HOW to plan out suspension/tires part of build?

As many of you proper lurkers can gather, I'm building out my truck and am asking lots of questions.

Today, I'm wondering how/when to incorporate the suspension/tire upgrades into my build? I largely want to budget for them and become aware of the costs/timeframe, but am still in the deciding stages of what camper to get (so my weight capacity is unknown). Do I need to wait until the camper is owned/installed before actually knowing what I need/want? Can someone reference me to another discussion about lift/tire size, as I'll probably gain an inch or two with a lift if I'm upgrading suspension. What brands/shops/considerations should I make when deciding what kind of work I need done?

Disclaimer, this is a 'budget' build, which means I want anything to be as cheap as possible. I'll absolutely spend the extra money when deserved or needed, but am not looking to put Kings and winch on my truck just cause. I mainly just want the truck to be able to function well on sand, dirt, and rocks, while carrying a decent payload. I am not recreationally rockcrawling, but will drive in deep, soft sands regularly and dirt roads.

Think minimalist, but prepared and safe, camper build.

Edit: this is also an invitation to suggest brands of suspension and tires, as well as shops. I'm considering traveling out of the area for the work, as I live near San Francsico. Doubt this would be worthwhile, but I'm considering it.

 

You said, "This is a budget build".

Therefore, the first thing you need to do is define who will do the work. Next, you need to define your budget. Honestly, and realistically. You need to understand you'll be in this for $1k in tires alone, and that's for "decent" tires, not even awesome tires.

There's a ton of ways you can go about "lifting" your truck. i.e. if you were on an ultra-tight budget, you could theoretically get away with - and people are going to shit on me for saying this - strut spacers in front and blocks in back. It'll set you back maybe $300? But it's a really cheap ass, fallible way to go if you plan on getting into the thick of it.

You also need to decide on height. If you're just going for an inch, even an inch and a half, you probably don't need to futz with new UCAs, you can get by with struts and springs. Hell, if your OEM struts are still good, you may just be able to get by with springs, but a set of Bilstein 5100s cost so little, it'd almost be stupid not to get them. With your RCLB, if you throw some OME 2884 springs in those 5100s, you'll get that 1.25"-1.75" up front. I'd still get extended swaybar links, even if you only go ~1.5". I don't think I'd go with OME 2885 or 2887. Add-a-leaf kits really aren't exorbitantly expensive and cost 1/3 to 1/4 what new leafs would run you - wait to drop the money on more stout leafs when you have the camper and an accurate measure of how much it weighs, that #lb-age will be critical to selecting the right leafs for the job.

So really ... who will do the work, and what is your budget?

Outline it now. Then build around it.

If you find you're, like 10%-20% short, maybe you need to adjust your budget.

 

So basically, I need to research/decide exactly what I want, and then in inquire with shops independently? And you think it would be fine to access this before the truck is loaded?

I’m certainly not in a place to be doing substantial work on my car, and don’t want to start my mechanical work with suspension stuff and the tools that’ll entail. So I’ll be going to a shop.

 

What's your budget for the build? My budget build got out of control quickly

Basic lift with UCA - https://camburg.com/shop/suspension...yota-tundra-00-bilstein-6112-performance-kit/

Camburg will run a labor day sale for 15% off, you might want to spend some money on the rear since weight is a factor, upgraded leafsprings, and shocks that are serviceable since the bilsteins are not. Is a Lexus GX big break kit upgrade needed?

You will need new lower ball joints OEM,

Watch some youtube videos and run some numbers. Wheels 17 inch, with a -10 or -12 offset and tires 285/70/17 will be the most common.

https://www.youtube.com/@1stgenoffroad

https://www.youtube.com/@JDMDriveway

https://www.youtube.com/@EvergreenOverland/videos

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5foHvLKGpts - pretty much my build

 

Totally depends. I want everything to be as cheap as possible, but am flexible as this will probably serve as my primary dwelling on/off. If I had to ballpark a number, I don’t think I’d be happy if I spent more than 4k on tires and any suspension work. My camper will easily be 6k, and the truck is otherwise good condition, but I think I’ll be hurting to spend more than 10k on this project. (Obviously excluding the thousands of dollars I’ll spend on smaller things to get it comfortable and functional)

I know everyone builds are very different, and yours looks amazing and well done, but I’m looking for the ‘what can I do to avoid hazardous situations and minimize any wear-n-tear to my truck’. I’ve quickly disregarded new rims, and don’t care at all about a lift for aesthetics sake (but I think it’s very cool looking and possibly functional). I just want the truck running well, safely, for as long as possible.

