Dirty deeds injectors

I’m pondering buying a set of Dirty deeds injectors.
My transmission shifts like butter now. Seems to have
Plenty of power. The engine runs great and has 90K miles.
I’m asking if a new set would be worth it.

 

At 90k I think I would wait.

Just my .02

 

Would I get better gas mileage?

 

I need my transmission to shift like butter. What’s the secret?

 

low miles (I guess)

 

In my case no you wouldn’t. It stayed about the same *maybe better* but not worth it if thats your goal. My truck had about 155k miles on it and wanted to clean the injectors which locally cost about $275 for all 8 plus two day lead time. Saw the DD 12Ports and it was a no brainer at $330 shipped to door. Takes about a 1/2 day to replace them. Technical, but straight forward job.

Another member here just had his Originals cleaned with iirc about 150k on them and the pretest prior to cleaning showed about 5 of the 8 were ‘dripping’ and the remaining were out of spec. Confirms my suspicion about mine before doing the 12Ports.

My transmission has been well maintained (A340f) and it ALWAYS had a lazy downshift when coming from speed into a slower turn. The 12Ports fixed that and the gear is right there when hitting the gas in a turn/coming out of turn. The shifts are slightly different in other scenarios but the lazy downshift is the major fix/skirt lifting for me. Plus, the Denso 12ports are clean reman’d and have a more robust build (per a reading and can’t confirm this) vs. the original style

 

New fluid first. 12Ports next.

 

I love mine but I did it at 330k, but I really suggest a new fuel filter to go with it whenever you do it.
I'm convinced that what made my mileage go up so much.

 

I watched this video yesterday and found it very interesting. It’s comparing 4-hole injectors vs 12-hole.

Spoiler if you don’t want to watch vid, dyno results show no real advantage to using them.

 

Saw this video too and made me not buy new injectors.

 

Yeah. I watched that vid about 6 months back and commented on it. Basically, a realistic view on someone who has them and driven them for 2 years. You’ll be surprised. You’ll also want them for you truck for the many reasons I’ve discussed here quite a bit. I’ll comment later this evening.

*Spoiler* The Dyno guys didn’t actually drive the truck or get out of battery reset mode on the vehicle post injector install.

 

Alright here is basically what I repeated in an argument on this same subject when someone else here posted the same video a while back. They do not have the 12Ports.

I’ve been very straight forward on these 12Ports with honest reviews and seems like everyone else thats done them afterwards can confirm the same.

Context:

1) These Injectors were my first DIY ‘mod’ other than basic stuff like Feather Dusting.

2) Reason for wanting to do them was because I had a suspicion the OEM injectors needed a cleaning. Did some research here on the Island and there are lots of Marine Injector Cleaners as the crap ethanol clogs boat motors. Cost about $225-250 iirc at the time for 8 injectors. ‘Bob the Six Million Dollar Man Build’ just posted 5-6 of his Original Injectors were leaking and the remaining were out of Spec (actual printout). Confirms my suspicion as our truck had about the same miles.

3) Researched some more and came across the 12Ports. Saw the price was $330ish iirc for Reman’d Densos via DDI mailed to the door and ready for install. Beats a two day lead time and downtime on the truck waiting on Marine Service.

4) Bought the 12Ports based on a convo with Kieth. You can read all his claims on his website. I address these later. Main thing that stuck out to me was the better shift points and pedal response. I doubted the MPG claim as the ECU sets the pump pace/injector flow. I did think maybe HP would improve.

5) Fast forward and I got these installed in 5 hours with success! Truck started up in first turn. Engine sounded about the same but lots smoother. Less clicks sounds from the Injectors. Instead of typewriter it sounded more like a sewing machine.

6) Went for a drive and the pedal felt more responsive. Truck was torquier.

7) The more I drove it I noticed the shifts were better. The gears held a little longer and the biggie?... *the lazy downshift from speed going into a turn disappeared. The gear was right there with the pedal push! Like a modern vehicle! No more engine winding out on a pedal push and then backing off the pedal to wait for the transmission to be ready.

8) Did some MPG logs and I didn’t see *major* betterment, but I wasn’t expecting it (even though its being sold as such). Horsepower? I have no Dyno, but Truck felt way torquier after than before. Torques improved even more with newer Denso Front o2 Sensors.

Conclusion: I would do these all over again and will say the same as above. I recommend them. I’ve been very consistent on this.

Now to address a few things about the video. I can’t argue against their test (if done scientifically) as I do not and have not made any test like this myself. I know my MPG is about the same as thats an easy metric to track.

Without watching the video again I’m going on memory. Here is what I remember asking myself after watching it months ago:

What kind of goofy guys do a test on the Dyno and then don’t even take it for a test drive? (This would have let them see how the 12Ports actually performed with the better shifts). Did they give the ECU time to reset after the install? (No, so now their results aren’t apple to apples which means the entire video is unscientific!) A fail! and they then go on to post their dumb video pronouncing how smart they are. Maybe smearing a small business?

On top of that they go on to the MudIH8 Jeep site and talk shit with their stupid ‘facts’ (based on the flaw of a reset ECU). They still don’t understand! You can find the thread yourself and Kieth tried to explain to them the same thing I just did above (but he still claims better MPG and I don’t see it). I’ll stick with the no betterment of MPG but it didn’t get worse. Maybe the Horsepower isn’t more (but it sure feels torquier!) and remember I have no Dyno to stay otherwise yes/no. Engine sounds better in a smooth way. Throttle is more responsive and she shifts way better!

