1. Welcome to Tundras.com!

    You are currently viewing as a guest! To get full-access, you need to register for a FREE account.

    As a registered member, you’ll be able to:
    • Participate in all Tundra discussion topics
    • Transfer over your build thread from a different forum to this one
    • Communicate privately with other Tundra owners from around the world
    • Post your own photos in our Members Gallery
    • Access all special features of the site

Transmission cooler or not Thread

Discussion in '2.5 Gen Tundras (2014-2021)' started by Mad Max, Oct 12, 2020.

  1. Oct 12, 2020 at 6:04 PM
    #31
    Mad Max

    Mad Max [OP] New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2020
    Member:
    #53237
    Messages:
    682
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Max
    Vehicle:
    2021 Tundra Limited
    It reads as two buddies talking. He mentions no statistical data to back up opinion. If he would have said we experienced a failure rate of % due to thermal degradation of fluid and components it would have caught my attention. Degradation occurs at XX miles or hours. He seen defects in trucks from overheated fluid? Engineer would say we have seen defects in transmissions (not trucks) for overheated fluid which caused adhesive failure on the clutches leading to slipping. The first question my design function would ask him is, where is your data to support your claim?

    Trucks been the same since 2014 but people who design them don't know how they are used. Avoid 2022 at all cost!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
    Sundown5oh and Cpl_Punishment like this.
  2. Oct 12, 2020 at 6:11 PM
    #32
    GODZILLA

    GODZILLA Hail to the King, Baby.

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2019
    Member:
    #35514
    Messages:
    27,086
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Adam
    Wyoming
    Vehicle:
    2023 Solar Octane TRD Pro TACOMA, 2022 Honda CB500X
    Trying not to mod it
    X2 That seals the deal. Before I tow a travel trailer I will install a cooler. Thank you @ColoradoTJ for sharing this, and tell your friend thanks as well!
     
  3. Oct 12, 2020 at 6:14 PM
    #33
    ColoradoTJ

    ColoradoTJ Certified tow LEO Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    Member:
    #2766
    Messages:
    35,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Colorado
    Vehicle:
    LML 3500HD
    Calibrated Power 5 Tune pack, Allison 1000 tune, PPE deep trans pan, Cold/Hot CAC pipes, Banks CAI, PCV reroute, resonator delete, S&B 62 gal fuel tank, B&W GN hitch
    They did the work. If they post that information, pretty simple to figure out who it was.

    Buy a cooler, don’t buy one. For some people it would be a waste of money. From what I’ve seen, 75% of people would be a waste. Just service the transmission more often and be happy.

    I do my trans every 20-25k. Is that way overkill? Yes. Do I care? Nope. Warranties don’t help you when one is in the middle of nowhere with no help in sight for a while. I was reminded of that on my rescue thread in the middle of bumfked Wyoming and running out of trailer tires.
     
  4. Oct 12, 2020 at 6:41 PM
    #34
    ColoradoTJ

    ColoradoTJ Certified tow LEO Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    Member:
    #2766
    Messages:
    35,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Colorado
    Vehicle:
    LML 3500HD
    Calibrated Power 5 Tune pack, Allison 1000 tune, PPE deep trans pan, Cold/Hot CAC pipes, Banks CAI, PCV reroute, resonator delete, S&B 62 gal fuel tank, B&W GN hitch
    Will do. Where you live in Wyoming and the wind you get I would recommend a cooler for your truck.

    Back in the day I knew a automotive engineer that lived in Chili. He was wined and dined by Cummins and Dodge and flew him all over the world. Funny, he was also testing a Tundra with the TRD SC and was really impressed with the overall package. I lost contact with him and fear the worse (he was older). He lived on a yacht...liven the dream.
     
  5. Oct 12, 2020 at 7:10 PM
    #35
    Bakershack

    Bakershack Critical of Noncritical Thinkers

    Joined:
    May 20, 2020
    Member:
    #46846
    Messages:
    4,961
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Kelly
    Spanish Fort, AL
    Vehicle:
    2020 SSM 1794 4x4
    You're exactly right. Two buddies who trust each others' educated and experienced opinion. I've been an engineer for well over 20 years. There are several engineers and designers I know who don't make statements lightly about issues similar to this transmission cooling issue. Although there are appropriate times to ask, I don't push them for data on every issue because that would tell them that I don't trust their years, sometimes DECADES of experience. If @ColoradoTJ trusts the experienced opinion of this guy, then I'm not going to ask @ColoradoTJ to potentially offend his buddy by pushing for that.

