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Coating Experiences (Multiple Brands)

Discussion in 'Detailing' started by Ckatz53, Oct 23, 2021.

  1. Oct 23, 2021 at 4:14 PM
    #1
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

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    www.fouroneodetailing.com
    I figured I would start a thread like this after a couple have suggested me to do so.

    A short backstory: I run a part-time detailing business where we will often correct and coat vehicles. I am "accredited" (this is marketing bullshit) by IGL Coatings, Glassparency, and Owner's Pride. I have also started to dabble in a new-to-the-scene coating known as Undrdog. I am in no way shape or form directly linked to these companies and don't receive monetary gains from any review I may do.

    I plan on laying out my experiences here, as well as providing timeline updates on several coatings I either have on personal vehicles or have the ability to see and maintenance wash. For those new to me and my postings, I'll keep it real with my experiences, don't bullshit or fanboy over a product, and I curse sometimes...it's just second nature.

    I will be saving several posts after this initial thread beginning so that I can update them in real-time as they come about and they'll all be at the beginning. Let the scrutiny begin...
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2021
  2. Oct 23, 2021 at 4:14 PM
    #2
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

    Joined:
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    2020 Cement Tundra CM Limited 4x4
    www.fouroneodetailing.com
    Owner's Pride (OP)

    Owner's Pride, from my understanding, is an off-shoot of Opticoat. Essentially a few of the Opticoat folks left and started their own company now known as Owner's Pride. Since the time of this posting, they offer a 1, 2, 3, 5, and 7 year coating. The coating is automatically warrantied and goes on your vehicle's Carfax report. The warranty protects against dulling, fading, and any circumstance where what the coating should be preventing (UV fade, dullness, water etching to the point where a water spot remover will not suffice, etc.) experiences failure. The coating used to only be warrantied for vehicles 4 years old or newer, but they have in the past few weeks moved to warrantying ALL aged vehicles. OP can be applied to all surfaces (paint, trim, vinyl, rubber, glass, wheel faces).

    Owner's Pride is a SiC coating. It is a "ceramic" coating in nature, however unlike SiO2 coatings, it will bond with your clear coat and through some chemistry I'm unfamiliar with, change the chemical properties of your clearcoat. As a result, no thickness is added to your paint. SiC coatings are supposed to be better at chemically resisting caustic elements (bird poop, bug splatter, APC's, etc.) and are slightly more resistant to water spotting than SiO2 coatings. SiC coatings are known primarily for their ability to add gloss/sheen (think enhancing the mirroring effect on your paintwork). Couldn't tell on the truck, but the coating seen below definitely did not enhance the color on the Mini Cooper. Rather both just looked super "shiny" and mirror-like after the coating was allowed to cure. Over the course of a week, even with driving, both vehicles appeared to get shinier as the coating was allowed to fully cure.

    As of September 23, 2021, I applied Owner's Pride 7 year (single layer that has since been changed to a dual layer Part 1/2 format) to my Tundra and daily driven Mini Cooper. Neither get garaged frequently, but my intent is to properly maintain the Tundra and let the Mini Cooper go few and far between maintenance to see the results.

    There have been a couple accounts of OP failing prematurely or requiring a serious deep cleaning (clay bar/iron remover/water spot remover) to rejuvenate the coating properties, which to me is a failure and defeats the purpose of a coating. Essentially you can get the same coating effect on a non-coated vehicle by doing these things. I have high hopes for OP as I do think their product lines are great and the customer support is there, however with the potential of premature failure I don't feel comfortable putting my name on something that I haven't been able to test first hand. If I coat a vehicle and it fails early, I'll be looked at as a hack and my hours of work would be for nothing. I also cannot afford time wise to be revisiting and fixing coatings for free, so my own independent testing is needed.

    First up, the Tundra. Coated 9/23/21 after a decon and one step paint correction. Coating applied to paint, trim, vinyl, tonneau cover, and wheel faces. Photo of freshly coated truck:

    20210923_220640.jpg

    Application process is super easy. Temps mid 70s with 50%ish humidity. Product layers on and "sweats" to let you know the delivery agent has evaporated and you're ready to buff. After the test panel, I was able to coat half the truck before I noticed it was time to buff off. "Sweating" seen here:

    DSC_0013.jpg

    After 24 hours, I applied OP's Ceramic Detailer as a sacrificial layer to protect the coating while it cured completely (3-5 days) and I needed the truck out of the garage for an incoming client. Again, I plan on properly maintaining the truck since it's my child. The Cooper will be let go to see how I would imagine an average client would maintain the vehicle (washing every couple months).

    Tundra Update #1:
    Performed the first maintenance wash on the truck today (10/23/21) approximately one month since application. Washing was just as I expected...insanely easy. Truck barely looked dirty (gets driven two or three times a week with multiple towing sessions). 95% of the grime that was on it came off after a foam soak and pressure washing. The rest just wiped off with ease upon contact washing. Excellent water sheeting everywhere. Total time to wash the entire truck was roughly 45 minutes, which is a God-send because it would typically take me roughly 3 hours start to finish.

