could I "get away" with it most times? Yes. But I can count two or three times a year that without 4wd I would have needed people pushing me to get unstuck.

Yes, I've gone far, far down mountain and desert roads and never put it in 4wd. But when I need it, I need it.

I guess in the end I can't know where you drive and what the conditions are like. I legitimately spent all evening after test driving that truck reading forums, then most of the night unable to sleep, trying to go through the mitigation measures I'd need to take to get by without 4wd.

I'd love to spend a year hanging out with someone with a 2wd truck doing what FrenchToasty describes. As I ran through situations in my mind, I could mitigate many of them. But in the end what I kept coming back to was "I'm going to be a liability in the backcountry. People are going to have help me get unstuck. Everywhere I pull off the road in the winter I'm going to need to be extra extra careful I won't get stuck there. There will be times I had planned to visit friends and need to cancel." I know canceling due to weather is something that's smart even with 4wd. But some roads are totally fine with 4wd, but impassable without.

 

I also remember being in college and thinking that a 4wd was necessary for a truck but then you realize what are wants and what are needs lol don’t want that to sound like 4wd isn’t a need but maybe we just made do where I’m from. We had a lot of “mountain” and brush parties going up far away from civilization and I’ve seen some 2wd vehicles do unimaginable things haha

 

To all the 4wd vs 2wd comments I'm going to be eventually turning it into an overland rig that I sleep out of, so I would much rather have the creature comfort of having 4wd if I'm ever in a situation that needs it. Better to have it than not!

Thanks for this, it's by the Air Force base near St. Louis so pretty close! I'll let you know if I change my mind on that truck and decide to go 2wd. Really appreciate that with no questions asked!

 

real close to there let me know I’ll check it out.

 

Finding some crazy deals on Emunds right now... I sent a bunch of messages to dealerships asking for frame pictures so I should get a bunch of feedback tomorrow! If I was going to drive 250+ miles I'd have to do it this week or during the summer when I have a Friday off, leave work Thursday... Should be interesting

 

I've seen cars, like Honda Civics, Toyota Camrys, in crazier places than 2wd trucks, definitely. If you know where to place your wheels, how much clearance you have, and don't mind a little scraping, you can get places some people with high clearance and 4wd don't dare go. When 4wd saves you is of course traction, and that's only needed in a few circumstances. For me, all the contingency plans (driving a different route around town to avoid the steep hill anytime it snows, or getting a good running start, not going to friends houses when it's wet, tons of weight in the back, great tires, worrying about whether I can park on the side of that street since they haven't plowed yet etc) isn't worth the benefit of having one less set of axles and two less gearboxes, though I DO see that benefit.

I really would like to spend 4 seasons knowing someone who did the stuff I do, but with a 2wd. I don't doubt it's possible, just never seen it.

Anyway, tangent.

Edmunds! Crazy. I never even thought of it. When I was first looking, I was looking for anything to take the pressure off my Tacoma as a daily driver. Subaru, any small SUV etc. Craigslist, FB and actually AutoTrader were where I found the most action.

SLC has a site called KSL that has a great, heavily used classified section. I'm guessing other cities have something similar. For me SLC is just several hours straight down I-15, or a short plane ride, so I was looking close there. But Utah is the land of money and image and crazy driving. So too many vehicles are lifted, lowered and/or driven really hard.

 

The 2wd vs 4wd debate is interesting while I am over here debating a Full Time 4wd with CDL t-case swap from a Sequoia in my 4wd truck IMHO, the biggest benefit to a 4wd truck is low range gearing reduction, especially on steep/tight trails. Since it sounds like @michael.crg will end up doing some traveling, he'll probably experience more than flatlands. If you end up at the top of Black Bear Pass (if it ever reopens) you will greatly appreciate having 4wd and low range.

I drove 450 miles to get my truck. It was a Marketplace find. The rust free frame and easy to work with seller made it worth the drive, despite the truck having a myriad of issues.

Don't discount a clean high mileage truck. I understand why somebody would want a ~150k mile truck over a 250k mile truck, but I would suggest entertaining a nice high mileage truck. More than likely both trucks will require similar maintenance while the higher mileage truck will generally cost 1/3 to 1/2 of the lower mile truck.

 

Great points. I wanted 200,000 or less, but was fine with 225,000 on a really well maintained truck. And the OP can read the "so you bought a first gen" sticky to see the consensus on extremely low-mileage 20 year-old trucks. 150,000 is kinda the lowest you'd feel safe going. Otherwise it's sat a ton or only done short, stop & go in-town driving and is likely in worse shape than something with ~10,000 miles/year put on it.

My first several Toyotas had manual locking hubs. It could be annoying if the need for 4wd caught you off guard, but on the other end of the spectrum, I regularly made of use of the 4lo gearing without locking the hubs. It's like having a true granny gear. Really handy. And since you aren't in 4wd you don't need to worry about binding on pavement, like the boat ramp or something.