 

You dont need much lift or big tires if you stay on the easy trails.

Skidplates and sliders might help more.


Mine is the stock black truck in a lineup of lifted 'big' tire trucks.

 

This is mainly what I’m trying to gauge. By off roading, I mainly mean literally being off the paved road. Fire trails, well used dirt roads, minor rock crawling (if you’d even call it that?), soft sand is mainly what I’m knowing I’ll be driving on. I also know that I can be off the road for hundreds of miles, as I’m heading to baja mexico and want to go to places like scorpion bay.

 

We see a lot of people who say "everything as cheap as possible". Cheapest possible is where you do the work yourself.

Before we continue: Will you be doing any of the work yourself?

It sounds like you won't be. This seriously kills budget. For example. I'm about $2k into my lift right now. I was pissed at my upper balljoints. For shits and giggles, I called a local offroad shop known for Toyota/Overlanding builds. I asked them to quote out my new tires, alignment, and install of SPC upper control arms and my Toytec coilovers (I'm supplying, and that's clear in the quote) so I don't hafta deal with the ball joints. Just for the coilovers and uppers install they quoted $2,025 - that doesn't include alignment. That's more than I spent on all my suspension so far, front and rear. Even if they're removing my knuckles, there's no way it's more than 5 hours worth of work on those two items, so I guess they're saying their shop time is $405/hr at 5 hours labor? I need to call them and ask them to clarify. The whole quote for 4 new tires, with install and TPM programming (I'm supplying Denso TPMs and wheels), and the UCA + CO was north of $3,800. THAT DOESN'T INCLUDE WHAT I ALREADY SPENT ON PARTS.

Now, I'm not saying every shop is going to do this, but I contacted a competing shop just to see if it comes back more-sane. Bottom line is, If you won't be doing the work yourself, you are SERIOUSLY cutting into your budget. Competent, trustworthy shops that won't F your shit up are apparently $$$ these days.

Edit: Point being, you can get Bilstein 5100s at all four corners and OME springs for under $1k. If you need someone to install the springs into the struts, you're looking at +$100-200 on that. If you need someone to install the rear shocks (2 bolts each, top one sucks), you're looking at another +$200. If you're needing someone to install the springs into the struts and install the struts for you, you're probably looking at +$600-800. Then you need to get an alignment, +$100-200. You just doubled the cost and you're over $2k now. Shit adds up. QUICK.

 

I agree with @shifty`, do all the research you can and feel as confident as you can before you even drop a dime. It's a catch 22, my friend. To be happy with a "build", you'll probably wind up in the $3k-$5k range after the suspension stuff and tire/wheels, alone. That's just my opinion, and going to a shop for the installs is going up the cost quite a bit.

It's sort of like a can of worms, you open it to do the "cheap" upgrades, but realize that you should have gone a slightly different route/brand/whatever. Sure you'll be happy with what you have, but not without a touch of regret lol.

I went the more cost effective route just to make sure I wanted to get back into these sort of thing and I should've have know it would give me the itch again. Below is an idea of the prices I paid a little over a year ago.

$600 for 1.75" lift (OME coils + Bilstein 5100 setup)
$60 suspension maxx sway bar links
$120ish for the rear Bilstein 5100 shocks
$750 Camburg UCA's (upgraded the upper control arms ahead of time because I knew I was going to want more soon)

$1500 right there and I've barely done anything! I do and will save a ton of $$$ because I install everything myself, so that would have at least been another grand to have a shop install.

 

The downside of the 'cheap' upgrades people tend to ignore is, the cheap stuff often isn't tested as hard, and has a track history of doing more damage than good. Repairing damage from subpar add-ons costs $$ and just puts you further in the hole. It's all a gamble.

That stuff is cheap for a reason: There's nobody standing behind it if it screws something up, and they're not charging extra $$$ to clear the R&D overhead that went into it. Is it true with everything? Probably not. But we've seen enough horror stories (or flat-out issues) here with Rough Country and Rancho products alone.