    Used Meg's nonacid wheel cleaner on the wheels. Prior to using this, you could see the effect of water sheeting off the wheels. After scrubbing and using the nonacid, this blew the coating apart. Water stuck to the wheels. Somewhat to be expected, but was honestly surprised. I will recoat the wheels while it sits in the garage overnight and attempt a light washing with a wheel-dedicated mitt and foam soap next time.

    My issue I'm seeing already though was the lack of sheeting on both fenders directly behind the rear tire. For reference, my wheels stick out about 1.25" so stuff is bound to sling back there. Contact wash did not return these properties. Utilized a light claybar mitt session and they returned to normal. Panel still felt slick and "velvety" after using this letting me know the coating was not affected by this process. Coatings are known to clog up under rough conditions (not maintained, extremely dirty, etc). I suspect these sections clogged because my tires are known to throw a lot of dirt up on these areas. Couple that with towing and driving the truck like I stole it (has 5.29s and a LSD...I like to burn it up from time to time), and I would expect issues from any coating on those locations. It does concern me that only after a month this has occurred though. Topped with Ceramic Detailer again. Photo update:

    20211023_185818.jpg

    Second up, the Mini Cooper (referred to as R53 from hereon). One stepped and coated the R53 in OP's 7 year (same bottle used on the truck) on 10/1/21. Applied solution finish to the trim (was in bad shape) and let cure for 24 hours before applying OP to paint, wheels, trim, and the vinyl decal on the hood. Also took the time to coat all 6 window panels with OP's Window Coating (different from OP7). OP's Window Coating is supposed to enhance glass strength by 30% (who knows) and provide water and debris self-cleaning capabilities. At the time of writing this, I drove the R53 through farm country and coated the car in about 4lbs of bug guts. A rainstorm came through a day later and using the wipers, the front glass was all but clean of a few straggler guts (very impressed). I plan on washing the vehicle at the one month mark and then letting it go through the winter to see how it holds up. Photo upon completion:

    20211004_093926.jpg

    R53 Update #1: Got around to performing the one and only maintenance wash on the Mini tonight. Sitting almost 5 weeks since the coating. The majority of the hydrophobics were retained. I did run into similar clogging issues as seen on the truck. I'm very surprised that after just over a month of daily driving, the coating was already clogged on the lower panel sections. This is to be expected because it was indeed dirty, but the amount of clogging and how it was remedied was alarming. Apologies for the dark/poor photos. Got home late from work but threw the work lights up to get this done.

    20211109_174043.jpg
    20211109_174134.jpg

    Clogging shown above on the lower panels of the doors. Water is slow to sheet/bead off when sprayed with the hose. Foam soak/spray down had little effect.


    20211109_175319.jpg
    20211109_175505.jpg

    After a contact wash, there was still some clogging. This is what was annoying. This happens with coatings, it is natural. However, for 5 weeks on and it's already suffering like this? I can get better results out of a sealant. Maybe this is why OP changed to a two part 7 year coating? Then that begs the questions: what's up with their 1, 3, and 5 year coatings that are a single layer? Are they just as susceptible?

    I started with the easiest of de-clogging techniques. Iron X sprayed on and let dwell returned all hydrophobics. Water sheeted/beaded which let me know the coating was clogged by some form of metal particulates (to be expected on a FWD car with BMW brakes that like to dust). The next step would have been a water spot remover (per Owner's Pride troubleshooting steps). However, a WSP is an acid used to remove residual mineral deposits from water spotting that could be clogging a coating. This in and of itself (acid) creates a high contact angle with water that could cause a false positive of hydrophobics returning. Luckily we didn't have to do any of that. This however, showed some MORE issues with the coating that less folks are aware about. See below:


    20211109_180308.jpg
    20211109_175309.jpg

    For those new to what is, this is what is known as a "sweat line." Sweat lines are where water likes to cling to the tracks where you actually applied the coating. Door panels I always start vertical then crosshatch horizontal, thus leaving behind horizontal trails of coatings that subsequently get buffed off. What you're seeing here is an issue with the coating bonding with the paint, and as such water is not wicking from these track marks and instead clinging. This can be user error of course, however nowhere else on the vehicle are these present, to include the same locations on the driver's side door (showing it's not a simple design characteristic of the door). All variables were kept constant when applying so this leads me to believe it is a coating issue. This is one of the issues I saw on some YouTube reviews from various other folks that used the coating. This can be a sign of premature failure as it is a weak link in the coating where the breakdown can begin to spread.

    20211109_182725.jpg

    All washed up and MOSTLY dried. Topped with OP Ceramic Detailer. This will be the first and final wash for several months as I let the winter weather beat on it for a true test.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2021
    GODZILLA and Saltyhero13 like this.
  3. Oct 23, 2021 at 4:14 PM
    #3
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

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    www.fouroneodetailing.com
    Undrdog (UD)

    Concerned about OP's failure accounts (none by myself so far), I opted to give Undrdog Pro a go. UD is a PTFE (teflon) coating and not a ceramic. Yes, think teflon non-stick cooking pans. I'm not familiar with the bonding process, but somehow they were able to chemically deliver the compound to a vehicle's surfaces. From my personal account it creates insane gloss/slickness to coated surfaces.

