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Winch options

Discussion in 'Recovery & Gear' started by 08sequoia, Apr 9, 2018.

  1. Apr 9, 2018 at 10:16 PM
    #1
    08sequoia

    08sequoia [OP] New Member

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    Soooooo I’m still new so don’t chew up to bad. I need a winch that has a “remote mountable box”. And I have no clue what the hell that means. I’ve looked through google a good amount. Can anyone help me make the right choice?
     
  2. Apr 9, 2018 at 10:25 PM
    #2
    zcarpenter92

    zcarpenter92 Yotas and Yellow Jackets

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  3. Apr 9, 2018 at 10:27 PM
    #3
    Cemented

    Cemented Function over Form

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    Try searching for solenoid relocation kit vs remote mountable box. Most winches allow for you to relocate the solenoid to another spot, either with a kit or just your own cabling and mounting options. If you aren’t familiar with it, the solenoid is the part that you’ll often see mounted on the top center of an exposed winch, and where you’d connect your wired remote.
     
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  4. Apr 9, 2018 at 10:43 PM
    #4
    08sequoia

    08sequoia [OP] New Member

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    Got it. I wasn’t sure of the verbiage. I’m getting a bumper and the manufacture told me that I should look for that.
     
  5. Apr 9, 2018 at 10:55 PM
    #5
    Cemented

    Cemented Function over Form

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    Cool. A lot of different winches should work, I just got a Smittybilt X2O that I’m happy with so far. Warn Zeon are popular choices. Depends on what you want to spend, whether you want steel or synthetic line, wired or wireless remote. Most should allow you to relocate the control box/solenoid.
     
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  6. Apr 9, 2018 at 10:57 PM
    #6
    08sequoia

    08sequoia [OP] New Member

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    I was thinking of smitty, would you recommend steel vs synthetic?
     
  7. Apr 9, 2018 at 10:57 PM
    #7
    08sequoia

    08sequoia [OP] New Member

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    Thank you btw.
     
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  8. Apr 9, 2018 at 10:59 PM
    #8
    Cemented

    Cemented Function over Form

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    I went synthetic, lighter and seems safer to me if something goes wrong.
     
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  9. Apr 9, 2018 at 11:07 PM
    #9
    08sequoia

    08sequoia [OP] New Member

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    Got it. I really appreciate all your help.
     
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  10. Apr 9, 2018 at 11:27 PM
    #10
    831Tun

    831Tun heartless Bastrd

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    Synthetic lines are as strong or stronger than steel rope of the equivalent diameter. At least that's what they say in the marine industry.
     
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  11. Apr 9, 2018 at 11:58 PM
    #11
    Spvrtan

    Spvrtan Amateur fabricator

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  12. Apr 10, 2018 at 4:08 AM
    #12
    Black Wolf

    Black Wolf Bigfoot Hunter, Sasquatch too, but not Yeti

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    Most decent winches come with a control (solenoid) box that can be mounted pretty much anywhere. Top, side, and not even on the winch itself. The only limitation is the length of the control box cables. Not hard to fab up some longer cabling.
     
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  13. Apr 10, 2018 at 4:15 AM
    #13
    Black Wolf

    Black Wolf Bigfoot Hunter, Sasquatch too, but not Yeti

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    The thing to remember about synthetic rope is that it is very susceptible to heat. You need to be aware of over heating the winch drum. My X20 has built in safe guards to prevent overheating. I'm old school. Use steel rope...
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2018
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  14. Apr 10, 2018 at 6:43 AM
    #14
    trayday

    trayday New Member

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    I have a Smittybilt and relocated the control box to fit in my bumper. I snapped the original cable and replaced with rope, the cable would bind and get tangled. I called Smittybilt last month about my winch not working, they asked me how long ago I purchased the unit and sent me an updated box that fixed the problem.
     