 

Lift - OME or Dobinsons basic lift kit with medium weight springs, add-a-leaf for the rear. New OE lower control arms?
Brakes - A quality front pad and a fluid flush, check the flex lines for leaks or bulging.
Cooling system - New radiator, thermostat and fresh coolant.
Engine - Oil filter and change to an appropriate oil weight for your location. Maybe a quick drain plug? Air filter and a spare. New plugs.
Driveline - grease or replace U- joints if worn, check front CV boots.
Tires - too many to choose from, good luck but don't cheap out too much. Load range D?

 

Absolutely. There's a reason some places list a complete, 6", lift kit is $2500... and it ain't 'cause it's really good. If a deal looks to good to be true, it's 'cause it is.

I guess I wouldn't say that my setup is "cheap" (nor do I think you are, either). "Affordable" is probably a better word to use.

 

Realistically, no. None of it. I live in a trailer in the woods currently, where I cannot work on my car, nor do I have any mechanical tools except a couple shitty socket wrench sets my dad left behind.

Am I interested in learning? Very much so. I love working on cars, and have bought/sold/built out a few trucks and vans. Probably one of my stronger passions, and I’d love to reinforce it with mechanical skills.

Have I f*cked my cars up and needed professional help half way through a repair? Also, yes, and let me confirm mobile mechanics suck.

I’ve done a lot of minor (and very easy) things like changing door handles, air filters, headlights, etc., but find mechanical work to be difficult, extremely time consuming, and I lack the space/tools/confidence to give it a go.

I’m currently poor, and plan to not work for a while so I’m trying to save up, but I’m good with money and have a few moderately well paying jobs. If something costs $500 extra to have a shop install it, we’ll it’ll probably be easier/faster for me to work 2 nights than to spend 2 weeks doing it, while spending the same money on tools.

This is response is half car, half me, but you’re probably the most responsive person I’ve met on here so I’m curious for your response. I’d love to learn, in fact I really want to, but I already carry around a bunch of crap as I move from place to place every few months. I love woodworking, have a bunch of tools, but seldomly have the time/space to build something that I won’t have to throw/give away 3 months later when I move.

 

Get Kings or Fox 2.5 up front with TC UCAs and never look back. I have that and now I'm trying to justify long travel. But I will tell you that adjustable coilovers are worth the money on and off road. They do need some maintenance. If you want maintenance free, get Bilsteins up front. My experience and it's personal, is start where you want to end. The hard part is you may not know today. I didn't.

 

First off, nothing wrong with being cash-strapped. I doubt you're gonna find many dudes on here who've never experienced that. Nobody judging you here. I was roofless for a short stint, be blessed you've got one.

I'd be curious if anyone on here that's mechanically inclined and/or has more resources close-enough to SFO who could share said resources/talent. This isn't me volunteering anyone for the job, but I'd be lying if I told you I haven't run across others in my days who are willing to jump in like that. Hell, when I was new to the VW world, some random dude I've never met before jumped in to help me install a kit, since he knew more about the ups and downs. Never asked for anything, was totally eager to help, asked nothing in return, dude just loved wrenching and didn't mind the hot ass weather and humidity. We had some beers after, and I never heard from the dude again, weirdly. I've done full-blown stereo system installs and engine swaps for folks on other forums and misc other audio work, audio repairs un-fucking previous owner garbage .... But , whatever, I'm going off on a tangent here.

Anyway, you're on a limited budget. If you wanted to stretch that budget, it's ideal to find someone that can help. Let's toss some bait: Anyone within an hour of the Bay Area available to lend a hand?

When I was looking at going budget I was gonna jump on the Bilstein train, with Bilstein 5100s and OME 2884s. You're out the door under $1k. You may need to add-a-leaf out back eventually, or update your leafs, but could get by with some blocks out back if it looks goofy, or drop a couple hundo on some add-a-leaf option. The base 5100 setup opens you up to larger tire options, but doesn't increase altitude enough you'll need to fork out for new uppers yet. You'll probably want to throw on extended swaybar links, under $200 more.

What does that look like?