    A major point to UD Pro is this is a "retail" coating (anyone can buy it). The creator of UD Pro has been in the detailing industry for some time and left a major coating company after getting fed up with the bullshit of the detailing industry (egregious claims, false statistics, etc). I had a good 30 minute conversation with him over the phone when I sent a pretty "wtf you got" email to the company and he was a straight shooter. The coating at one point had an "up to 8 year" claim, however the owner said that was from his marketing team and he hated the idea of it. Stated, and it makes sense, that no one can determine the longevity of a coating because there are entirely too many variables. Instead he told me simple "it will last as long as you take care of it." General consensus from folks in the network is folks will say the coating will last at least 2 years, and up to 5 (again, no one really knows). But for the price point of $70/30ml bottle, it's one of the cheaper coatings on the market right now given the spectacular results it has been showcasing from both the company and independent reviewers.

    When selling this coating to clients, I tell them the same thing. Take care of it and it'll treat you great. Don't, and you'll just end up wasting your money with me. The owner currently has had it on his vehicle for about a year and a half and documented 200+ washes on his car and updates his FB page fairly regularly. It appears to be functioning as if it has been on there day one with 0 toppers applied after washing. A video circulated of this coating (along with several other big name coatings) on a test panel. The video creator dumped paint thinner on the panel and washed it. They then sprayed the panel down to see which coating's properties failed. UD held strong and was by far better than the others. All of the coatings obviously had failure to an extent, it's paint thinner for Christ's sake.

    I don't like to take people's word for it, hence the test on my own vehicles.

    I applied UD Pro to my wife's Camry and my CBR1000RR. I wanted to apply these and give the Camry the same treatment as the R53 above to give a pretty decent side-by-side comparison of this and OP (one wash one month in, then going some time in between maintenance washes to see real-world effects).

    The Camry. One stepped and coated on 10/19/21 (paint, wheels, trim, and all 6 windows). The coating process was very easy as well, with your typical rainbow flashing effect. After a test panel, I was again able to coat half the vehicle at once. Flash times are recommended at 7-10 min, but individual conditions affect this. Based on my conditions (low 70s, 30% humidity), I was at about the 12 minute interval before wiping/buffing was needed. I let one panel go for 25 minutes as a test and while difficult to wipe, it was buffed off with some elbow grease and leveled just fine. The coating added some real depth and "color-pop" to the paintwork. Topped with OP Ceramic Detailer. Although it doesn't require a topper and it's q different product, I wanted to give an equal test since both OP coated vehicles were given the treatment. Completion photo:

    20211017_184335.jpg

    The Death Missle. I'm a two wheel guy at heart and have owned several bikes over the years. I recently acquired a 2009 Honda CBR1000RR Repsol (true VIN Rep) with 23k miles. Since it is #1132 of 1500 made that year, I want to take care of it. I performed a very light polish of the plastics (they're OEM and I did not want to reduce what little clear coat they have left or damage any vinyl decals) and deep cleaning of the frame, electronics, and wheels. After such, I applied UD Pro to literally everything on 10/20/21. Again, not needed, but topped with OP Ceramic Detailer. I really enjoy it. Obviously, I will be taking care of the bike moreso than the Camry due to the test I want to conduct...however I will note I do a lot of "spirited" riding in the back country which equates to bug gut plagued nose cowls and rubber caked under tail sections. Very interested to see how the under tail being coated performs with removing caked on rubber from the super soft compound tires I run. My love:

    20211018_215336.jpg

    UD Pro bottle:

    DSC_0151.jpg

    Had a bit leftover leftover the UD Pro bottle so I decided to coat my Shoei RF1400. It's a matte vinyl wrap on the shell so I was interested to see what it would do aesthetically to the vinyl appearance. Prepped and taped, then the visor replaced and coated the exterior as well. Here are raw, unedited photos of before afters.

    Before:
    20211101_195516.jpg

    After:
    20211101_203014.jpg

    Dark living room so the flash sort of washed out the photographs, however it did very little to change the appearance. Slight sheen added but that was to be expected. Excited to see how easy it is to clean in the future.

    Camry Update #1: Finally got around to a maintenance wash of our UD coated Camry that was done 10/19/21. Washed it last night 11/24/21 so a little over a month (similar to the R53). A major difference is this car was taken to Raleigh (about 700 miles/11 hours round-trip) as well, putting it at about the 2 month mileage mark since it is also daily driven.

    Initial impressions before the wash was the car looked so much cleaner than the R53 with OP7 on it and had similar daily driven conditions with the addition of the road trip. Some runoff under the door seals and a bird poop splatter on the driver's side front fender was all that was really noticeable. Not very many bugs were stuck to it which was surprising (but could be due to the drop in temps and less bugs out in general).