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  15. Apr 10, 2018 at 6:57 AM
    #15
    Black Wolf

    Black Wolf Bigfoot Hunter, Sasquatch too, but not Yeti

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    • Classic problem with steel cable. Did you prep the steel cable before you used it? When new you need to free spool the cable all the way out until only one layer left on spool. You then need to winch it in under a minimum 1000 lb load. This allows the steel cable to properly set. If you don't do this step first you will get severe binding and can snap the cable when winching in under load the first time. It's extremely hard to snap a steel cable if properly prepped prior to first use. I've never had binding issues with steel rope.
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2018
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  16. Apr 10, 2018 at 7:23 AM
    #16
    Black Wolf

    Black Wolf Bigfoot Hunter, Sasquatch too, but not Yeti

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    Smittybilt has great customer service and great warranties.
     
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  17. Apr 10, 2018 at 8:28 AM
    #17
    gosolo

    gosolo You Don’t Know Who I Am But I Know Where You Live

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    Another thought regarding wire rope cable vs synthetic,
    I have heard that in cold wet conditions a synthetic rope that has been spooled when wet can freeze into a pretty solid ice block.
    I always have had wire cables on my winches and as long as you pre-stretch the cable when new, like @matluth said, and always lay in snug after use, you will never have a problem
     
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  18. Apr 10, 2018 at 8:50 AM
    #18
    trayday

    trayday New Member

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    First use was close to 6k lbs, unsure if only 1 layer left but we pulled a lot of cable out. The binding and break was after multiple uses and the day the cable snapped, a 20k lb winch pulled me out of a hole, wasn't a cheap day.
     
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  19. Apr 10, 2018 at 8:55 AM
    #19
    Black Wolf

    Black Wolf Bigfoot Hunter, Sasquatch too, but not Yeti

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    Sometimes things happen. :mudding: haha.. I used to always have a spare rope. I'll probably get a synthetic for my spare. Who knows..I may switch over to synth but I really prefer the all around usefulness of steel.. Synthetic definitely a lot easier to handle. :oldglory:
     
  20. Apr 10, 2018 at 9:24 AM
    #20
    Over the LINE

    Over the LINE New Member

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    Looks like where I mounted my control box.

    P6280008.jpg
     
  21. Jun 4, 2018 at 6:59 PM
    #21
    counselor

    counselor New Member

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    I attended the Overland Jamboree or whatever it's called in Arizona a couple years ago. The Warn rep advised if you use the winch frequently, then go with the synthetic rope, if used infrequently, then go with the steel cable as it lasts longer.
     
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  22. Jun 4, 2018 at 7:08 PM
    #22
    Black Wolf

    Black Wolf Bigfoot Hunter, Sasquatch too, but not Yeti

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    yep.jpg
     
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  23. Jun 5, 2018 at 11:19 PM
    #23
    counselor

    counselor New Member

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    By the way, nice Vizsla.
     
  24. Jul 15, 2018 at 1:50 AM
    #24
    Slp82

    Slp82 New Member

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    2014 Tundra 4x4 5.7L DC; Bilstein 6112s @ 1.9"; 35x12.50 Nitto Ridge Grapplers on 20x9 wheels with +25 backspacing; DV8 front & rear bumpers, Engo 12k winch (SOLD) 2005 Tundra RC 4.7 4x4 w/3" spacer, addicted offroad tube winch bumper w/9k Engo, homemade sliders, skid row skid plate, 285/75r16 Cooper AT3, Detroit trutrac in rear.
    Look into Engo winches. They are engineered in USA but built in China to save money. They use a series wound motor just like the high end Warn winches. Some winches use to use permanent magnet motors and those are not as good as a series wound motor. Engo also has a lifetime warranty on all the gears, drum, brake, internals, and structure. The electrical components have a 1 year warranty but the winch is rebuildable as well. I have had one for about 5 years on my 2005 Tundra and it has never failed me. I have winched myself out about a dozen times and probably winched out about another 50 other people over the years. They are on sale right now for about $310 shipped to your door. Here is the link:

    http://www.rockridge4wd.com/c-1207042-winches-recovery-gear-8000-to-16000-lbs-electric-winches.html

    Also I am not sure if this 12% discount code is still working but enter "FREEDOM". That knocked off another $45 from the already on sale price for a total of about $310 shipped for the 12k steel cable Engo winch.

