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2019 2020 transmission cooler missing

Discussion in '2.5 Gen Tundras (2014-2021)' started by sgtfluffy16, Aug 10, 2020.

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  1. Aug 11, 2020 at 12:59 PM
    #91
    blanchard7684

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    blanchard7684 New Member

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    Trying to research what the Toyota JWS3324 spec consists of to get to the 280F temp limit. Note Mobil makes an ATF for Japanese OEMs called ATF 3324.

    First document.

    Notice the temp ranges of PAO and Polyol Esters.

    https://www.machinerylubrication.com/Read/31106/polyalphaolefin-pao-lubricants

    Second Document

    Mobil ATF 3324

    https://www.mobil.com/en-cn/passenger-vehicle-lube/pds/gl-xx-mobil-atf-3324

    Third document

    Mobil jet 254 a POE based oil for high temp stability in gas turbines

    https://www.mobil.com/en-us/aviation/pds/gl-xx-mobil-jet-oil-254

    Note that MSDS only list substances that are hazardous under the hazcom standard. it isn't an accurate description of the actual composition. In fact the sub note on the MSDS for WS indicates this clearly. It is a trade secret.

    However based on other characteristics and information, it looks like if it is a blend of polyol ester oil and PAO as a base it could legitimately hit 280F and maintain stability.

    Overall though I'd say that the charts floating around that indicate trans fluid is DOA at 175 F are based on a mineral oil not synthetic.

    It is also possible to create a blend of oils that can reach fluids temps as high as 280F and maintain stability.

    I work with gas turbines that have oil temps that are well above 280F and their oil systems don't get oil changes for many years. In fact the units have very little varnishing when torn down during overhaul.

    All I'm saying is its possible to get an oil to live a long life at really high temps without component damage or seal damage.

    My guess is that WS fluid is a POE/PAO mixture with high phosphate concentrations.
     
    blanchard7684, Aug 11, 2020
    #91
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  2. Aug 11, 2020 at 1:01 PM
    #92
    osidepunker

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    osidepunker OsidePunker

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    The shock oil I use is rated to 450f haha
     
    osidepunker, Aug 11, 2020
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  3. Aug 11, 2020 at 1:18 PM
    #93
    jetfishn

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    jetfishn New Member

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    Been reading about this on some of the other forums, couple guys have had the trans overheat light go on, while towing, with 2020 Tundras. The overheat light comes on at 302 F ! Clutch damage and seal damage starts around 290 F so you will eventually see a pile of blown transmissions it will just take time. The trans fluid may be able to take the extreme heat but the clutches and seals will die prematurely. This has me looking elsewhere for a new tow rig. I don't want to have to add a trans cooler for 600.00 or so to a new truck and have it void warranties in the process. There are other decent towing trucks on the market now with aux radiator coolers in place still.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2020
    jetfishn, Aug 11, 2020
    #93
  4. Aug 11, 2020 at 1:28 PM
    #94
    Cpl_Punishment

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    Cpl_Punishment All men are equal when their memory fades

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    Tundra isn't an HD truck.
     
    Cpl_Punishment, Aug 11, 2020
    #94
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  5. Aug 11, 2020 at 1:33 PM
    #95
    jetfishn

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    jetfishn New Member

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    Tundra is HD to me compared to what I am coming from, a 06 Tacoma OR. I feel sorry for the customers that tow heavy sucked into buying new Tundras with only a heat transfer unit for cooling. I won't do it personally.
     
    jetfishn, Aug 11, 2020
    #95
  6. Aug 11, 2020 at 2:26 PM
    #96
    sgtfluffy16

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    sgtfluffy16 [OP] New Member

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    Great info. Thanks! But it doesn't show the thermal degradation temperature
     
    sgtfluffy16, Aug 11, 2020
    #96
  7. Aug 11, 2020 at 2:27 PM
    #97
    glowblue

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    glowblue From time to time

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    I agree with @AZBoatHauler - sell the truck if you don’t like it or what Toyota sold you. Prices are through the roof on used Tundras right now. I love my 2019 DC but was seriously thinking about selling because I was offered +$3000 more than I paid 18 months ago!
     
    glowblue, Aug 11, 2020
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  8. Aug 11, 2020 at 3:46 PM
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    sgtfluffy16

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    sgtfluffy16 [OP] New Member

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    im with you, but there is A TON of proof out there that the transmission fluid temperatures are HIGH. i am getting the ball rolling because the ONLY way a remedy is going to come about is if enough people bring the concern to Toyota. then they will do their own in house testing to see we aren't just blow smoke out of our butts, because we have legitimate proof of our findings. When Toyota duplicates the same concern they will dig into it further for a remedy. I still would urge you to call Toyota and express the concern.
     
    sgtfluffy16, Aug 11, 2020
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  9. Aug 11, 2020 at 3:47 PM
    #99
    FrenchToasty

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    FrenchToasty The Desert rat, SSEM #5/25, 6 lug enthusiast

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    I don’t know if anyone has told you, but, CALL TOYOTA!
     