    I plan to keep my Tundra for well over 10 years, well past even extended warranty coverage. Running the transmission hot now could decrease the life of the transmission in ways that do not reveal themselves until the warranty coverage has expired. And it certainly doesn't help that the light does not illuminate until the temp is significantly higher than the fluid is rated for, OR that there are no ATF temp gauges! I don't tow often, but when I need to tow, I might not have enough time to get the cooler parts delivered and installed before the trip. If the parts are installed carefully and properly, then the burden of proof is on Toyota if they want to deny a warranty claim, and it is quite easy to illustrate the BENEFIT of the cooler as evidenced by the decreased operational temps.

    I personally plan to install the cooler, but likely not until next Spring or Summer because I'm pretty certain that I won't be towing anything significant before then.

    I read every post on the other threads regarding this subject. I know they got heated, and then locked due to some people being offended by the opinions of others - opinions based on actual observed and recorded ATF temps that were higher than experienced tow-ers were comfortable with. It is my opinion that this thread was started to continue the argument ad nauseum, but I am glad it was started because of @ColoradoTJ's post. That post just reinforced my decision to add the cooler.
     
  6. Oct 12, 2020 at 7:18 PM
    #36
    ColoradoTJ

    ColoradoTJ Certified tow LEO Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    Member:
    #2766
    Messages:
    35,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Colorado
    Vehicle:
    LML 3500HD
    Calibrated Power 5 Tune pack, Allison 1000 tune, PPE deep trans pan, Cold/Hot CAC pipes, Banks CAI, PCV reroute, resonator delete, S&B 62 gal fuel tank, B&W GN hitch
    I was on the bandwagon after Greg M oil sample analysis for not getting one. However, he was towing 7K in some high ambient temps, but only for 18K miles (2K was actually towing). Not enough time towing to make an end all decision about this topic.
     
  7. Oct 12, 2020 at 7:19 PM
    #37
    GODZILLA

    GODZILLA Hail to the King, Baby.

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2019
    Member:
    #35514
    Messages:
    27,086
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Adam
    Wyoming
    Vehicle:
    2023 Solar Octane TRD Pro TACOMA, 2022 Honda CB500X
    Trying not to mod it
    Kinda my thoughts as well. I think spring time I will try to get it done. Winter is basically here, and I only tow my little utility trailer with Quadzilla on it, for now.
     
    ColoradoTJ[QUOTED] and ElNopal like this.
  8. Oct 12, 2020 at 7:30 PM
    #38
    ColoradoTJ

    ColoradoTJ Certified tow LEO Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    Member:
    #2766
    Messages:
    35,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Colorado
    Vehicle:
    LML 3500HD
    Calibrated Power 5 Tune pack, Allison 1000 tune, PPE deep trans pan, Cold/Hot CAC pipes, Banks CAI, PCV reroute, resonator delete, S&B 62 gal fuel tank, B&W GN hitch

    This guy gets it. Advice can either be used or discarded.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2020
  9. Oct 12, 2020 at 7:32 PM
    #39
    Coffee*8)

    Coffee*8) New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2020
    Member:
    #51608
    Messages:
    96
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Chris
    Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    2020 Tundra Crew Max
    + Trans cooler
    Think the 'minority' that use their trucks as trucks will install after market coolers. So Toyota may never see the ramifications of this.
     
  10. Oct 12, 2020 at 8:00 PM
    #40
    Bakershack

    Bakershack Critical of Noncritical Thinkers

    Joined:
    May 20, 2020
    Member:
    #46846
    Messages:
    4,961
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Kelly
    Spanish Fort, AL
    Vehicle:
    2020 SSM 1794 4x4
    If this decision by Toyota causes significant issues, the few of us on Tundras.com installing the coolers won't change things. I don't care if there are never any issues. I still believe, based on all of the discussion on this site, that the best way to get the longest life out of my Tundra is to control the temps better than the OEM design.
     