    As far as the synthetic rope vs steel cable, I asked multiple winch techs at various companies and this is what most told me:

    Cable requires very little maintenance compared to synthetic rope. My wire that came with my Engo winch is galvanized and after 5 years with no cover, it is still not rusted. I have never cleaned the mud or sand out of it and it doesnt hurt the wire. If you get sand or mud in synthetic rope and put a load on it, the sand will cut the rope internally like sand abrasives. If you get sand or mud on the rope, you need to go home and pull the rope out and wash it in a 5 gallon bucket of water and soap.

    As another member mentioned, rope insulates the heat in the drum where the brake is usually located. This can do 2 things, cause the brake to over heat, and weaken the rope. Synthetic line loses strength if it is heated to just 150 degrees according to synthetic line manufacturers. The steel cable actually acts like a heat sink and helps dissipate heat off the brake drum.

    Overall the only two benefits i see from synthetic rope over cable is a little weight reduction (25 lbs) and it is safer if it breaks (which if its synthetic rope, it will eventually). Steel cable is more dangerous if it snaps, but a little common sense goes a long way. When i am using my cable i always inspect the cable to ensure it is not fray and I never hook the cable back to itself. You should have tow straps and D-rings along with a winch.

    Overall the cable is much tougher and forgiving. Ive seen lots of guys snap synthetic ropes but Ive never seen a steel cable snap. Not saying it never happens, but the synthetic breaks far more often as there is multiple different scenarios that can cause it to fail. Also an extra 25 lbs is nothing for rolling weight. Guys will add 20 lbs per tire of "rotating mass" by running 35" tires, but then talk about saving 25 lbs on winch line. Rotating mass sucks WAYYYYY more power than simply weight added to the vehicle.

    I am attaching a screen shot of a post that a editor of 4wheel drive magazine said when someone asked him about "synthetic rope vs steel cable"... read his reply:Screenshot_20180712-171830_Chrome.jpg
     
  25. Jul 15, 2018 at 1:54 AM
    #25
    Slp82

    Slp82 New Member

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    2014 Tundra 4x4 5.7L DC; Bilstein 6112s @ 1.9"; 35x12.50 Nitto Ridge Grapplers on 20x9 wheels with +25 backspacing; DV8 front & rear bumpers, Engo 12k winch (SOLD) 2005 Tundra RC 4.7 4x4 w/3" spacer, addicted offroad tube winch bumper w/9k Engo, homemade sliders, skid row skid plate, 285/75r16 Cooper AT3, Detroit trutrac in rear.
    Oh also the Engo winch has a solenoid that can be remote mounted as well. Here is a picture of my friends 2014 crewmax that we remote mounted the solenoid on the firewall to keep it away from water and mud just for extra protection.20180630_151229.jpg
     
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  26. Jul 15, 2018 at 3:52 AM
    #26
    Black Wolf

    Black Wolf Bigfoot Hunter, Sasquatch too, but not Yeti

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    My Smittybilt X20 10K is series wound, planetary geared, highest pulling torque in class, and waterproof. Has a very decent warranty. The first non Warn winch I've ever purchased. Well worth considering. Can get a super discount at AutoAnything thru Mike here on the forum. Just can't mention price. Super discount. Steel rope all the way for me. Old school but still better IMHO. I do agree that synthetic rope is a hell of a lot more convenient to handle and you can pinch off a steel rope if wound improperly. When doing straight simple "air" pulls I think synthetic is hard to beat. Anything beyond that.....steel. How many high lead "tension" logging outfits have switched to synthetics? Not many.... too be kind. Lots of good winches out there. Like the cooler thing. Warn and Yeti always come to mind but there are decent alternatives. Hope my grammar is correct. Don't ask...heh..heh..
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2018
  27. Jul 15, 2018 at 4:43 AM
    #27
    Slp82