    A pre-spray with the pressure washer removed most every sign of grime buildup on the car. The bird poop came right off. There was a slight amount of water sticking (mineral deposits clogging the coating in that spot) that was taken care of by the regular wash (seen below).



    Foam soaking took care of the wheels easily. To test against OP, I used some Meg's nonacid on two of the wheels and a light brushing. Previously I had used it on wheels coated in OP7 for testing purposes and it resulted in killing the coating almost immediately (evident by no water repellant features). Meg's didn't touch the UD coated wheels. Cleaned quick and water repelling features remained with the UD coated wheels.

    Foamed the car and rinsed off. VERY small section behind the rear wheels (seen pictured) where the coating was clogged. The coating was unaffected anywhere else. Clogged coatings happen, it's normal. The difference is how much work they take to return to normal (Ex. contact washing, water spot removers that break down the minerals clogging the coatings, or chemical and/or mechanical decontamination).



    Contact wash was completed and both the bird poop spot (seen above) and the clogged rear bumper/quarters returned to normal hydrophobic features. The coating unclogged with simple maintenance. To put into perspective, several extra steps had to be done to unclog OP7 on my other two vehicles that had less severe driving conditions than this vehicle.




    Finished the car up with a layer of Undrdog Quick Detailer (bottle says 1 month protection, but there are several users saying its given them 4 months as a standalone so far). I've noticed the company under-promises on their website and product descriptions and so far, they are overdelivering by a long shot. I've used their WSP (water spot remover) and it has blown several other water spot removers out of the water. Many of the users of UD Pro say the coating doesn't need a topper and have had it on for a decently long time without topping and it is still going strong. I did so just because: 1. I'm used to topping coatings 2. I wanted a relatively equal variable test between this and the R53 where that was washed and topped with a ceramic detailer.

    All in all, I am VERY impressed with UD Pro thus far. This winter and my lack of maintenance washing until around February 2022 will be the real test (for both the Camry and R53). I'm more interested in how the coatings function after being neglected because in my mind, a neglected coating that hangs on well will be an even better coating if it is regularly maintained. I also figure most clients that get their vehicles coated probably do not wash their vehicles as much as I'd like, so I'd like to see the real-world result of a vehicle not being cared for. However, UD kept the Camry looking way cleaner in a similar time-frame for the R53. Washing was as easy as you can imagine a coated vehicle to be with zero extra steps needed to unclog compared to several extra steps needed to unclog Owner's Pride's 7 year coating. I'm actually kind of upset that I have OP7 on my vehicle's and not UD lol. But, only time will tell...

     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2021
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  4. Oct 23, 2021 at 4:14 PM
    #4
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

    Joined:
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    2020 Cement Tundra CM Limited 4x4
    www.fouroneodetailing.com
    IGL Coatings

    When I first began offering coatings, I had reached out to become an installer with IGL Coatings, USA. It was great. Excellent feedback, business support, and topnotch products. IGL Coatings are SiO2 based. What this means it the ceramic is delivered through a solution that suspends SiO2 molecules in a resin. The result is a thick coating (for a lack of a better term) to the surface of the vehicle (thickness is actually increased of the paintwork, but very very slightly). SiO2 coatings are known for their ability to enhance color and add depth (think a microscope on your paint). As such, to get the best results you would definitely want to polish your vehicle before applying one as any imperfection is magnified.

    I don't see very many IGL coated vehicles back for maintenance because the folks' vehicles I've applied this to maintain their vehicles themselves or get someone else to do them that has the time (except for the one below). I unfortunately work full-time, so several of my clients use other detail companies to maintain their vehicles since I just don't have the time. I fit them in where I can, but I'm insanely busy with life.

    My second experience (not listing the first as I don't maintain the first vehicle) with IGL was coating a 2018 Honda Accord show piece in their one year coating named "Poly" after a one step correction. As I'm writing this on 10/23/21, I have had the opportunity to see this vehicle back twice. The owners takes immaculate care of his vehicle and washed it several times in between me seeing it. The vehicle was coated 10/26/2020 and maintenance washed twice by me. I actually have his wife's BMW coming up in the middle of November for a coating of Poly. The Accord is getting a refresh and probably recoated in UD Pro early next year. True to SiO2 coatings, the depth of the paint and "pop" of the metallic flake was absurd. Application can be a bit finicky as their flash times can be all over the board given environmental conditions.

    IGL Poly was relatively easy to use. It's the same solution layered twice with 2 hours in between each coat. I've used quite a few of their coatings over the course of the year (different temps/humidity conditions) and the flash times were always different. Their other coatings are a base and top coat comprised of two chemically different bottles.

