1. Welcome to Tundras.com!

    You are currently viewing as a guest! To get full-access, you need to register for a FREE account.

    As a registered member, you’ll be able to:
    • Participate in all Tundra discussion topics
    • Transfer over your build thread from a different forum to this one
    • Communicate privately with other Tundra owners from around the world
    • Post your own photos in our Members Gallery
    • Access all special features of the site

Transmission cooler missing…I know I know

Discussion in '2.5 Gen Tundras (2014-2021)' started by ColoradoCub, Sep 27, 2021.

  1. Oct 5, 2021 at 7:32 AM
    #481
    GCanuck

    GCanuck Member since 2020

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2020
    Member:
    #49167
    Messages:
    348
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Gary
    BC,Canada
    Vehicle:
    2020 Tundra DC MGM TRD Sport
    TRD Swaybars. Line-X bed liner. Toyota Tri-fold Tonneau. N-fab side bars. TRD cold air. AMP bed extender. Rough Country Level kit. BFG A/T K02. RCI Skids. OEM Tow mirrors. TRD exhaust
    Ya. I got it!
     
  2. Oct 5, 2021 at 7:38 AM
    #482
    coldcanuk

    coldcanuk New Member

    Joined:
    May 31, 2021
    Member:
    #63738
    Messages:
    143
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2021 Tundra Platinum
    Not everyone is a blue seal mechanic. I didn't find the post funny? I thought it was cool some guy took the time to take a picture and make a comment using 'I think' not to get anyone excited.

     
  3. Oct 8, 2021 at 12:03 PM
    #483
    realprotundra

    realprotundra Always Skeptical

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2020
    Member:
    #55643
    Messages:
    226
    Gender:
    Male
    Gilbert, AZ
    Vehicle:
    2021 Lunar Rock TRD Pro DC
    So for those following along, service just called and said that they had to add fluid to the transmission and that it appears to have been underfilled from the factory. I'll keep you posted on whether the slipping/failure to engage in reverse (again 2 times in about 11k miles) happens again now that it has been filled and also what trans temps are on my next tow (although it won't be 100+ degrees ambient again for several months). I'll also be calling Toyota to try to get an extended warranty due to the underfilled transmission and very high trans fluid temps. They probably won't do it but worth a shot.
     
    Melikeymy beer and Acedude like this.
  4. Oct 8, 2021 at 12:12 PM
    #484
    timsp8

    timsp8 Former Tundra owner for 13 years

    Joined:
    May 11, 2018
    Member:
    #15231
    Messages:
    3,524
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Tim
    NY
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tundra Limited Crewmax - Traded In
    There was a post a while ago by a guy who said his was shifting weird and that his was overfilled from the factory. He said the factory went by the spec ‘with’ a cooler and it was a little too much. Haven’t hear of any others that were underfilled.
     
    realprotundra[QUOTED] likes this.
  5. Oct 8, 2021 at 12:18 PM
    #485
    realprotundra

    realprotundra Always Skeptical

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2020
    Member:
    #55643
    Messages:
    226
    Gender:
    Male
    Gilbert, AZ
    Vehicle:
    2021 Lunar Rock TRD Pro DC
    Yeah, for all I know they didn't actually do anything at all. That being said, this dealership service department has been very good to me and really went to bat for me with the Tacoma headlight issue so I have no real reason not to trust them. Also seems odd that they would say that rather than "cannot duplicate" if they weren't actually going to do anything.
     
    timsp8[QUOTED] likes this.
  6. Oct 12, 2021 at 10:25 AM
    #486
    GTundraX

    GTundraX Rub some dirt on it.

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2021
    Member:
    #62346
    Messages:
    101
    Gender:
    Female
    First Name:
    Melyssa
    Oceanside, CA
    Vehicle:
    2019 TRD Off-Road DC
    Had the warning light come on our 2019 this past weekend while overlanding.

    Drove about 340 miles on paved highway with a few stops along the way, then aired down our tires and plugged in our ScanGauge to proceed down a dirt road. It was a flat, level dirt road for about 4 miles, then we switched to 4lo and proceeded up a trail.

    We went .5 mi with an ascent of 250 ft in elevation; it was pretty steep and we were taking it slow, but the transmission light went off and the ScanGauge read 260 degrees!!! WHAT?! Also, it was only about 65-70 degrees outside, so nothing extreme.