 

Yeah, lots of good deals through dealers on Emunds. Found one in the Midwest that's a double cab limited, white (Not a big fan of the color but that's okay, grill is also white which is ugly imo), 4x4 w/ I think 105k miles for 9k which is maybe 11k after fees which is still a sweet deal. Obviously first thing I asked was to see the frame since that's probably the problem, but nonetheless a sweet deal. I've been looking everywhere on pretty much every website.

I'll check out that in terms of classified's! I've not looked through those yet. I even went through to look at repossessed vehicles auctioned off by the US Treasury. Nothing there lol.

As much as I want to entertain a higher mileage truck (>175k miles) since I know that in most cases, a higher mileage truck that has great maintenance is better than a lower mileage truck that's been sitting in the garage and has not undergone proper maintenance going to be the better pick, I really can't due to my investor (my mother).

My mom knows nothing about cars/trucks and is already criticizing me for picking an older vehicle due to safety and reliability even though I explained they're built better than pretty much any other vehicle 15k and under. She thinks new is better and I already know she has this image in her head that she wants me to drive something brand spanking new off the lot, but I'm not letting her shell out a 30k-40k. It's financially feasible but its not something I agree with because I penny pinch wherever I can get, and I know the payments will get passed off to me as soon as I get a full time gig.

My plan is to have the Tundra because I can do all the work on it myself, it's safe, reliable, and most of all does all the fun stuff I want with no ridiculous payments. I'll eventually upgrade to something else newer down the line as a daily when I get a job and I'm independent and still keep the Tundra as a strictly fun mobile instead of a daily driver. Reason being they aren't getting any younger and great ones are becoming harder and harder to come by.

 

Totally agree with you. I'm looking for 125k-150k range mainly. If it's REALLY low mileage I know that can link to a problem and I'll probably have to do sludge removal to avoid any serious issues which is a pain in the ass. Read above I kind of talk about my look somewhat further.

 

Also if I were to get a fixer-upper auction car I'd have to wait until after my internship since my mom would be pissed if I had a POS sitting in the garage all summer

 

I found some pretty good pics of front framerail cracks on a 190k mile truck out of TN. I don't remember who I was warning to look in this spot recently. I think it gets overlooked.

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Yikes, looks rough

 

Rest of the frame looked pretty good.

We had a similar case almost identical to this recently. Rest of the frame looked mint. But then he pulled back the splash guards/aprons inside the front wheel wells (beside the struts, where those fractures are) to find this (reply #270).

 

Update:

No 05-06 yet, but I did find a 2000 White AC 4x4 Limited with 162k miles for 8k.

Has a new transmission and differential installed. Also a clean engine bay. Those are flags of suspicion for me…

Upgraded Stereo system.

Owner states it’s been garage kept its entire life and never been off-roading. Has only towed Jetskis.


Regardless of some obvious red flags and me being a guy who doesn’t settle for less, I’ve never test drove a Non-VVTI and I can’t ignore a great deal, so I think it’s still worth checking out! I’ll upload photos once I get to my computer.

 

Here's two pictures. The rest on the listing were just close ups of the inside.


Some more info on it too is that it is one owner, and if he's lived in Florida his entire life that's a really good sign there is little to no frame rust. It has seat covers on so I'm immediately ripping those up to see the probably messed up seats unless I hit the lottery since Toyota didn't know how to stitch leather upholstery together. Also has a vinyl Tonneau cover that is damaged do to the sun (which is contradictory to the owner saying its been garage-kept its entire life).

Edit: Truck also has a newly installed TRD dual cat back exhaust system. A lot has been done to the truck so it would save me a lot of money

 

Holy shit, that looks great. Look under the dash for spaghetti. At least the power setup for amps looks properly done, but ... still. Also, PS fluid and brake fluid will likely need a flush. K&N shit has to go.

 

100% going to. Also has a new TRD Dual cat exhaust system installed. From the looks of it though, I think this guy has gone through a third party to get everything done to his truck and isn’t a DIY-er, but I won’t know until I see it!

 

I worked at a shop in my earlier years, they did audio primarily, and tint, competed in IASCA, etc. Really depends on the shop as to how bad it'll be. Some of them operate on quantity, not quality, and that results in some nightmarish shit. Could be a huge win, or a huge nightmare. Check it out! This could be the one.

 

Oh wow that’s a great looking truck and looks like a great deal. I have an 06 but I think that generation in an access cab is a better looking truck. Vvti regardless these trucks aren’t breaking any land speed records haha I don’t think the extra hp makes any difference. I’d be all over that

 

I like that the owner of that truck is still using the Panasonic Toyota battery. Leads me to believe it was somewhat cared for. Shifty` is right, the fluids look dark.

 

Seeing the Toyota battery makes me think there is probably a nice stack of service records in the Toyota Owners online portal as well.

 

Checking it out at 5pm today since that’s his only time slot. Guy has 9 other interested hoping I can get lucky and swindle a higher offer on 8k so I can get some cash together and purchase it tomorrow if the condition is great.

Although again I’m in no rush, so if it gets swept out from under me it’ll be alright!

 

That is super clean. It's also suspicious to me that it needed a new tranny and differential. I'd ask the story on that. Either years of bad of driving habits, or one catastrophic "oops" event...

Otherwise everything looks immaculate!