Subscription needed for map?! $$

And if you buy one with lifetime maps, you pay for it up front.

 

This is not correct….. I did not have to pay for a map update (dvd based navigation) on my 2010 4Runner Limited. I paid an upfront premium for that vehicle which included navigation. There were two or three dvd map updates made available during my ownership but opted not to buy because I didn’t feel the need. Also, this system worked where there was zero cell service…. Try that in the new state of the art best ever Tundra

 

It most certainly is. Nothing is free, but given how much the truck costs, it's hard to imagine they couldn't include lifetime maps into it as well.

How much do you think it cost garmin to push you updates on 130$ unit? Makes toyota feel like pinch-penny grinch!

 

Exactly… I love mine !! I have a Garmin motorcycle GPS that was rather expensive, over $600. But has worked flawlessly for twelve years and on four different bikes. Also lifetime map updates….

 

Do you tie it to your phone for real time?

 

I'm so damn old I can use and read a Map! As a result I don't need Navigation and I saved enough to purchase fuel for driving! Toyota can shove their subscription where the sun don't shine, along with XM and the rest. Android AutoPlay for me.

 

Does anyone actually make a paper map anymore? And how do you fold those damn things?

 

So like I said, you would have had to pay for updates. You simply opted not to.

 

I’m not saying I agree with Toyota charging a subscription. I was simply pointing out that the older Toyota navigation also charged for map updates, but they were in the form of an SD card you had to purchase, rather than subscription-based OTA updates.

And subsequently I was pointing out that the “lifetime maps” updates from Garmin are included in the price you pay for the unit. It’s not free.

 

While you had to pay for updates, at least it still worked if you didn't. I was disappointed when my subscription ran out a couple weeks ago. I didn't think it was too important because I didn't use the app for the truck that much anyway. Until I seen NAV was null unless I updated my subscription. F that. The factory nav would take me on some extra turn routes because it was a shorter distance or something. One thing I did like was you could have your cluster center screen tell you the next step on your journey. I liked the screen to display "other" info. Cough benize cough. Would be nice if the OEM nav at least worked when the truck is connected to your phones hot spot. But no.

 

Yes gang, and I totally understand. Perhaps it would psychologically feel different if they included it quietly into the price of a pickup.

 

Yes, I opted not to update the maps from the original 2010 nav dvd. I never paid an extra fee to use the navigation during my ownership of that vehicle and it worked perfectly well for me right up to the day I sold it this last spring to take delivery of my 2023 Tundra. I could jump in my Runner (without having my phone) and have a working factory installed navigation system that I paid a premium for when I originally purchased the vehicle. Just saying… $60,000 is enough to pay for a vehicle without having ongoing extra fees to use the nav. Throw another $500, $1,000 or whatever up front on to the $60,000 purchase price and give me a vehicle a WORKING navigation system

 

I just pulled my Garmin out that has been in a drawer for 6 years and updated the maps for free?

 

I pay $5/month. Told them that’s all it’s worth to me, guy just said
OK and took my $60

 

I don’t necessarily disagree with rolling the price into the price of the truck. But on the other hand, if I don’t want or use the factory navigation, why should I be forced to pay a premium for it? With a subscription-based service you can choose to pay for it or not. In other words, let those who want it pay for it, while those who don’t want it aren’t forced to pay for it. In my experience, Toyota’s factory navigation is worse than useless, so I wouldn’t want to pay a dime for it, especially when there are better options available for free. Heck, I’d even pay a subscription for Google Maps or Apple Maps rather than pay a dime for Toyota navigation.

Like I said, you chose not to update the maps in your older vehicles. Depending on where you live, that may or may not be practical. In some places your navigation would be useless without those map updates. With a subscription-based service your maps would be updated regularly through OTA updates.

 

And like I’ve said numerous times throughout this thread, that update might have been at no cost to you at this time, but you paid for it up front when you purchased the unit.

The last Garmin I bought also included lifetime map updates. The price was significantly higher than the same unit without lifetime map updates. Looking at Garmin’s website now, it appears all new units include lifetime updates, but pricing assuredly is higher to pay for those updates, and you have no choice but to pay it whether you choose to update or not.