    We followed the owners manual instructions which said to park the vehicle and see if the light goes off. The light went off and we waited for the temperature to go down a bit more. Started again, drove about .10 mi with about 80 ft of ascent, and it went off again. We repeated the previous steps, switched to manual shifting, and didn't have a problem after that (except when we tried to go back to automatic).

    The ScanGauge stayed between 210 and 220...so 4lo and shifting manually helped, but I don't think the manual shifting should be used like this and that still seems pretty high to me. We drive rugged terrain about once a month to camp in the backcountry - I wouldn't quite call it off-roading usually but there are definitely obstacles.

    I don't really know anything about transmissions, engines, etc., but it seems like there should be a better solution.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2021
  7. Oct 12, 2021 at 10:31 AM
    #487
    ColoradoCub

    ColoradoCub [OP] New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2021
    Member:
    #68216
    Messages:
    439
    Gender:
    Male
    A major disservice was done to Tundra owners by removing the cooler, everyone thinks it’s just a towing issue, not giving the transmission a single tool to cool itself is a problem in more circumstances than just towing. Slow maneuvering or travel in up and down terrain builds heat on the transmission quicker than towing, at least towing there is some air flow, not enough …but some. Slow moving in rough terrain is going to heat the trans up quick. Dumbest thing Toyota could have ever done!
     
  8. Oct 12, 2021 at 10:34 AM
    #488
    An701904

    An701904 New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2021
    Member:
    #67394
    Messages:
    68
    Vehicle:
    2021 black TRD Pro
    If transmission failures start popping up do you guys think Toyota will TSB adding a coooler?
     
    AircareTundra likes this.
  9. Oct 12, 2021 at 10:37 AM
    #489
    realprotundra

    realprotundra Always Skeptical

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2020
    Member:
    #55643
    Messages:
    226
    Gender:
    Male
    Gilbert, AZ
    Vehicle:
    2021 Lunar Rock TRD Pro DC
    The difference in trans temp alarms is a bit concerning. I was up over 260 numerous times and never got a trans temp warning.
     
    Jtundra81 and GTundraX like this.
  10. Oct 12, 2021 at 10:39 AM
    #490
    GTundraX

    GTundraX Rub some dirt on it.

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2021
    Member:
    #62346
    Messages:
    101
    Gender:
    Female
    First Name:
    Melyssa
    Oceanside, CA
    Vehicle:
    2019 TRD Off-Road DC
    There really should be - we all need to report our problems directly to Toyota! Hopefully we are still under warranty if/when that happens...
     
    AircareTundra likes this.
  11. Oct 12, 2021 at 10:41 AM
    #491
    GTundraX

    GTundraX Rub some dirt on it.

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2021
    Member:
    #62346
    Messages:
    101
    Gender:
    Female
    First Name:
    Melyssa
    Oceanside, CA
    Vehicle:
    2019 TRD Off-Road DC
    THIS is another thing! I cannot get a solid number on what to watch out for from other threads I've looked at. The ScanGauge should be reading codes directly from the system so we should all be seeing the same reading when the alarm goes off. Unfortunately, that's not the case.
     
  12. Oct 12, 2021 at 10:42 AM
    #492
    ColoradoCub

    ColoradoCub [OP] New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2021
    Member:
    #68216
    Messages:
    439
    Gender:
    Male
    Nope! They would have to reverse course on that idiot engineers assessment a while back. They are willing to chance it on the toughness of the transmission in the tundras and figure true failures early on will be minimal to none. But for those that intend to own their trucks for a long time it will ultimately end up being on us to deal with it. How many times can this transmission experience 260 + deg before specific internal components start prematurely wearing or overheating is the question.(ie clutches, orings, seals,etc) We know that the first 12 years of Tundras never had to experience these temps, right? And anyone who says I’ll wait until the factory warranty expires before installing a cooler may very well be applying the fix after some damage is already done.
     
  13. Oct 12, 2021 at 10:52 AM
    #493
    hagrid

    hagrid The most diverse of Diversity Hires!

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2018
    Member:
    #22645
    Messages:
    1,975
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Spraynard
    Pittsburgh
    Vehicle:
    K1600GTL ZX-14R
    paynuss stretchers
    Howz come no one is talking aboot the 260°F torque converter heating up the flex plate and the rear main crank seal?
     
