OTT Tune for stock NA Tundra

Seven years ago I installed a DAP Tune on my N/A 2007 5.7L, the only engine performance modification on my truck is a Y-pipe design Dirty Deeds cat-back with a single tail pipe... tires, gearing and so on are all stock.



My goal was to remove the speed governor, improve transmission shifts and maybe extract a little more peak horsepower and torque from the engine - DAP Tune delivered.

My questions:
Has anyone compared the basic OTT tune with the basic DAP tune?
What are the PROs & CONs with each?

 

Unfortunately I don't have any experience with any other tuner other than the ott tune. I have heard of the dap tume but didn't research it enough to compare the 2, didn't want to try to do any tune myself and didn't know anyone near me to do the tune.

Found a couple guys somewhat in my area that did the ott tunes and my for.er supervisor had the ott done on his tacoma and raved about how much it changed how the truck drove.

So all ive got for you is since I added the larger heavier tires and then the tune I am very pleased with the ott as the truck is much more responsive and driver friendly. Better that the dap i can not say but the ott was worth the upgrade for me.

Now I just need to get the supercharger upgrade and get it re-tuned. But that in a future (dream) a long ways away

 

Biggest issue is DAP has 0 customer service and stopped responding to people years ago. In general folks liked the tune but now that there are options besides DAP, there is basically no reason to for anyone new to pick him.

If you don't have issues with your current DAP tune, it probably isn't worth you paying another company for changes. When the time comes when you want a change, its doubtful the DAP will help you out (many folks on the forum were left high and dry. I personally never had a tune but had been considering it when he started ghosting people) but since you paid I would start there. If you get no response, I think OTT is a great option. Lot of folks like the work they do, they have good customer service, a presence on the forum, and will work to get you a tune that makes you happy.

 

DAP is long gone, and there is nothing that can be done about that.

My question focuses on a comparison of the two products in their basic form.
Are they basically the same?

EDIT: I am genuinely curious if anyone compared the two, but in the end it really doesn't matter because DAP is no longer available.

 

If I understand correctly, most of what OTT does for our trucks is a customizable Tow-Haul... actually 2 different ones. We also can get ~5-10% boost in midrange torque if we use premium gas, which is nothing to sneeze at.

I already have a throttle controller and use TH all the time on highways. 35s (probably 37s next) stock gearing, big constant load. The shifting and behavior seem fine and avg MPG is in the high 14s. The most annoying thing is cruise control shutting off when it kicks into 3rd, but I don't think that can be fixed with a tune. The second most annoying is when I forget to turn TH off when I leave the highway. It's dangerous to have two settings that are very different IMO... or cruise that turns off at every steep hill.

Should we expect a noticeable improvement in MPG if we use premium gas?

And what is the total cost if we want the ability to tweak the throttle and shift behavior after the first try? Are a certain number of tweaks included?

 

OTT adjusts many maps both in normal drive mode and tow haul. Both modes get throttle, shift logic, VVTI, fueling, and other modifications. Tow haul mainly gets a more aggressive throttle and shift logic changes relative to the normal drive mode changes.

OTT can’t change the 3rd gear CC behavior as far as I know. That is to keep people from using CC at low speeds.

Prices range between $450-$600 depending on location and vehicle set up for naturally aspirated Tundras. Most are $450. If you have an aftermarket intake that needs compensated for that can add $50, so $500 total. Some areas with higher cost of living can be $550-600.

Updates and adjustments to the tune are typically no cost. But if you expect the tuner to provide door to door direct service to you, there may be travel costs. If you go to them, no cost.

You can also buy a DIY kit from OTT directly if you want to go that route. That tends to be $700-800 in most cases.

 

CC will work down to 25mph, but by then you could be in 4th or even 5th gear. Some time I'll try to remember to lock my truck into 3rd and see if the cruise works, as well as try to remember to come back here to report my findings.

 

I may be mistaken, but I think it will work in 3rd if set in 3rd or 4th, but won’t downshift to 3rd from 5th or 6th (and remain active) either because of a logic lockout or power override - 3rd gear delivering more power than 4th, 5th, and 6th. Logically, it would make sense that if your truck requires enough power that it drops to 3rd gear at close to WOT, a driver should take control and pilot the vehicle. Just my opinion. But now I’m curious, too.

 

If you are hauling or towing pretty heavy, and especially at high altitude, 3rd gear is required on many hills. The truck can easily go >75 in 3rd, but when CC drops from 4th to 3rd on a hill, it slows down suddenly. Better hope no one is tailgating! It's a silly and dangerous behavior. With CC off, constantly varying the throttle with your foot and watching the speed is a distraction and chore on long drives. I hate nannies as they are all dangerous and annoying.