  11. Oct 12, 2020 at 8:34 PM
    #41
    ColoradoTJ

    ColoradoTJ Certified tow LEO Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    Member:
    #2766
    Messages:
    35,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Colorado
    Vehicle:
    LML 3500HD
    Calibrated Power 5 Tune pack, Allison 1000 tune, PPE deep trans pan, Cold/Hot CAC pipes, Banks CAI, PCV reroute, resonator delete, S&B 62 gal fuel tank, B&W GN hitch
    Power Plant. GE Frame 7 FA gas turbines. You probably have some LM2500 or LM6000 gas turbines out there. Very reliable simple cycle units that you can pretty much just leave alone.
     
  12. Oct 12, 2020 at 8:45 PM
    #42
    ColoradoTJ

    ColoradoTJ Certified tow LEO Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    Member:
    #2766
    Messages:
    35,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Colorado
    Vehicle:
    LML 3500HD
    Calibrated Power 5 Tune pack, Allison 1000 tune, PPE deep trans pan, Cold/Hot CAC pipes, Banks CAI, PCV reroute, resonator delete, S&B 62 gal fuel tank, B&W GN hitch
    Thread cleaned. Had to do some self moderation to stay on topic.
     
    ryanwgregg and Lake.Life24 like this.
  13. Oct 13, 2020 at 3:50 AM
    #43
    Bammer

    Bammer I'm disinclined to acquiesce your request.

    Joined:
    May 23, 2019
    Member:
    #30901
    Messages:
    1,386
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    John
    Monroe, CT
    Vehicle:
    2019 Tundra SR5 TRD Crew Max 4x4
    Thanks ColoradoTJ ! :thumbsup:

    My decision has been made, and my kit is ordered. but this solidifies my decision as the right one for me. :amen:
     
    ryanwgregg, ColoradoTJ and GODZILLA like this.
  14. Oct 13, 2020 at 5:13 AM
    #44
    Mad Max

    Mad Max [OP] New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2020
    Member:
    #53237
    Messages:
    682
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Max
    Vehicle:
    2021 Tundra Limited
    No half ton is designed for 100% duty rating at max capability. I believe how the vast majority (95%) use their truck they will never have an issue related to transmission temperature issues. Towing less than 10% of time. Only my opinion I don't have any secret information. If you are towing 75% of time get a Superduty, their transmission are 3 foot longer than Toyotas with their own water cooled system. They are designed for 100% duty rating. Only issue is you will live with its own set of demons. Toyota made the right decision based on ROI. I don't tow even close to 10% of the time, no cooler for me.
     
    Sundown5oh likes this.
  15. Oct 13, 2020 at 5:28 AM
    #45
    Bammer

    Bammer I'm disinclined to acquiesce your request.

    Joined:
    May 23, 2019
    Member:
    #30901
    Messages:
    1,386
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    John
    Monroe, CT
    Vehicle:
    2019 Tundra SR5 TRD Crew Max 4x4

    If you tow within capacity, why not a half ton? Landscapers do it all the time. All depends on the application.
     
    GODZILLA and Cpl_Punishment like this.
  16. Oct 13, 2020 at 5:44 AM
    #46
    blanchard7684

    blanchard7684 New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2018
    Member:
    #21856
    Messages:
    879
    Gender:
    Male
    And they had the older shift mapping that built up more heat.
     
  17. Oct 13, 2020 at 6:06 AM
    #47
    Coffee*8)

    Coffee*8) New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2020
    Member:
    #51608
    Messages:
    96
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Chris
    Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    2020 Tundra Crew Max
    + Trans cooler
    When towing without a cooler can feel the heat pouring into the cabin when you stop and roll down the windows to back up.

    Think more cooling happens with heat transfer to the air then to the heater/cooler.
     
  18. Oct 13, 2020 at 7:01 AM
    #48
    Rotaryphoneuser

    Rotaryphoneuser New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2020
    Member:
    #45102
    Messages:
    258
    Gender:
    Male
    Ontario. Canada
    Vehicle:
    2018 Cement CrewMax
    Well, if I have a 2019+ Tundra, I would get on. I spent more money on silly things than trany cooler.
     