  14. Oct 12, 2021 at 11:14 AM
    #494
    ultra1988

    ultra1988 New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2020
    Member:
    #55179
    Messages:
    132
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2019 tundra
    Surprised at the lack of “Toyota knows more than you” posts on here. Last year when I posted about my ATF temps getting above 260f while towing a low profile 3500 pound boat I just walked away from the post because of all the Toyota fanboys who couldn’t handle negativity towards their brand.

    oil doesn’t hit a single temperature and go bad, it fails on a scale. The oil will fail faster at 240f then at 210f, and will fail a lot faster at 280f then at 240f. When lubricants fail, parts fail. Cst’s (viscosity) lowers with temperature. This issue is the only part of my 2019 that keeps me on the fence of getting rid of it. And now that I have bigger tires Toyota can void my transmission warranty.
     
    pickeledpigsfeet likes this.
  15. Oct 12, 2021 at 11:35 AM
    #495
    ColoradoCub

    ColoradoCub [OP] New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2021
    Member:
    #68216
    Messages:
    439
    Gender:
    Male
    There was some of that going on earlier in this thread, the engineers holier than thou mentality BS. The fact that Toyota came out with a TSB a week or so ago regarding 19-21 Tundras getting the transmission overheating messages tells you all you need to know about the Engineers know best crowd! Common sense is common sense, for 12 years Toyota felt it was essential to have a transmission cooler on the Toyota Tundra, and then all of a sudden the last couple years of production they scrap it when they can no longer use existing designed parts and we’re planning on the debut of the newly designed tundra which has been delayed. Now we have a transmission overheating issue in the 19-21 Toyota Tundras, C’mon man!!!
     
    pickeledpigsfeet likes this.
  16. Oct 12, 2021 at 11:43 AM
    #496
    Oey12

    Oey12 New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2020
    Member:
    #45061
    Messages:
    1,492
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Joey
    New York
    Vehicle:
    2020 SR5 TRD OFFROAD
    Coach Builder 1 inch lift strut spacers Coach Builder 1 inch shackles TRD Sway Bar Diode Dynamics SS
    Again if Toyota such a shitty product why not sell immediately? Clearly the 2019 to 2021 Tundra lacking a transmission cooler isn’t up to any tasks. Okay, great mock the Toyota fanboys all you want…you guys are still driving an inferior product based on your extensive knowledge and data. How is that not any dumber than being a Toyota fanboy?? Asking for a friend…
     
    hagrid, JDR76 and Cpl_Punishment like this.
  17. Oct 12, 2021 at 11:50 AM
    #497
    ColoradoCub

    ColoradoCub [OP] New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2021
    Member:
    #68216
    Messages:
    439
    Gender:
    Male
    Sorry dude but that’s just a stupid post. Those of us who bought a 19-21 Tundra, bought the truck because of its reputation, I for one owned 3 previous Tundras. But not knowing that Toyota had eliminated such a critical component until after the purchase is quite frustrating. Being a fan boy is just childish, you own and spend your hard earned money for the best product for your use, and I am no fan boy of any brand. I’ll defend a good product that has served me well but will also always expose its weaknesses or inferior designs. You have to hold the brand accountable for its downfalls as well as it successes. This transmission debacle is not one of Toyota’s successes. Thankfully it’s easily remedied, no need to get rid of the truck.
     
  18. Oct 12, 2021 at 12:01 PM
    #498
    JDR76

    JDR76 New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2021
    Member:
    #64642
    Messages:
    510
    Gender:
    Male
    WA
    Vehicle:
    2021 1794 TRD OFF ROAD
    Are you referring to me?
     
  19. Oct 12, 2021 at 12:07 PM
    #499
    Oey12

    Oey12 New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2020
    Member:
    #45061
    Messages:
    1,492
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Joey
    New York
    Vehicle:
    2020 SR5 TRD OFFROAD
    Coach Builder 1 inch lift strut spacers Coach Builder 1 inch shackles TRD Sway Bar Diode Dynamics SS
    My post was meant to stupid and sarcastic…

    Toyota has a ton of downfalls however less than other manufacturers. I have owned many Toyota’s and have see all kinds of problems.

