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35's or 33's with 3"/1" or 4"/2" lift

Discussion in 'Wheels & Tires' started by alta-tundra, May 24, 2017.

  1. May 25, 2017 at 3:33 PM
    #31
    Jsena

    Jsena Trend setter, not a follower!!

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    Lmao, that's great advice :rofl::rofl:
     
    JAMES and joonbug[QUOTED] like this.
  2. May 25, 2017 at 4:21 PM
    #32
    JTP

    JTP The Big Black Moose

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    My Toyota mechanic up at the local dealer says that sticking your wheels OUT on 1st, 2nd, and especially 3rd gen Tundras is very hard on the front end bearings. They have had a lot of guys come in with front wheel bearings seizing / over heating issues. Those are sealed bearings and the grease cooks inside and the bearings fail. He even bought a laser "heat gun" type thermometer that he can show them where the front end bearing hosing temps so that they can see that they are cooking.

    He said that they all bitch and moan about the truck and will not acknowledge its an offset and tire size issue that caused the bearing to fail. Another contributing issue is wheel spacers to get your wheels even further out (usually spacers are used because of wrong wheel offset and too big of tires) and these guys come in with them all of the time with the same bearing issues.

    Bunch of that "don't think just do it" redneck engineering will cost you about 900.00 per front wheel bearing replacement plus correcting your wheel / tire problems and you might get lucky and not have to be towed to the dealer before the truck is un drivable, maybe. When they fail they fail. If you drive on it your whole front end is now ground to a pulp.

    Another reason that I didn't go wide on rubber, was greatfull that the offset on these wheels that I have wasn't wide / sticking too far out, and that the truck had ample lift for the tires that I wanted.

    Im too poor to do this cheap, twice, and have to buy new bearings (or worse) and another set of wheels and tires OR be down and have to be towed out in the middle of nowhere.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2017
    Jsena likes this.
  3. May 25, 2017 at 4:52 PM
    #33
    Jsena

    Jsena Trend setter, not a follower!!

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    Damn right, it ain't cheap!!!!! But like said above and 100x any prob with the truck they will always blame it on lift if they can.. without a doubt.. bro t fck em..
     
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  4. May 25, 2017 at 5:09 PM
    #34
    CJ21

    CJ21 CJ-21

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    DELAWARE
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    Clifford Alarm, 7" BDS lift with Fox coil overs, 20x12 with -44 off set fuel Mavericks , 35" TOYO Open Country Tires , Bush Wacker pocket fender flare ,2" rear Leaf springs, Bull Bar,
    35"s with a 7" BDS Lift with Fox coilers.
     
  5. May 25, 2017 at 5:10 PM
    #35
    CJ21

    CJ21 CJ-21

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    DELAWARE
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    Clifford Alarm, 7" BDS lift with Fox coil overs, 20x12 with -44 off set fuel Mavericks , 35" TOYO Open Country Tires , Bush Wacker pocket fender flare ,2" rear Leaf springs, Bull Bar,
    Tundra 2.jpg35"s with a 7" BDS Lift with Fox coilers.:laser::stirthepot:
     
    2GSequoia, JTP, Puud and 1 other person like this.
  6. May 25, 2017 at 5:11 PM
    #36
    CJ21

    CJ21 CJ-21

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    Clifford Alarm, 7" BDS lift with Fox coil overs, 20x12 with -44 off set fuel Mavericks , 35" TOYO Open Country Tires , Bush Wacker pocket fender flare ,2" rear Leaf springs, Bull Bar,
    20x12 -44tundra 24.jpg
     
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  7. May 25, 2017 at 7:34 PM
    #37
    joonbug

    joonbug °°°°°°°°°°

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    But your Toyota mechanic didn't mention anything about lower center of gravity or being top heavy or rolling your truck? Hmmm. It's a trade off.
     
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  8. May 25, 2017 at 7:39 PM
    #38
    JTP

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    Mechanic didn't need to warn me about driving stupid in a big / high CG vehicle. I don't feel the least bit top-heavy. Truck feels like its stock, actually better than stock. feels like the truck / ride was "engineered" correctly.