    The owner reports phenomenal results throughout the course of the coating, but that is to be expected with almost any product (coating, sealant, etc) with regular maintenance toppings and good washing procedures. For reference, first wash/decon took about 3 hours. Maintaining the vehicle took me about 30 minutes each time (no decon) with a topping of IGL Premier (paint sealant) at the end. Vehicle first coated:

    122750070_192716889038696_1761963547537892311_n (2).jpg

    And a maintenance wash some months later:

    142161704_246154413694943_6912588632490411616_n.jpg

    Several of the other vehicles we have coated seen here with the coating used listed underneath the photo:

    110139080_160318245611894_4420903287520505655_n.jpg

    First vehicle coated. IGL Quartz+ 3 year coating, first formula. Has been regularly maintained by another detail company (guy is almost 1.5 hours from me so not feasible for me to do regularly) and is going strong.

    198007523_337826037861113_7360043401655852139_n.jpg

    IGL Quartz 2 year coating. Owner maintains the vehicle. I conducted a wash/wax service on his neighbor's house a month ago and was able to check the car out (4 months after initial application). Looked like it had just been coated.

    226291733_366778381632545_3074010806981884313_n.jpg

    IGL Coatings Poly 1 year. Previously polished and sealed this vehicle. Was asked back after they went through several automatic car washes and redamaged everything I had fixed with swirls. Opted for a coating and I have checked in on him once. He loves the coating and will be getting his wife's done at the beginning of 2022.

    136102105_234270754883309_3907066125294014020_n (1).jpg

    IGL Quartz+ 3 year coating, first formula. Doesn't show the whole car, but was hoping to reference the depth it provided with this beautiful dark red paint work. Again, owner cleans his vehicle every couple of weeks (retired firefighter) and absolutely loves it. The application however was a bit rough as there were quite a few high spots that appeared 24 hours later that needed polishing and recoating (applied in 40 degree temps so that was the issue).

    If you read everything above this, please read this tidbit:
    The reason I have been referring to IGL in the past-tense is that I no longer use them very much anymore. Several months ago, they transitioned their Quartz+ 3 year coating to "graphene infused." This was bullshit. The nature of graphene is it will not adhere to anything without some serious chemical or thermal reactions going on, nothing of which has been discovered to be applicable to being safe for vehicles. My research has shown most companies just toss a dab of the stuff in their coatings and call it graphene.

    I had a 2016 S63 in for a Quartz+ application after they swapped formulas (the owner of the above BMW M6 that loved the coating). The application process from their formula switch was absolutely brutal. First layer (base coat) went fine, however second layer (top coat) would flash instantly. No amount of buffing, distilled water microfibers, nothing....would level the top coat. A call to my IGL rep left a bad taste in my mouth. I questioned Quartz+ and he instantly referenced "top coat?" This led me to believe he was aware of the issue. My rep basically told me that I needed to roll with the punches and this is what makes you grow as a detailer. I'm not the best. I'm not all knowing. But I know when your product is f*cked up to the point that is it not usable (and apparently he was too). Since then, I have spoken to several IGL installers and the consensus is Quartz+ is garbage and unusable in its current state. All the ones I have spoken to have dropped it from their line and only offer Poly (1 year), Quartz (2 year), and Kenzo (5 year). I have not been given access to Kenzo as from what I've seen, they only give it to high-volume businesses. We may do 1 to 3 coatings a month which I guess if they want quantity over quality, they can have that shit.

    The whole business/client relationship really left a bad taste in my mouth and I have discontinued using them for the most part. It's sad because I've had great success with their coatings, however if I can't get good feedback and support from my rep then I'm not dealing with them. I still use several IGL products in my regular details and maintenance washes but won't be installing IGL anymore until Quartz+ is fixed (best bang for your buck coating). One year coatings are a waste in my opinion and their other option is a 2 year, whereas any of my other coatings will provide that at a minimum and are significantly less expensive to purchase. There are loads of coating products out there that do the same thing for a fraction of the hassle.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2021
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  5. Oct 23, 2021 at 4:14 PM
    #5
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

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    www.fouroneodetailing.com
    Glassparency (GP)

    Before GP became retail, I was an installer of their glass coatings. As such, I got first access to their now retail coating options. If you read the above section, I had a shit time with IGL Quartz+ and was in a pinch after spending three days correcting a hammered 2016 Mercedes S63 AMG. I had applied their base coat to realize the top coat was altered and unusable, thus meaning I had to REPOLISH the car to get the base coat off. I made a call to the vehicle's owner (I have done several of their vehicles and actually work with him full-time so we are on a buddy basis) and offered giving him what is supposed to be a longer lasting, better coating for the same price for the inconvenience of keeping his vehicle longer than expected.

    I made a quick call to GP (they have PHENOMENAL customer service both as a retail consumer and installer) and had a bottle of their Graphene Coating overnighted to me. I call bullshit on Graphene coatings in their current state of advancement, however after speaking with the vehicle's owner and going over what they SAY it does, he was cool with the option and being our guinea pig.