You install everything - this means loading springs in the struts, installing struts, installing shocks, installing links. This should get you variably from 1.5" - 2.25" front lift, and adding 1" - 2" out back with a basic, non-adjustable near-OEM ride lift:

• ~$500 => 5100 front struts, 5100 rear shocks
• ~$200 => OME 2883 or 2884 springs (you may want to go 2883, actually, I think 2884 may put RCLB over 2" lift, especially if you're V6 and 2WD, stick with 2883!)
• ~$120-$220 => alignment
• ~$130 => RECOMMENDED: Extended swaybar links (this model)
• OPTIONAL: 1" - 2" lifting block out back once you settle in, but ideally add-a-leaf until you know how much weight you'll have back there and can pick an updated leaf spring

If you don't install everything, here's what you're adding on - and this is probably wildly variable on pricing depending on what mechanic options are available around you:

• $50-$200 => Installing spring in struts, low end of that could be carrying it to a chain shop and having them load things up, high end is buying from an online vender that'll ship pre-loaded
• $100-$200 => Having a shop install rear shocks
• $200-$300 => Having a shop install front struts
• $50-$75 => Having a shop install extended swaybar links

All of the above is 100% assuming:

• Your upper and lower control arm bushings are fine (required to apply and hold alignment)
• Upper and lower ball joints are fine (if lowers are worn, ONLY BUY OEM Toyota PARTS for LOWER BALL JOINTS)
• Your tie rod ends inner/outer are in good shape
• Steering rack bushings are ok, rack is not leaking
• Alignment cams aren't fucked, else you won't be able to get in alignment, if worn out THIS IS THE OTHER PART TO ONLY BUY OEM (and they're $$$, sorry!)
• No significant rust or other problems that lead to more man-hours at the shop

I might be missing some stuff, if I am hopefully someone can chime in. You can ultimately check the condition of the above mentioned bushings on your own. If you have a jack, you can also test your ball joints and tie rods up front pretty easily by grabbing the tire at different positions and push/pull/wiggle to check for play, videos on YouTube.

 

Don't forget Panhandlemonium, where four dudes from TX met at a trailer park in Amarillo TX and nobody got.......well, you know.

I went with a budget coilover setup on mine.

$1600 for a full lift kit including AAL, and $1500 for 255x85x16 on stock wheels. It allowed me to handle some decent off-road stuff, leveled the truck out but a tad higher, and fixed a bunch of issues I had. Coilovers are just a few bolts and shouldn't be to hard to replace yourself. Add on the maintenance shifty mentioned above and you got your target price.



Edit: added pics

 

Do you not have the space to work on it there? I hate to pile on, but trying to do this on a budget is hard enough, paying someone else to do the work makes it nearly impossible. It would actually be cheaper to invest in tools than to pay someone. Also, if your intention is to drive down to Mexico, you're going to want a decent tool kit to take with you in case something breaks.


Here are things I would NOT waste money on:

-spacer lifts
-add-a-leaf
-anything made by Monroe

This is one of those things where you'll actually save money by doing things right the first time.

 

Monroe, Rancho, Rough Country ...

 

I just want to say that photo is a thing of beauty.

 

Man San Fran?? Damn... If you could travel out of the area for work on your truck, would you?
I would suggest maybe call some shops in the Reno, NV area, just don't tell them you're in San Fran, it's about a 4-hour drive where labor maybe cheaper, I'm pretty sure there is a whole lot more of shops there... My stay in the Bay area You can probably double the labor cost from what @shifty` is stating. May have to budget for fuel, but at least it won't be as much in labor cost. Also as stated, upgrade your brakes, you will be adding more weight which may overtax your stopping power. Maybe the most overlooked upgrade on any build. Junkyards, or even the stealership, Steven's Creek Lexus I got an upgraded big brake kit for my SC400 undercutting RockAuto, so it pays to shop around and see what's more cost effective.

 

Honestly, anywhere north or east of the Bay could suffice. Sac, Modesto maybe? I saw so many little shops between Manchester and Fort Bragg while there a few months back, couple with nothing but Toyotas lined up, it's a bit longer of a trek, but if you're saving $$, get a cheap motel for a day or two and plan ahead ... But this is one of those cases where I'd just be pinging around for another member with more resources that's open to lending a hand.