 

I believe that's what I pay also. I very rarely even listen to it. Having the big screen, I listen to movies on trips greater than 10 minutes. I don't think it's taxing SXM's satellite by having my subscription, so any money is better no money. So much that I have all the channels and Internet listening as well, for the $5/mo.

 

The reason for the costs for the navigation is in part what Toyota has to pay AT&T for the LTE service. The maps and traffic updates don't just magically appear. If AA and Google Maps didn't exist, I'd have no problem paying for the service, as the traffic updates alone are very much worth it. The time saved on my daily commute has been massive thanks to the traffic updates. At the same time, basic integrated navigation would be a bonus, but everything is going to "the cloud" or an software as a service model so don't expect to see integrated navigation from any manufacturer going forward.

 

I bought CoPilot app with live traffic and lifetime updates for $9.99 in 2012. Still works.

Google Maps was actually good some years ago, but now it is meh. I stopped using it when I planned my MA-FL route carefully to avoid major metropolitan areas, yet this shit silently redecided everything and pushed me through NYC, which cost me 5 hours just to escape back to my original route, which was longer mile-wise, but less traffic. Also does not work well off the grid.

The last Garmin I've owned had a bug, which rendered it useless when crossing US-CA border (was throwing you off the roads east by like 50 yards and thus wasn't able to find route).

TomTom was quite nice a decade ago, but I can't stand their new UI. Stopped buying.

So CoPilot is the best.

I actually use a paper Maine Atlas by DeLorme quite a bit It is not updated, so most of old log roads don't exist anymore, while new roads are not added, but it is still nice to see where you can go, even if it means water in bed and brush scrubbing the paint

Oh, Garmin's EarthMate is quite good in pair with their InReach satellite communicator. Use it in boonies all the time.

 

Perhaps the core problem is lack of customization. I personally never liked in-car navigation. It always felt mediocre to me compared to garmin or more recently google alternatives.

If there was an option to add navigation to the car for a certain fee(module and software installation) or skip it entirely, it would probably solve a lot of frustration for owners who never wanted such feature to begin with.

 

My 2014 Highlander has live traffic updates and no additional costs to me. My Dealership updates everything for free as long as I bought the car from them and I'm the original owner. They check every service and always inform me about it. We used the Highlander for a family trip here in the Northeast through CT, NY, NJ, Delaware and Maryland. The old school, updated for free, 10year old Nav. was stellar.
New pay-as-you-go stuff sucks dong crust.

 

Dumbest shit I've ever heard of. Would you like to access your vehicle's turn signals? $25/month please and thank you

 

So what would you pay per month for A/C Mr. Smith?

 

Not a penny. I don't use it. In fact, I wish I could have bought my truck without it and saved the cost.

 

I had an Audi that came with Google Maps. Once the subscription was over, you lost the ability to see Google-related stuff, but you didn't lose the map function. So ridiculous that Toyota would do that. At least allow the ability to see the map and use it, even if it is outdated.

 

i bought a kenwood 1007 with Garmin built in...kept getting old map notifications so went thru the process to update them no cost...
-format SD card
-insert SD card into the unit
-find update map on the unit
-unit puts a code from it on the SD card
-remove SD card and plug into PC that has gamin express software loaded
-download updated maps
-eject SD card and plug back into the unit and leave it in
-Map updates...leave the unit running until this is done...

Now if I could only figure out the firmware update on the Kenwood.

 

I think it's ridiculous not to have free navigation. I paid 70k for my 22 Platinum and now that my year is up, I get nothing. I usually use android audio so it's not a big deal, but occasionally, it doesn't want to connect and instead of seeing a map, I get some stupid message talking about navigation reimagined with no map. Greedy companies make me look cheap when the crappy software won't connect to my phone

I will never pay the small monthly subscription out of principle

 

Totally understand Connected Services having a fee because those cost Toyota monthly for connectivity. But Nav? Not at all. We can get an semi annual map update from a download through our phones or from a USB file plugged into the port. Absolute Greed to charge for Nav. Just think how far a gesture of good faith would go if Toyota gave back Nav to all owners free of charge. What a tremendous show of customer appreciation that would be!! It would help keep them above the rest!! (and for cheap) Huge Marketing opportunity being missed!!!

 

CarPlay is way better anyways with any map program you like , Apple Maps , google maps, Waze , etc

 

Agree. Big Time Wazer here. So at least let us hide the non subscribed Nav App from the screen