I played with using S mode on hills a few weeks ago. I think I only tried S6 and S3 and neither worked. S3 actually surged back and forth which was weird, but it didn't maintain speed.

I look forward to see if you find anything out.

 

That's what I'm getting at... I tow between 5k and 8k feet often and have several mountain passes within 50 or 100 miles most any direction I go. If you are towing or hauling heavy, as a driver, one should be actively driving the vehicle instead of relying on the cruise control to make it up steep grades. I don't think Toyota or any other MFG recommends using CC while towing to begin with.

I'm not trying to tell people how they should drive their vehicles, just appealing to what I consider good driversmanship (yeah, I made that word up, cuz I'm cool like that...). CC can only react to load inputs from its current circumstances and command power and gearing accordingly; as a driver, you can proactively assess a driving situation before you are in the situation and command more power or gear before you get there. For example, the top of most every pass has signage that recommends a lower gear and slower speed before starting the descent.

I figure it's more a safety hazard for me to not be paying attention and be surprised by the truck shutting down cruise control. But that's just me. I also used to get really annoyed by the traction control (and still do from time to time) but I had a wheel speed sensor go bad one winter, which disabled ABS, TC, and wouldn't let me shift in or out of 4wd on the fly, and I learned how much TC does to keep going forward and straight down the road when I'm not thinking about it. I mean, I had plenty of fun getting sideways, but it was less fun when it was at 60 MPH and unexpected..

 

Toyota clearly states not to tow with CC in the owners manual.

 

Just because I'm using CC, doesn't mean I'm napping in the driver seat. If I'm in hilly terrain with a good deal of traffic, I want to use CC because everyone else is. I allows you to maintain a steady speed without much effort, besides occasionally adjusting the setting... meaning that you can pay attention to other things besides maintaining speed. And I'm pretty sure I can get to the brake quicker in CC than I can if my foot is on the throttle.

If there isn't a lot of traffic, and there isn't in most of the places I drive, then it absolutely sucks that I can't just set the speed and forget about it.

Towing is probably more precarious... don't know because I don't do it. But we should still have the option, rather than the nanny abruptly turning it off when you are going up a steep hill with an 18 wheeler on you tail.

 

Toyota probably thinks you shouldn't tune your truck and a myriad of other things too

 

Agreed. I constantly tow with CC when on the highway. I kick it off in the hills or on windy roads, but have seen zero negatives of towing with my tuned N/A truck on cruise with trailers up to our 25’ travel trailer. Truck has been set up this way for the last 100K miles. 200K on it total.

 

I've also read that pre-2014 trucks didn't have this nerfed CC.

 

They do. My '13 will shut off when downshifting to 3rd on the highway.

Never said you were Just advocating for drivers driving cars is all. Too many ding dongs around here cruising around staring at their phones.

 

And, that’s why I have adaptive cruise…

Hell, I drove my wife’s ‘25 Outback to San Diego a few weeks ago. Not only adaptive cruise, but also drives around the corners and keeps it centered in the lane.

If I were smarter, I would have painted eyeballs on my lids so the driver surveillance system wouldn’t scream at me when I wanted to take a nap…

 

I just had my truck tuned by Master Yota. Love the throttle response and shifting seems less clunky when I’m gassing it. Haven’t towed my trailer yet so I can’t comment on that. But I do have a question, I constantly monitor my trans and coolant temps and in a very limited sample it seems my trans temp has decreased by about 10 degrees while coolant temp has also decreased between 5 and 10 degrees. Is this normal or just an anomaly?

 

Normal.

One of the biggest benefits to the tune, IMO, is the shifting and transmission management. I noticed it immediately and still appreciate the difference. The drop in trans temps is always a good thing.

 

Circling back. In S3 at 25mph the cruise would not set. In S4 and D it would. So, I found the steepest paved hill that I could (~8% grade) with the idea that maybe in D the transmission would stay in 3rd and I could set the CC. Nope, the transmission would shift to 4th before I was able to lift my foot off the throttle to verify if the CC was set. I was not able to think of some other way to test.

 

Is it significantly different than Tow-Haul, though?

 

It could be radically different, within the parameters of the TCU; or it could be very similar but noticeably better.

 

Yes, very - in a good way. But let me explain..

There are two different maps setup in the ECU from the factory - normal Drive, and Tow/Haul. OTT has the ability to tune each of them individually. In fact, one of the questions they asked me was if I tow and want to retain the Tow/Haul function. I tow with all of my vehicles and asked to keep the two modes, with the latter being appropriate for towing. However, since they are customizable, you could technically have Normal driving setup like factory Tow/Haul, and new Tow/Haul setup for Race, or even Eco-Mode - Race and Eco being user-defined throttle and transmission settings. S-mode makes some modifications as well, but we'll ignore them for now.