  19. Oct 13, 2020 at 7:14 AM
    #49
    Bakershack

    Bakershack Critical of Noncritical Thinkers

    Joined:
    May 20, 2020
    Member:
    #46846
    Messages:
    4,961
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Kelly
    Spanish Fort, AL
    Vehicle:
    2020 SSM 1794 4x4
    That Million Mile Tundra that was in the news a few months ago was a work horse - towing and hauling hot shot equipment for its entire life. So yes, Toyota does design for full duty. Or at least they used to. I would love to hear from a 2019 owner who has put his truck through its paces with regards to towing and hauling with the OEM setup. I'm not sure we have anyone like that on this forum. They're probably too busy driving! :)
     
  20. Oct 13, 2020 at 7:19 AM
    #50
    14burrito

    14burrito IG @14burrito

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2014
    Member:
    #798
    Messages:
    3,819
    Vehicle:
    2014 SR5 CM 4x4 5.7
    @ADSracingshocks - F 3 point ohh / R 2.5 - w/clickers @camburgracing - uniball UCA @rigidindustries - 40" amber/white split, Dually XL, D2 @coopertires - 35/12.5/17 STT MAXX @bayareametalfab - low pro bed rack @toyotausa - 17" rock warrior @sdhqoffroad - rock sliders, a-pillar @hondogarage / @apple / @gaiagps / @dualgps- navigation @wheelersoffroadinc - superbumps
    We have a guy on our AZTG FB page who has a MY19 and tows what seems like almost daily. I'll reach out to him, get more details, see if we can get him signed up and then maybe try an get a sample pulled for Blqckatone analysis.
     
  21. Oct 13, 2020 at 7:23 AM
    #51
    GODZILLA

    GODZILLA Hail to the King, Baby.

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2019
    Member:
    #35514
    Messages:
    27,086
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Adam
    Wyoming
    Vehicle:
    2023 Solar Octane TRD Pro TACOMA, 2022 Honda CB500X
    Trying not to mod it
    That'd be awesome. More data, excuse me @hagrid... More ROCK SOLID data is never a bad thing.
     
  22. Oct 13, 2020 at 7:34 AM
    #52
    Avi8or

    Avi8or New Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2020
    Member:
    #46920
    Messages:
    152
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Johann
    MO
    Vehicle:
    2020 Limited Crewmax
    TJ. Does your buddy have any comment on the current formulation of the WS fluid? There has been info floating around that it was reformulated as a full synthetic at some point in the last few years.
     
  23. Oct 13, 2020 at 7:35 AM
    #53
    14burrito

    14burrito IG @14burrito

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2014
    Member:
    #798
    Messages:
    3,819
    Vehicle:
    2014 SR5 CM 4x4 5.7
    @ADSracingshocks - F 3 point ohh / R 2.5 - w/clickers @camburgracing - uniball UCA @rigidindustries - 40" amber/white split, Dually XL, D2 @coopertires - 35/12.5/17 STT MAXX @bayareametalfab - low pro bed rack @toyotausa - 17" rock warrior @sdhqoffroad - rock sliders, a-pillar @hondogarage / @apple / @gaiagps / @dualgps- navigation @wheelersoffroadinc - superbumps
    I have good news, I'll post more specifics after I call the tech who will be working on his truck :)
     
  24. Oct 13, 2020 at 7:39 AM
    #54
    Clemsonman14

    Clemsonman14 New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2020
    Member:
    #50545
    Messages:
    303
    Vehicle:
    2020 SR5 Crewmax 4x2
    And wasn’t it the 4.6 setup as well with no cooler?
     