    Glassparency's Graphene Coating is a single product that allows a single or double layer, resulting in 3 years or 5+ years respectively. Again, no one really knows how long this stuff lasts unless it's maintained so take it with a grain of salt as the product had only been tested and approved several months prior to its release. Graphene Coatings are supposed to retain everything a ceramic coating does, however they say it is better at resisting water spots due to the graphene dissipating heat better (the idea is coated body panels dissipate heat more evenly and effectively causing water evaporation to be minimal, thus resulting in less water spotting to occur).

    We applied a double layer on 8/5/21 to the vehicle. Application was very easy with a rough 3 minute rainbow flashing time. Could do two panels at a time once I did the initial test panel to gauge flashing. The coating left a silky feel on the paint. It's hard to explain, but it really felt fake to touch. It is maintained (along with his BMW M6 coated in IGL Quartz+, the original formula) by another detailing company due to my busy schedule and him being very far from me. He reports the coating is great and is maintaining just as expected with no water spotting (cannot compare the water spotting to the M6 as that vehicle is garage kept and never driven in rain). The finished product:

    231894792_373093461001037_5796792846808699033_n.jpg

    Audi A8 corrected and coated with GP Graphene. Similar ease of use experience and great gloss levels. Can't get over the silky feel...

    242374308_404889371154779_2946336073698261597_n (1).jpg

    I still offer GP's Graphene Coating alongside my other coatings as some folks actually ask about graphene and want those coatings specifically. I do explain to them that the graphene claims have not been proven, but if a customer wants it then I will offer it. I have some leftover from the Audi application that is nearing it's expiration shelf time of 6 months and a full unopened bottle (1 year shelf life) that I want to use soon.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2021
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  6. Oct 23, 2021 at 4:15 PM
    #6
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2019
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    To recap the experiences I have had above:

    Owner's Pride: Easiest application by far, slick results. I don't have long term knowledge of the durability, hence this post. You can google and find some videos of it doing GREAT, and others not so much. I really enjoy their retail product lines and use those frequently now. Product support is top notch. Mirror-finish and shine.

    Undrdog: Who knows for sure yet, but I love it. After doing some research, Undrdog Pro has been shitting on a lot of coatings on YouTube reviews. It's retail (anyone can purchase) and really is insanely easy to apply (only second to OP's coatings). Will keep everyone posted on longevity results, but I have high hopes. Depth of color, glossy, slick.

    IGL Coatings: Excellent results, piss-poor new Quartz+ formula, shit representative experience. For the cost, other options perform the same, if not better. It's a shame I won't use them anymore. But, since I'm not pumping out massive quantity and as such don't have access to their Kenzo line (known as one of the best coatings out there currently), I have to forego their one and two year coatings. Sealants nowadays can last up to a year (waste to do all that correction work for a one year coating when it's cheaper for my client to just get a sealant afterwards, and since I'm transparent with my clientele, I let them know this). Other coatings give a minimum of two years for a cheaper purchase point and less hassle when applying (can be finicky on flash times given conditions).

    Glassparency: Superb customer service, a phenomenal silky feel, only time will tell. Had to use their graphene coating in a pinch and the results were great. Will update as time progresses as I do have the option to see the car on a fairly regular basis.

    I understand some of these coatings most folks won't have access to to apply themselves so that portion may not apply. As for the retail products, hopefully this helped a bit. The main theme here is I'm testing/monitoring the durability of these coatings to help some folks who either may want to coat their own vehicles or are looking into having their vehicle coated and see these as their options from their local detailers. This is in the infancy stages for the majority of the above experiences but I will update as time progresses to hopefully help out.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2021
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  7. Oct 23, 2021 at 4:15 PM
    #7
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

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    saved 2
     
  8. Oct 27, 2021 at 10:54 AM
    #8
    owb2gp

    owb2gp New Member

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    Nice looking Repsol. I had an 07 I bought new and sold 5 years ago. Wish I would've kept her.

    Question for you regarding lightly polishing sport bikes. As you know they have paint and decals. What do you use to polish and how? I'm assuming you don't polish the decals?

    I have 3 90's 900's and I want to coat the 95 over the winter. This bike is near mint condition and I don't want to screw up the fairings, you can't buy them anymore.

    I bought a 30ml sauce pro, detail spray, water spot remover, and the applicators recently from underdog coatings.

    I might coat the 93 or 96 1st, they are not mint condition.

    Here's a picture of the 95.

    PXL_20210514_015911148.PORTRAIT.jpg
     
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  9. Oct 27, 2021 at 11:25 AM
    #9
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

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    Love that bike. So when it comes to working on bikes and polishing them you have to know the medium you're working with. '09 OEM Repsol fairings were 60% paint/decals and a light spraying of clear coat overtop. I already knew this, but a surefire way to tell is by polishing these areas and seeing if there is paint transfer to your pads. The side fairings (orange) and colored underbelly are the only sections that are single stage with decals stuck on. Any dark metallic blue on the bike is clear coated.

    So for the sections I know that are clear coated I used 3D One and a white CCS (light cut) 3 inch polishing pad on my Flex PXE mini polisher. Sections that required by hand (too small), I used a microfiber sponge and Meguiar's M110.