There are both throttle sensitivity settings and transmission shifting settings. Both are defined and easily modified to suit a users wants/needs, both are different between normal Drive and Tow/Haul. I use HP Tuners and am able to view the stock throttle and transmission settings, so take what I say from that perspective. OTT has access to much fancier tuning software and can edit more parameters that I can't even see in HP Tuners; they are able to port their tune over to HP Tuners with their own changes beyond the simple throttle sensitivity and shift setting that I can fiddle with.

Also, as I understand it, they are able to simulate shifting behavior and power output with much more know-how than the average shade-tree mechanic, then implement that in their tunes. If you follow the HP Tuners forums, there isn't a whole lot of tuning info for our vehicles, but the info that is available shows a glimpse of what I'm talking about. A gentleman there uploaded a few Excel calculators to help model transmission and few other things, but the beginner steps are 'take the factory settings and add or subtract 5% at a a time until you've achieved satisfactory results as far as throttle sensitivity and transmission shifting. For funsies, I've fiddled with these settings on one of my vehicles and am at around 13 or 14 iterations for both throttle and trans to get it to mostly behave the way I would like in normal mode. I'm not sure I've even messed with Tow/Haul yet.

But even after all that work, my OTT-tuned Sequoia just flat drives and shifts better and more effortlessly than my own tuning efforts. It feels like you actually have a V8 under the hood but isn't jumpy or hard to control, it shifts smooth, easy, and quick like you would expect something like a 4L60 with a mild shift kit to shift, but without any clunk or jerkiness. It also always feels to be in the power band without getting on it, if that makes sense. Overall, it's smooth and powerful.

OTT has dyno-verified 30 to 40 additional HP at areas under the curve, so it's definitely more than just throttle and shifting. Peak HP is pretty close to the same, but that additional midrange oomph is pretty evident in daily driving. It's right where most drivers actually drive their vehicles, not at redline.

To say the tune is just Tow/Haul under normal settings isn't at all accurate. I know some tunes have that reputation because that's really all that some tunes do. That is not the case here. To boot, they offer a few throttle options to suit your taste.

 

Do you do any work up here in Canada?

 

Looks like they have a few retailers up north, with one in Calgary.

https://overlandtailor.com/retailer-locations/

 

In the 2700 to 3800 rpm range it's ~30 hp, but I'm pretty sure you need premium fuel to get much.

Do you use premium? Does the tune improve mpg?

 

Yes, I use premium. It’s only 30 cents more than 85 octane around here. Even in stock form (my ‘21 is still stock but will soon get an OTT tune) the vehicle pulls less timing on premium and runs smoother with more power below the curve. OTT’s tune adds power on top of that. According to Lake Speed Jr, running premium fuel helps reduce engine wear by a measurable amount. I switched from 85 to 91 (premium here) well before tuning and still noticed a big difference after the tune. The tune will handle lower octane fuels but I don’t recommend it.

Mileage-wise, I can’t say that I gained much there. But I didn’t lose any, either. And my rigs got heavier with more power and a better driving experience. So maybe a little, but it’s not one of their selling points - which is fine by me. I don’t hypermile but I don’t drive with reckless abandon either.

 

I went up an 11% grade yesterday in S4, with CC set to 50 mph, and when it kicked down to 3rd, CC dropped out.

 

I'm in the Pacific Northwest area and the PNW Tundra Facebook page is active, but used to be super active few years ago. Anyways, the moderators were pushing that DAP tune hard for years, it personally made me feel like they were getting some kind of kickbacks.
Anyways I finally went to one of the DAP tune events to meet fellow local Tundra enthusiasts and drove another guys Tundra that was raving about how good the tune was. Being totally honest I couldn't feel any difference from my own stock Tundra.
I probably would have still considered getting the tune since I was already there but the guy wasn't friendly at all, and neither was one of the group moderators that was there. Like they had giant sticks up their B holes. Lol
I've owned my Tundra for 17 years now, done all my own maintenance and mods myself, and have a wealth of knowledge about the 07-21 Tundra's, and felt out of place at the event.
Anyways, I'm here in this thread because I always see ads on Facebook for the OTT tune from Big Turtle Tuning (the local tuner in my area) I guess. I've always been interested in getting my Tundra tuned but on the fence if it's worth it. It'd be awesome if I could do a test drive to sample if I would want to keep it. I use my truck like a truck, and also tow a boat and a 16 foot cargo trailer in the summer.
Sorry for the long post and rambling on...

 

I'd guess if the DAP tune didn't impress you... you probably won't be impressed.

Based on what I've heard, Toyota changed the computer programming with the 2.5 gen... throttle response, shifting, etc. It makes sense that people with that model would notice more difference. I got a throttle controller and use tow-haul to make it behave how I like.