Goofy Video Dyno guys FAIL with their FLAWED Video and should be ashamed of being ignorant.

We have multiple members here who have great feedback on these and I am happy for them. You can go and find their feedback or maybe they can post up here which would be nice. If I’ve mistaken their good reviews, then they can correct me here.

 

It would be interesting to see them do that test with 15-20 year old 4 holes compared to new 12 holes. I think they had their 4 hole injectors cleaned before the dyno if my memory is right.
My guess is that most of the noticeable improvement people report is because you're going from old/dirty injectors to new ones, not because you're going from 4-12 holes.

If one wants to upgrade their injectors it probably makes sense to go with Keith's instead of getting the original ones cleaned. If I ever swap mine, that's what I would do. It's probably not a bad idea for preventative maintenance at this point.

 

We’ll never know about the hypothetical argument unless its tried (actually driven by Goofy Video Guys). Remember, I’ve had my truck since new and it always had the lazy downshift shift. Always. You can read about it from others on the TS site from 2004 posts. That was corrected with the 12Ports. It believe it has something to do with a lighter pedal push/response and the Throttle Position Sensor interactions.

The better atomization has to be strongly considered in a 12 vs 4 hole. Just watch the TONS of videos on the subject and the misting tests etc. Reason we clean our Injectors is so they spray/mist better and the 12 holes do it better than 4 in clean vs clean test.

The other thing I’d like to mention is that I’d love to find the 12Port Denso Injector Model Number to do more research on it vs the 4 holes. Reason is I’ve read (not from DD) that these have a much more Robust Internal Design.

Keith was the first to turn me on to them and I believe they are his ground breaking idea so I will continue to recco people his way. Small business ideas are worth $$$.

 

Well said, I know when I do the tune up soon, I’m going with the 12 hole!

 

You’ll be stoked for the reasons explained. I can’t recall anyone regretting it here. If they do, please stand up and say so.

 

Playing the devils advocate a bit but I hear a lot of the same claims when people install a ‘cold air’ intake. I’ve used a few on different vehicles and the only ones I noticed a difference on was my ‘00 Jeep Wrangler and my ‘13 Cummins.

Now if your butt dyno says it’s made a difference, it probably did. Not many can say they’ve owned their truck since new so you have enough seat time to notice when something wakes it up. Might be something I consider if/when my injectors decided to give me troubles.

 

12 hole is a good upgrade for people with miles or planing other mods. Ona. Stock truck I don’t see fuel atomization doing a whole lot. Now for boosted applications? You’ll start to see more of a benefit.

I still plan on doing the 12 hole injectors, but first I’ll get headers, engine mounts and some other goodies and just do it all at once.

 

Since you mentioned headers, what headers are you going with? I want some but I heard they're a bitch to install.

 

I plan on doing long tubes. They’re not terrible to do, but definitely time consuming. I’m doing poly motor mounts at the same time.

 

Don’t forget the injection pump bypass, and I plan on making new fender skirts from the ones I tore out with new fasteners.
The weird vibration I was having at idle............is seemingly gone!!!! Motor mounts for the win!!!!

 

I need to be cArB cOmPLiAnT so I think long tube are out for me. I heard you damn near have to lift the motor out...

As for motor mounts, I have these (pictured) from a guy on Instagram Solid Offroad. He sold me motor and tranny mounts for my Tacoma and he does out Tundra's too. Definitely feel the vibration more but shifts really nice. I don't know if I want them for my Tundra since I daily it but we'll see.

 

What is the injection pump bypass?

 

So you can get two different styles of long tube headers, one with the air injection pump tube on the header and one without, the one without is cheaper, but then you have to bypass that startup system on the AIP which are also known to fail and very expensive resolution..... bypass kits can be found from 50-160$+
Hewitt tech or Slyfox on t4r has units for sale

 

Oh ok, So I wouldn't need to do this with shorties.

 

They make both options for shorties as well, but just bite the bullet and go long tubes.

 

They aren’t that bad. I have JBA’s on mine. I’m only 16 and my friend and i changed them in most of a Day. I don’t know where the “they are so hard to install” or the “you need to take out a motor mount” came from as they were frustrating but not that bad and between several various 14mm sockets and a long swivel head ratchet and ratchet wrench i did not remove either motor mount. Also know that you will need to extend your o2 sensors. I cut mine between the quick disconnect and to o2 sensor itself and butt connected about a foot more same gauge wire in the middle. This keeps the quick disconnect functionality and extends the o2s without needing to buy the extended ones. Then route them behind the heat shield. I also had to take loose my steering shaft to get the driver side header in.

After installing my headers i had a exhaust shop weld up 2.5in pipes into a flow master muffler. Sounds good and between that and my 12hole injectors torque and power are hugely noticeably increased in my opinion. These mods definitely got my old pep back because i run 35/12.5s on stock gears. Would recommend both injectors and headers.

 

If you are going to do it, go long tubes. Shorties aren’t really any easier to install or cheaper, but certainly do have less ugga duggas.

 

i've got his mounts for the taco. theyre what i plan on for the tundra.