    Nothing at all crazy about it. Im a pilot so I am "flying" this thing like a 737 not a P51. I slow down to below 15 mph making 90 degree turns anyway and she rolls right through them. I have taken some nice high speed interstate curves and she feels very solid at 70+. No "roll" issues what so ever.

    Not ready to put number badges on the doors yet but I would not have any issue taking her through some twists and turns in a controlled environment.
     
    Eclipsed & Floating likes this.
  9. May 25, 2017 at 7:44 PM
    #39
    JTP

    JTP The Big Black Moose

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    Nice!
     
  10. May 25, 2017 at 7:45 PM
    #40
    joonbug

    joonbug °°°°°°°°°°

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    Well I wasn't talking specifically about you. And people don't roll their trucks on curves or taking turns. It's usually something like swerving on the highway. Or tipping over off-roading. I agree going too wide isn't the best thing for your bearings but once you start getting to a certain height, the truck is more stable with a wider stance. It's a trade off.
     
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  11. May 25, 2017 at 7:48 PM
    #41
    JTP

    JTP The Big Black Moose

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    I hear yea, dodging anything at speed is going to be dicey. Im not ready to put on my leathers and helmet and see what I get. I like having the ability of rolling right over shit with that lift and tall tires though :curls:

    Im just saying that my set up is right for me. I drive to Alaska and back every year with an RV or flat bed and its perfect for what Im doing with it. Highway.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2017
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  12. May 25, 2017 at 7:49 PM
    #42
    joonbug

    joonbug °°°°°°°°°°

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    Yup. Big wheels are fun. :D
     
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  13. May 26, 2017 at 3:47 AM
    #43
    R0CKETMAN

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    How does wider stance create "lower center of gravity"?
     
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  14. May 26, 2017 at 4:19 AM
    #44
    Netmonkey

    Netmonkey Don't be a Dumbass

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    +1

    this is a 12" wide tire on stock 20x9 +50mm offset wheels.

    [​IMG]
     
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  15. May 26, 2017 at 7:32 AM
    #45
    joonbug

    joonbug °°°°°°°°°°

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    Are you saying it doesn't?
     
  16. May 26, 2017 at 7:38 AM
    #46
    TTU19

    TTU19 Wreck 'Em

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    Fenders stick out right at about 2"...

    IMG_5424.jpg

    IMG_5423.jpg
     
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  17. May 26, 2017 at 9:32 AM
    #47
    JTP

    JTP The Big Black Moose

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    Think of it like this,

    If you made train tracks and train cars twice as wide but DID NOT make then any higher at all.

    They WILL have a lower center of gravity. They will not flip over as easy

    Im pretty sure that is why the NASCAR trucks (and cars) are slammed on the ground and have wide stances. LOWER CG

    On a pick up with going a few inches wider I'm sure has some of the same effect.

    BUT

    If you put shims on or off set the train wheels vs widening the axels and tracks (where the load is transferred to) I'm pretty sure that the ends of axels, shims, studs would do the same thing, wear out faster.

    Gravity pulls straight down. The weight of a truck or (train car) is transmitted straight down though the bearings, then through the wheels, and straight down through the tires to the road.

    If the wheel "offset" is wider that load transfer is no longer straight down. That load then is "offset" and the weakest point, the bearings, no longer has the straight down load that they were designed to carry, its out to the side, thus the bearings wear out prematurely.

    If you truly want to go wide and not wear out bearings or other front end components then widen the axels.

    Toyota or any other MFG designed their front ends and all bearings the way that the did, for straight down transfer of the load / weight of the vehicle.

    Yes, any combination of any lift combined with any wheel offset is the cause of this load transfer engineering being tampered with.

    Going straight up with a lift dose not effect the straight down load transfer. It dose make your CG (tipping point) higher which means that you have to slow down in the curves and that the truck will tip over easier on a slope.

    Shimming out and/or off-setting the wheels jacks with the straight down load transfer. Cant blame the truck or Toyota for that.

    My truck is set up for higher lift but maintained the factory straight down load transfer through the bearings, front end, wheels, and tires.