 

100% agree.... My opinion was based on living in both places. Bay Area and Reno, NV

 

If his cam tabs are screwed I’ll toss the cam eliminators tabs out as a suggestion. For your type travel I’d want my setup as bulletproof as possible

the downside will be they’ll more than likely require some spc upper control arms

 

Appreciate the advice. I'm not too familiar with suspension systems, beyond the basics of bushing, control arms, etc. so I'm still wrapping my head around what the h*ll half this stuff is. I think accessing the condition of my truck as is would be my first step, to make sure nothing else is in need or work, and then focus on what needs to be upgraded. I feel like it'd be a tall order for me to attempt this work on my own, although the appeal of learning and saving the money is very high. I'm located specifically in Santa Cruz, CA, which is about 45 minutes from the proper SF Bay. It's also the "2nd highest cost of living in the country". I'm saving up to move out of here, and a majority of my savings is making this home on wheels.

I think my objective, besides comfort, is to get the truck as functional and well kept as possible while being as affordable as possible. Sounds like I still have a lot of options and decisions within that realm of thought.

 

I do not have free reign of my space outside my trailer, and I'm about maxed out on any other possessions. I move constantly and don't want to add a bunch of automotive tools to the mix. I also don't think I'll be eager to pack a notable tool kit when one of my biggest concerns is payload.

Why would you not suggest add-a-leaf? I'm aware why spacers and monroe suck.

 

Absolutely. Especially so if my intended work ends up being thousands of dollars and can be completed all at once. Although, it'll have to be a notable price difference, which I may not have much luck with anywhere around California from a reputable place. There are simply too many people with too much money for any reputable, half decent place to not charge as much as the possibly can.

 

An add-a-leaf is not going to be adequate for a camper. I went with ICON's AAL and it's essentially a band aid. It doesn't change the fact that my 21 year old leaf springs are worn out. ICON promised 1-2" of lift and I got zero.

 

SANTA CRUZ!!


Suspensionwise.... For your 4WD, here's the breakdown of your front suspension, I really need to take a bunch of pictures on my truck and do some proper write-up for others, but I'll link to this from elsewhere in case it helps others.

Almost all the components I'm going to show you here have rubber circular bushings (donuts) where they bolt up. If those are excessively cracked (see pic in next reply), those are things you want to replace while you're in there. Sometimes it's not obvious, like for the lower strut (front shock) mount, especially with shitty aftermarket shocks (Rancho brand, I'm looking at you) it's common to find them blown out within 10k-20k miles.

​

 

RE: Bushings ... Look at this swaybar end link. It has two bushings holding it to the swaybar, top and bottom. They should be roughly the same height. Bottom/lower one looks fine. Notice how cracked up and squashed the top one is?! Not only does it look like someone tightened it down too much, but I think the combo of age + weight on it in this photo are basically flattening it. These bushings would need to be replaced. IIRC, I think that's a 14mm or 16mm. It's literally something you could do in your driveway, with the truck ideally on the ground. But if you're lifting, even if yours are bad, you should just replace with an extended-length link here, which I linked in my reply above.

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Places to look for worn bushings:

• Check both upper control arm bushings
• Check both lower control arm bushings
• Check the bushing where your strut/shock meets the lower control arm
• Check all both swaybar link bushings
• Notice the swabar is C-clamped to the frame, check the bushings at every point the swaybar is attached to the frame

Also check for torn boots, leaks at boots, evidence of grease slinging:

• The rubber boots for your steering rack, shown in that last reply's pic, at the right-hand end of the yellow arrow's line, which cover your inner tie rod - check for active leaks and signs of any tears or rips
• The rubber boot on the outer tie rod, where you tie rod end meets the lower ball joint (follow the steering rod to the point it connects just below the brake disc/rotor)
• The rubber boots for your axle, which you'll see at the base of the yellow strut/shock in that last reply's pic, make sure clamp is solid, look for rips/leaks, and look above/below/around each end of the boot inside the fender/wheel area for lines of grease spatter, evidence it's slinging
• The rubber boot on your upper ball joint, which connects your upper control arm to the steering knuckle, basically serving as the upper steering pivot point
• I feel like I'm missing one here... maybe I'll edit later.

For axle-grease-slinging, this is what to look for, see in this video at 1m32s, notice the lines of grease sling directly above each peak in the boot, this is what you're looking out for:

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YH5Cf7uJV5Y​