    But to constantly harp on it and refer to individuals who want more information on the subject prior to making a decision as fanboys is just as stupid and sarcastic…

    Not every owner here goes off-roading or tows at 75mph PERIOD

    Therefore it is not as crystal clear as the pro cooler members make it out to be.

    *EDIT* And we have no real data on the guys that do those things according to the manual like towing at 65mph max.

    I am a realist and I agree those number are high HOWEVER there are circumstances that will create high transmission temps in any transmission cooler installed ones as well.

    IE example:

    Speed

    At or near max capacity (payload and/or towing)

    Off-roading

    Ambient temperature

    Larger than stock tires due to weight
     
    Cpl_Punishment likes this.
  20. Oct 12, 2021 at 12:13 PM
    #500
    realprotundra

    realprotundra Always Skeptical

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2020
    Member:
    #55643
    Messages:
    226
    Gender:
    Male
    Gilbert, AZ
    Vehicle:
    2021 Lunar Rock TRD Pro DC
    Again, this all comes down to data. We simply don't know that the transmission temperatures exceed the reliable operating temp of the WS fluid or the transmission and its internal components. Only one entity has that information......Toyota.....good luck getting it out of them.
     
    Jtundra81, JDR76 and Oey12 like this.
  21. Oct 12, 2021 at 12:33 PM
    #501
    ultra1988

    ultra1988 New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2020
    Member:
    #55179
    Messages:
    132
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2019 tundra
    like I said, towing 3500 pounds I was over 260f, and I didn’t even get an alarm. It’s a known issue, Toyota won’t tell us the maximum temp allowable for the WS fluid AND they won’t tell us how often to change the WS depending on temperature. Like maybe if we tow and see over 260f we should change it ASAP?

    I bought a 2019 tundra, I’m not like some of the folks arguing on here who don’t even own one. I likely would have held off on buying one if I realized they took it out. I consider my truck incapable of slow uphill off roading and towing a 6000 pound travel trailer through the desert. My Silverado that I lemon lawed could do either of those things without skipping a beat.
     
    pickeledpigsfeet likes this.
  22. Oct 12, 2021 at 12:44 PM
    #502
    JDR76

    JDR76 New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2021
    Member:
    #64642
    Messages:
    510
    Gender:
    Male
    WA
    Vehicle:
    2021 1794 TRD OFF ROAD
    My opinion on the matter is an ever evolving one. I just towed my trailer this weekend and was hitting anywhere from 214 to 222. Meanwhile I read a post on here today about someone with a 2018 (with factory cooler) hitting 240 while towing.

    I don't see why some seem to get so offended about those of us stating that we'd like more data, but oh well. Further up the thread I did share my thought process on the matter as an experienced engineer. Sorry if that ruffled some feathers. I really don't get it. I'm not a fanboy, I just want to make an educated and not emotional decision.

    Do I think it was a poor decision for Toyota to remove the factory cooler? If it was indeed an effective cooler, then yes, yes I do think it was unwise.

    However, I don't understand how spending your own money to add an aftermarket cooler is holding Toyota accountable. It completely lets them off the hook and you absorb all the cost. If people are so sure it'll fail, then let it fail and let Toyota pay to replace it.

    I am still deciding what to do with mine. My temps have been reasonable though I do indeed wish they were cooler, and I am still considering adding the cooler to mine. However, I am not really sure I want to let Toyota off the hook like that if their decision to remove the cooler truly will lead to a failure. I do have a 10 year warranty on mine. If failure is such a sure thing, then certainly it will fail within those 10 years, and I can have Toyota foot the bill. If it fails after 10 years, then really, I'm not that concerned. If I have to sink a few grand into a 10 + year old truck, I can live with that. I spent far more than that keeping my Silverado running.

    I think I'm pretty much done towing for the season and won't likely do it again until the spring, so I will plan to make my decision by that time.
     
  23. Oct 12, 2021 at 12:52 PM
    #503
    crewmaxlmt

    crewmaxlmt How dare you!

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2020
    Member:
    #54795
    Messages:
    890
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    scott
    PNW
    Vehicle:
    2020 Crewmax Limited
    I would bet the decision to remove the transmission cooler came from the financial department and not engineering.
     