    Slp82 New Member

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    2014 Tundra 4x4 5.7L DC; Bilstein 6112s @ 1.9"; 35x12.50 Nitto Ridge Grapplers on 20x9 wheels with +25 backspacing; DV8 front & rear bumpers, Engo 12k winch (SOLD) 2005 Tundra RC 4.7 4x4 w/3" spacer, addicted offroad tube winch bumper w/9k Engo, homemade sliders, skid row skid plate, 285/75r16 Cooper AT3, Detroit trutrac in rear.
    Here is a review from a offroad magazine that did a torture test on multiple winches, the Engo was one of them. It and the superwinch were the only two that survived the abuse.

    http://www.fourwheeler.com/how-to/129-1107-massive-multi-winch-shootout/

    Also let me see if I can find the link to some testing a group did of actual resistance you must overcome at various depths stuck. Ultimately their findings were that buried to the frame, you need 300% more force than what the loaded weight of your vehicle is. This is curb weight plus mods, fuel, passengers, tools, etc. I believe my Tundras curb weight is around 5,625 lbs. Add in about 170 lbs for the front bumper and winch. 80 lbs for the rear pipe bumper. Another 100 lbs for 35s. Fuel is about 200 lbs. Toolbox plus tools is probably around 250 lbs. Then a 200 lb driver. You are around 6,600 lbs real quick. 6,600 x 3 is 19,800 lbs. Keep in mind this is NOT with a possible flat.

    So using that guide I felt a 10k winch would be pushing it for enough power to pull me out. I always run a snatch block to keep the work load down on my winches, so with the 12k, it can handle 24k which I am well under. Yes buried to the frame is a extreme situation and realistically, you should have enough brains to realize your stuck and not moving before you end up frame deep. But with some swampy (lots of water) mud, it might be possible. I just preferred the additional insurance of the 12k. Ill see if I can find the link to that thread on the winch calculations.
     
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  28. Jul 15, 2018 at 5:46 AM
    #28
    ColoradoTJ

    ColoradoTJ Certified tow LEO Staff Member

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    I would research breaking strength of two of the same size quality ropes. 3/8" steel breaking strength is 15087 lbs and synthetic 3/8 is 18500 lbs. The one on my Jeep is over 30000 lbs. Another aspect of synthetic rope, if you break it, tie a bowline and your back in business. Can't do that with steel. I've had my Viking rope for 8 years, no problems. Just an assumption here, but I would be willing to bet I have used my rope more than most people do.

    It all depends on use. Mud duties I would be steel all the way. Rocks, water, snow...I'll take synthetic rope any day. Then again, I also just prefer to just not get stuck in the first place, but it does happen on occasion when I'm on my side or lid.
     
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  29. Jul 15, 2018 at 5:54 AM
    #29
    Black Wolf

    Black Wolf Bigfoot Hunter, Sasquatch too, but not Yeti

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    I have to admit that tying a bowline with steel rope would be a bit tricky.. Seems like most rigs I see here run with synthetic. A hell of a lot easier to work with...
     
  30. Jul 15, 2018 at 5:57 AM
    #30
    Slp82

    Slp82 New Member

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    2014 Tundra 4x4 5.7L DC; Bilstein 6112s @ 1.9"; 35x12.50 Nitto Ridge Grapplers on 20x9 wheels with +25 backspacing; DV8 front & rear bumpers, Engo 12k winch (SOLD) 2005 Tundra RC 4.7 4x4 w/3" spacer, addicted offroad tube winch bumper w/9k Engo, homemade sliders, skid row skid plate, 285/75r16 Cooper AT3, Detroit trutrac in rear.
    I agree with you from that aspect. Where I am at (Houston, Tx) most people get stuck at the beach in Galveston or mud pits. The mud around here is very sandy. Thats why I chose steel cable. Ive seen guys with brand new synthetic lines snap the 2nd time they used them because they allowed their lines to soak in sandy silt filled water and didnt clean the rope out afterwards. Im kinda lazy sometimes and just want to go back to having a beer after pulling someone out. I would guarantee forget to wash the line out later.
     

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