    Sections that I knew were single stage got the above mentioned steps as well, however un-clearcoated vinyl decals got a very light pass of M110/black pad combo. This is a very fine polish and very soft pad finishing pad with no cutting ability. It provides a refresh but doesn't really do much, if any, correction. I didn't want to ruin gloss OEM decals that would be difficult to find. New decals can be polished as normal, but with older ones you have to be careful. Always do a test spot first regardless. Matte vinyl decals are a different story and can be ruined by polishing if you have any. Just use meguars vinyl and rubber cleaner to freshen those up if you have any (but IPA wipe them really good before coating).

    I didn't want to overkill the correction and potentially cause issues that I would then have to fix so I went for a more "refresh" and light defect removal. It's a bike and as such I do use it as intended so I wasn't worried about perfection...just doing the necessary prep to lay the foundation for the coating.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2021
  10. Oct 27, 2021 at 12:39 PM
    #10
    owb2gp

    owb2gp New Member

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    Thanks for the fast response!

    From what's I've been told the only decals that have clear coat on top is the gas tank. So I'll be polishing what I can by hand and will stay away from the decals.
     
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  11. Oct 27, 2021 at 1:28 PM
    #11
    triharder

    triharder Sorry, Not Sorry

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    Wish you lived closer to new england. Here's my 07 repsol. Wish somebody could polish it up for me.

    8040250851_a751651a7c_h.jpg
    298144_269490666409781_7860929_n.jpg
     
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  12. Oct 27, 2021 at 1:28 PM
    #12
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

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    Yup that is generally correct. Anything metallic has a clear coat and these Repsop fairings where it looks black are actually a deep blue with metallic flaking so they are clear coated. The orange on the side fairings and tail cowl are single stage and would show on my pads I was using. By hand is much safer just takes a little longer!
     
  13. Oct 27, 2021 at 1:29 PM
    #13
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

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    Beautiful. I miss my undertail 07 bikes.
     
  14. Oct 27, 2021 at 3:09 PM
    #14
    owb2gp

    owb2gp New Member

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    Here is my 07 I sold. Miss that bike. Guy that bought her totalled the bike a few months after purchase.

    IMG_20211027_160719.jpg
    IMG_20211027_160716.jpg
     
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  15. Oct 27, 2021 at 3:12 PM
    #15
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

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    Totaled? Ahhh damn man.

    The feeling of the 06/07 bodystyle is mutual. Had the blue/yellow anniversary edition 1k and this regular old pearl white 600 turned track later in its life.

    FB_IMG_1633812175965.jpg Screenshot_20211009-164340_Facebook.jpg
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2021
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  16. Oct 28, 2021 at 4:37 AM
    #16
    War Machine

    War Machine SSEM # 5 3MW

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    Awesome thread and work brother! It’d be cool if you could get a test hood and do some videos like others have.
     
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  17. Oct 28, 2021 at 4:56 AM
    #17
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

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    I've got an order of some stuff coming in. I have a Honda (I think) rear door panel I plan on doing some tests on. Couldn't find a decent hood at the body shop last time I stopped by there lol.
     
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  18. Nov 9, 2021 at 6:10 PM
    #18
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

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    Updated with my first Mini Cooper wash. See the Owner's Pride section labeled "Update #1" under the R53 sub header. Some interesting weak links already showing in the OP 7 year original formula. Maybe this is why they remanufactured it into a two part :monocle:

    Also included a portion of coating my new helmet in UD Pro.

    Decided I'll copy and paste stuff below so folks can see as it's updated but also keep the main body of the thread updated for first time folks.
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2021
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  19. Nov 9, 2021 at 6:17 PM
    #19
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

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    Tundra Update #1:
    Performed the first maintenance wash on the truck today (10/23/21) approximately one month since application. Washing was just as I expected...insanely easy. Truck barely looked dirty (gets driven two or three times a week with multiple towing sessions). 95% of the grime that was on it came off after a foam soak and pressure washing. The rest just wiped off with ease upon contact washing. Excellent water sheeting everywhere. Total time to wash the entire truck was roughly 45 minutes, which is a God-send because it would typically take me roughly 3 hours start to finish.

    Used Meg's nonacid wheel cleaner on the wheels. Prior to using this, you could see the effect of water sheeting off the wheels. After scrubbing and using the nonacid, this blew the coating apart. Water stuck to the wheels. Somewhat to be expected, but was honestly surprised. I will recoat the wheels while it sits in the garage overnight and attempt a light washing with a wheel-dedicated mitt and foam soap next time.