    AircareTundra and Acedude like this.
  24. Oct 12, 2021 at 12:56 PM
    #504
    ultra1988

    ultra1988 New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2020
    Member:
    #55179
    Messages:
    132
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2019 tundra
    I’m not going to install a cooler, I’m either going to get an extended power train warranty or sell the truck when the warranty runs out. I’m confident enough in my knowledge of lubricants that the lack of cooler combined with my normal summer tow being in 100-120f outside temps that my transmission will 100% not last as long as it should.

    im not a Toyota engineer and I don’t work for an oil manufacturer, so I don’t suggest anybody listen to me.

    while the maximum recommended operating temperatures, or a temperature/mileage change interval are not available for WS…there are plenty available for other name brand synthetic ATF’s, as well as high performance extreme duty ATF’s. None of them that I’ve found recommend operating between 240-290.
     
  25. Oct 12, 2021 at 12:56 PM
    #505
    ColoradoCub

    ColoradoCub [OP] New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2021
    Member:
    #68216
    Messages:
    439
    Gender:
    Male
    Ok, can you refer me to all the threads of Tundras pre 2019 overheating with light to moderate loads towing and guys cruising around the mountains at lower speeds? I don’t recall seeing any of that. In fact if you search “Tundras.com transmission overheating” the only threads that come up are related to 2019+ models. What’s funny is that thread after thread about this topic and everyone who defended Toyota’s genius engineer that eliminated the cooler, NOW…. in Oct of 2021 Toyota releases a TSB for these transmissions overheating. hmmmmm
     
    pickeledpigsfeet likes this.
  26. Oct 12, 2021 at 12:58 PM
    #506
    ColoradoCub

    ColoradoCub [OP] New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2021
    Member:
    #68216
    Messages:
    439
    Gender:
    Male
    Dont recall who all the engineer defenders were, you can look back at the first 10 pages and see.
     
  27. Oct 12, 2021 at 12:58 PM
    #507
    GTundraX

    GTundraX Rub some dirt on it.

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2021
    Member:
    #62346
    Messages:
    101
    Gender:
    Female
    First Name:
    Melyssa
    Oceanside, CA
    Vehicle:
    2019 TRD Off-Road DC
    If possible, will you send me a link to the TSB so I can review? I looked but must have missed it...
     
  28. Oct 12, 2021 at 12:59 PM
    #508
    ColoradoCub

    ColoradoCub [OP] New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2021
    Member:
    #68216
    Messages:
    439
    Gender:
    Male
    100%!
     
    Acedude likes this.
  29. Oct 12, 2021 at 1:00 PM
    #509
    2WD

    2WD New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2021
    Member:
    #64982
    Messages:
    138
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    21 Army Green CM SR5 TRD Off Road
    I haven't towed heavy yet, but light towing and off-roading, stop and go, 75 plus on the highway, etc - the hottest I've seen is 215 (no cooler). If it is maintaining 240+ all day long when I tow heavy I'll probably add a cooler.

    Before this cooler removal I don't think as many folks were watching trans temps of pre 2018's (no need, it has an AUX ATF cooler). It's clear the afternmarket coolers bring it down to 190-200 but what about the factor 2018 cooler? How much cooler was it?

    I still can't get past the fact that on the Ford Forums they had the same concerns and determined that the ECU doesn't react to trans temps on Superduty's until 247! Ford didn't want to stress out the fan too much I guess and are happy with heavy trailers and ten speeds 220-245 range all day. These are commercial grade trucks that sometimes never disconnect from their trailers.

    Has the industry as a whole realized these fluids/trans can handle warmer temps? Ford, GM, and Toyota have all come to the same conclusion. No Aux coolers on their half tons, and higher sustained temps on their HD's.
     
    Acedude and Jtundra81 like this.
  30. Oct 12, 2021 at 1:01 PM
    #510
    realprotundra

    realprotundra Always Skeptical

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2020
    Member:
    #55643
    Messages:
    226
    Gender:
    Male
    Gilbert, AZ
    Vehicle:
    2021 Lunar Rock TRD Pro DC
    TSB =/= Wrongdoing in the elimination of the cooler. Maybe it is going to set different parameters for TC lockup which will reduce temps as well. I don't know, I know you don't know because you have yet to provide anything but conjecture, probably no one in here knows.
     
To Top