    FrenchToasty, Aug 11, 2020
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  10. Aug 11, 2020 at 3:50 PM
    #100
    sgtfluffy16

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    sgtfluffy16 [OP] New Member

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    im honestly not very concerned at TC temps because they get hot because that is where the most of the friction is in the transmission and fluid because its spinning all the time. my main concern is seeing the trans pan temps above 220. that is when i am getting concerned. but 3500 lbs is NOTHING especially when driving down a highway during the rain. that trans should be cool no where near as high as the temps i was seeing. But driving around with me in the truck and nothing else and seeing 214 at the pan is high. just waiting until next month when i drive 5 hours, 7k lbs. ill be sure to be taking pics of the readings then.
     
    sgtfluffy16, Aug 11, 2020
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  11. Aug 11, 2020 at 3:52 PM
    #101
    sgtfluffy16

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    sgtfluffy16 [OP] New Member

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    no?? really??? i started the thread. i called Toyota. working diligently on it now.. Waiting for some more information to come in to make it a rock solid case.
     
    sgtfluffy16, Aug 11, 2020
    #101
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  12. Aug 11, 2020 at 4:21 PM
    #102
    Black Wolf

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    Black Wolf Chillin' in Alamosa

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    Yeah, so what, you rarely flex your tunny....:fistbump:
     
    Black Wolf, Aug 11, 2020
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  13. Aug 11, 2020 at 4:32 PM
    #103
    Black Wolf

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    Black Wolf Chillin' in Alamosa

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    Do you have "anything" other than suppositions and anecdotal crap based upon nothing that has been proven to cause long term harm to our Aisin trannys? If you order a HD RAM, sorry for bringing RAM name into this, the HD RAM tranny is an Aisin....near bullet proof....just sayin. Yes, I have a 14 and have the cooler. So what? Ha!
     
    Black Wolf, Aug 11, 2020
    #103
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  14. Aug 11, 2020 at 4:40 PM
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    jetfishn

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    jetfishn, Aug 11, 2020
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  15. Aug 11, 2020 at 4:55 PM
    #105
    sgtfluffy16

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    sgtfluffy16 [OP] New Member

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    I am one of those persons. I came from an 07 Tacoma double cab TRD sport. But I bought the tundra so I could haul my car trailer much safer then my Tacoma. Plus it was time for a newer vehicle. I still do not regret getting the tundra at all. I just would like this transmission issue addressed. I see the link that you posted below. Definitely is good information. I am aware of all of that but to educate others it's a good website
     
    sgtfluffy16, Aug 11, 2020
    #105
  16. Aug 11, 2020 at 4:56 PM
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    GODZILLA

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    GODZILLA, Aug 11, 2020
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  17. Aug 11, 2020 at 5:22 PM
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    hagrid

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    So what truck is High Definition?
     
    hagrid, Aug 11, 2020
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  18. Aug 11, 2020 at 5:26 PM
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    GODZILLA

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    GODZILLA, Aug 11, 2020
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  19. Aug 11, 2020 at 5:41 PM
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    Black Wolf

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    Black Wolf, Aug 11, 2020
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  20. Aug 11, 2020 at 5:43 PM
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    Black Wolf

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    Black Wolf, Aug 11, 2020
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  21. Aug 11, 2020 at 5:46 PM
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    JohnLakeman

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    For 2011-2018, the external fluid cooler is actually built into the top of the AC condenser, not the radiator.

    In 2019, the external fluid cooler in the AC condenser was eliminated. But, Toyota parts literature calls the device on the side of the transmission a "cooler". Previously it was called a "warmer" in transmission literature. And, technically, that device on the side of the transmission does become a cooler when fluid temperature exceeds coolant temperature (about 195*). Heat then starts flowing from the fluid into the coolant through a pitifully small heat transfer area to virtually no effect. And that's why Toyota is never going to do anything about claims they lied on the window sticker about "eng/tran coolers".
     
    JohnLakeman, Aug 11, 2020
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  22. Aug 11, 2020 at 5:47 PM
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    Black Wolf

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    I don't even want here about "systemic" tranny overheating yet.....facts please...
     
    Black Wolf, Aug 11, 2020
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  23. Aug 11, 2020 at 5:50 PM
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    Black Wolf

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    John, you can explain this in many ways that makes common sense but it's going on to a few determined deaf ears...and where is my real auto LSD?
     
    Black Wolf, Aug 11, 2020
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  24. Aug 11, 2020 at 5:59 PM
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    Cpl_Punishment

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    Cpl_Punishment, Aug 11, 2020
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  25. Aug 11, 2020 at 5:59 PM
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    FrenchToasty

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    FrenchToasty, Aug 11, 2020
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  26. Aug 11, 2020 at 6:01 PM
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    JohnLakeman

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    Look at this way...positraction differentials are over-rated. Since you can't kill a whale to get the right oil for the clutch plates anymore, you have to put in a little bottle of additive to keep the plates from chattering in turns. Getting the right amount of majic can be hard, sometimes they chatter anyway. Toyota is kind of "simulating" a positraction differential by applying the right brakes. :notsure: :D
     
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  27. Aug 11, 2020 at 6:03 PM
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    Black Wolf

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    Honestly, I'd rather have some MooseHead and Cheezies right about now...
     
    Black Wolf, Aug 11, 2020
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  28. Aug 11, 2020 at 6:04 PM
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    Cpl_Punishment

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    Cpl_Punishment, Aug 11, 2020
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  29. Aug 11, 2020 at 6:05 PM
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    Black Wolf

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    Don't tell anyone but I had some whale steak while I was in Japan. Damn good. Where's my Save the Whale sticker...damn it...
     
    Black Wolf, Aug 11, 2020
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  30. Aug 11, 2020 at 6:06 PM
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    Black Wolf

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    I'm not choosy eh...
     
    Black Wolf, Aug 11, 2020
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