  25. Oct 13, 2020 at 7:48 AM
    #55
    swampshark

    swampshark New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2019
    Member:
    #37439
    Messages:
    60
    Gender:
    Male
    south la
    Vehicle:
    2020 MGM SR5
    Transmissions - (Automatic) Bearings, bushings, gear shafts, clutch plates and drums, oil pumps, servo units, rings, governor, torus units, torque converter, and valves. (Standard) Bearings, bushings, shafts and spacers, main drive gear, main shaft, synchronizing drum, second gear, low gear, reverse gear, and all other internal gears. No coverage is provided for any electrical component pertaining to the operation of any transmission. *The transmission case on both standard and automatic transmissions are also covered if mechanical failure was the direct result of the failure of a part covered by this policy. The odometer driven gear, manual transmission clutch disc, pressure plate, clutch release bearing and pilot bearing are not covered at any time or for any reason.

    So....I copied and pasted Toyota's "Lifetime" power train warranty (for transmission) above...all work (new scheduled maintenance and repairs) must be done within the specified timeframe as listed in owners manual and subsequent repairs after warranty must also be performed at dealer to qualify. What are they leaving out with respect to transmission?
     
  26. Oct 13, 2020 at 7:54 AM
    #56
    ColoradoTJ

    ColoradoTJ Certified tow LEO Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    Member:
    #2766
    Messages:
    35,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Colorado
    Vehicle:
    LML 3500HD
    Calibrated Power 5 Tune pack, Allison 1000 tune, PPE deep trans pan, Cold/Hot CAC pipes, Banks CAI, PCV reroute, resonator delete, S&B 62 gal fuel tank, B&W GN hitch
    I can ask.
     
    ryanwgregg and Avi8or[QUOTED] like this.
  27. Oct 13, 2020 at 7:56 AM
    #57
    timsp8

    timsp8 Former Tundra owner for 13 years

    Joined:
    May 11, 2018
    Member:
    #15231
    Messages:
    3,524
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Tim
    NY
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tundra Limited Crewmax - Traded In
    If you are getting that from Team Toyota website, that’s the dealers warranty and not Toyota. A lot of dealers do a “lifetime” powertrain warranty to get you to do all your service there. If you don’t, I think it’s void.


    Team Toyota
    • 1788 O'Neal Lane, Baton Rouge, LA 70816
    https://www.team-toyota.com/lifetime-powertrain-warranty.html
     
    Giskk and ryanwgregg like this.
  28. Oct 13, 2020 at 8:02 AM
    #58
    TTund16

    TTund16 New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2017
    Member:
    #5798
    Messages:
    1,150
    Gender:
    Male
    Curious how Toyota tests the trucks under load or when towing or test any design changes? That's engineering 101. Isn't there a towing test in the desert and how can the Truck pass these test?
    Maybe they don't test it anymore!
     
  29. Oct 13, 2020 at 8:02 AM
    #59
    ColoradoTJ

    ColoradoTJ Certified tow LEO Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    Member:
    #2766
    Messages:
    35,621
    Gender:
    Male
    Colorado
    Vehicle:
    LML 3500HD
    Calibrated Power 5 Tune pack, Allison 1000 tune, PPE deep trans pan, Cold/Hot CAC pipes, Banks CAI, PCV reroute, resonator delete, S&B 62 gal fuel tank, B&W GN hitch
    We are in agreement on this. Most people will never have an issue except the members that actually tow on the upper limit of the ratings for 8K miles or more per year or the ones that do more difficult off-road adventures.
     
    ryanwgregg and Clemsonman14 like this.
  30. Oct 13, 2020 at 8:21 AM
    #60
    14burrito

    14burrito IG @14burrito

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2014
    Member:
    #798
    Messages:
    3,819
    Vehicle:
    2014 SR5 CM 4x4 5.7
    @ADSracingshocks - F 3 point ohh / R 2.5 - w/clickers @camburgracing - uniball UCA @rigidindustries - 40" amber/white split, Dually XL, D2 @coopertires - 35/12.5/17 STT MAXX @bayareametalfab - low pro bed rack @toyotausa - 17" rock warrior @sdhqoffroad - rock sliders, a-pillar @hondogarage / @apple / @gaiagps / @dualgps- navigation @wheelersoffroadinc - superbumps
    It was already addressed in one of the many many threads, might have been part of the clean up though.

    Davis Dam, it passed the tow test without the front mount aux cooler.

    SAEJ2807
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2020
    Saltyhero13 and ColoradoTJ like this.
To Top