    I got a higher CG yes but its not crazy or dangerous high and the truck performs great in curves. The suspension is actually a lot tighter than stock and handles better. No dips and less body roll.

    Im running bigger diameter tires which is great (they look like big tires) but not crazy wide but wide enough.

    My bearings, front end geometry, and the load transfer remains the same as the stock set up / design so I am not wearing out my front end.
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2017
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  18. May 26, 2017 at 10:00 AM
    #48
    JTP

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    You can go A LITTLE wider and not damage the front end but the truck was not DESIGNED for that.

    If you want fat wide tires that sick way out then your obviously needing the right info on every move that you make and you will have to start cutting on the truck.

    Call the Baja guys and look at the extreme engineering and MONEY that they are going through to get wide stances and fat wide tires that stick way out on their stuff.
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2017
  19. May 26, 2017 at 10:20 AM
    #49
    Netmonkey

    Netmonkey Don't be a Dumbass

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    a wider stance does not lower COG. in your nascar example, the COG is lower because the axles (and tires) are closer to the center of the mass of the vehicle. that gives it a lower COG, not the wider stance or tires. however, the weight of adding larger and wider tires and wheels will lower your COG, but that is because of the weight, not the width. yes, it is more difficult to flip a vehicle with a very wide stance, but that is because of the leverage from the edge of the tire to the center of the mass, not because of the COG.
     
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  20. May 26, 2017 at 10:29 AM
    #50
    Jackalope

    Jackalope New Member

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    My vote is for the 295s on a +18. I have method grids (18x9+18) on my truck with 295/70/18 grabber x3s and the tires throw gravel down the side of the body pretty bad. Sounds like every forest road is an ambush. I think your flares would help mitigate that issue.
     
  21. May 26, 2017 at 10:31 AM
    #51
    JTP

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    Lets all go get engineering degrees and work at Toyota in the front end department for 20 years and get back to each other. :thumbsup:

    I have only built 7 Toyotas. 3 Tacomas, 1 Tundra, 2 Land Cruisers, and 1 FJ what do I know.
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2017
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  22. May 26, 2017 at 3:55 PM
    #52
    R0CKETMAN

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    Yes

    Please explain how offset impacts center of gravity.
     
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  23. May 26, 2017 at 6:47 PM
    #53
    joonbug

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    Yeah I'm not really sure. I was just asking you if you were telling me it doesn't or asking me how? IMG_3692.jpg I just figure given two trucks exact size and weight, the truck with a wider stance would have a lower COG. Like this picture wiff the dot representing COG. :notsure:
     
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  24. May 26, 2017 at 7:02 PM
    #54
    chphilo

    chphilo Tundra addict

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    You are confusing the center of gravity of a truck with torque that tend to overturn the truck. For the same size/weight of wheels/tires, offset does not affect the center of gravity. But since the centerline and the edge of the tire has increased, the torque that centrifugal force has to counteract to overturn a vehicle increases, hence a little more difficult to overturn. Since torque is proportional to the distance from the edge of tire to the centerline of the truck, the increase in torque is not that much though.
     
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  25. May 26, 2017 at 7:19 PM
    #55
    joonbug

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    Ok, found a better pic of what I'm trying to say. Not really sure what you're saying.
    IMG_3693.jpg
     
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  26. May 26, 2017 at 7:29 PM
    #56
    R0CKETMAN

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    That has nothing to do with wheel offset.

    Is a higher center of gravity more likely to roll over than a lowered center of gravity, yes.

    Wheel offset/stance doesn't govern vehicle center of gravity.
     
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  27. May 26, 2017 at 7:31 PM
    #57
    R0CKETMAN

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    The train wheel's wider stance will not lower the center of gravity..all things bring equal.
     
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  28. May 26, 2017 at 7:45 PM
    #58
    joonbug

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    What do you mean? That's exactly what wheel offset is. This pic is just magnified of what we're talking about.
     
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  29. May 26, 2017 at 8:03 PM
    #59
    Jackalope

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    Think joon may have "center of gravity" mixed up with "roll center."
     
  30. May 26, 2017 at 8:18 PM
    #60
    Gibzki

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    Looks closer to 1 1/2" to me.
     

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