    My issue I'm seeing already though was the lack of sheeting on both fenders directly behind the rear tire. For reference, my wheels stick out about 1.25" so stuff is bound to sling back there. Contact wash did not return these properties. Utilized a light claybar mitt session and they returned to normal. Panel still felt slick and "velvety" after using this letting me know the coating was not affected by this process. Coatings are known to clog up under rough conditions (not maintained, extremely dirty, etc). I suspect these sections clogged because my tires are known to throw a lot of dirt up on these areas. Couple that with towing and driving the truck like I stole it (has 5.29s and a LSD...I like to burn it up from time to time), and I would expect issues from any coating on those locations. It does concern me that only after a month this has occurred though. Topped with Ceramic Detailer again. Photo update:

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2021
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  20. Nov 9, 2021 at 6:18 PM
    #20
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

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    R53 Update #1: Got around to performing the one and only maintenance wash on the Mini tonight. Sitting almost 5 weeks since the coating. The majority of the hydrophobics were retained. I did run into similar clogging issues as seen on the truck. I'm very surprised that after just over a month of daily driving, the coating was already clogged on the lower panel sections. This is to be expected because it was indeed dirty, but the amount of clogging and how it was remedied was alarming. Apologies for the dark/poor photos. Got home late from work but threw the work lights up to get this done.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Clogging shown above on the lower panels of the doors. Water is slow to sheet/bead off when sprayed with the hose. Foam soak/spray down had little effect.


    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    After a contact wash, there was still some clogging. This is what was annoying. This happens with coatings, it is natural. However, for 5 weeks on and it's already suffering like this? I can get better results out of a sealant. Maybe this is why OP changed to a two part 7 year coating? Then that begs the questions: what's up with their 1, 3, and 5 year coatings that are a single layer? Are they just as susceptible?

    I started with the easiest of de-clogging techniques. Iron X sprayed on and let dwell returned all hydrophobics. Water sheeted/beaded which let me know the coating was clogged by some form of metal particulates (to be expected on a FWD car with BMW brakes that like to dust). The next step would have been a water spot remover (per Owner's Pride troubleshooting steps). However, a WSP is an acid used to remove residual mineral deposits from water spotting that could be clogging a coating. This in and of itself (acid) creates a high contact angle with water that could cause a false positive of hydrophobics returning. Luckily we didn't have to do any of that. This however, showed some MORE issues with the coating that less folks are aware about. See below:

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    For those new to what is, this is what is known as a "sweat line." Sweat lines are where water likes to cling to the tracks where you actually applied the coating. Door panels I always start vertical then crosshatch horizontal, thus leaving behind horizontal trails of coatings that subsequently get buffed off. What you're seeing here is an issue with the coating bonding with the paint, and as such water is not wicking from these track marks and instead clinging. This can be user error of course, however nowhere else on the vehicle are these present, to include the same locations on the driver's side door (showing it's not a simple design characteristic of the door). All variables were kept constant when applying so this leads me to believe it is a coating issue. This is one of the issues I saw on some YouTube reviews from various other folks that used the coating. This can be a sign of premature failure as it is a weak link in the coating where the breakdown can begin to spread.

    [​IMG]

    All washed up and MOSTLY dried. Topped with OP Ceramic Detailer. This will be the first and final wash for several months as I let the winter weather beat on it for a true test.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2021
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  21. Nov 17, 2021 at 9:44 AM
    #21
    Vang530

    Vang530 New Member

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    thoughts on cquartz uk 3.0?
     
  22. Nov 17, 2021 at 10:04 AM
    #22
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

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    No personal experience with it, but I know a lot of folks use it so there must be a reason for that.
     
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  23. Nov 25, 2021 at 6:43 AM
    #23
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

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    Camry Update #1: Finally got around to a maintenance wash of our UD coated Camry that was done 10/19/21. Washed it last night 11/24/21 so a little over a month (similar to the R53). A major difference is this car was taken to Raleigh (about 700 miles/11 hours round-trip) as well, putting it at about the 2 month mileage mark since it is also daily driven.

    Initial impressions before the wash was the car looked so much cleaner than the R53 with OP7 on it and had similar daily driven conditions with the addition of the road trip. Some runoff under the door seals and a bird poop splatter on the driver's side front fender was all that was really noticeable. Not very many bugs were stuck to it which was surprising (but could be due to the drop in temps and less bugs out in general).

    A pre-spray with the pressure washer removed most every sign of grime buildup on the car. The bird poop came right off. There was a slight amount of water sticking (mineral deposits clogging the coating in that spot) that was taken care of by the regular wash (seen below).

    InkedAttach0 (1)_LI.jpg

    Foam soaking took care of the wheels easily. To test against OP, I used some Meg's nonacid on two of the wheels and a light brushing. Previously I had used it on wheels coated in OP7 for testing purposes and it resulted in killing the coating almost immediately (evident by no water repellant features). Meg's didn't touch the UD coated wheels. Cleaned quick and water repelling features remained with the UD coated wheels.

    Foamed the car and rinsed off. VERY small section behind the rear wheels (seen pictured) where the coating was clogged. The coating was unaffected anywhere else. Clogged coatings happen, it's normal. The difference is how much work they take to return to normal (Ex. contact washing, water spot removers that break down the minerals clogging the coatings, or chemical and/or mechanical decontamination).

    InkedAttach0 (5)_LI.jpg

    Contact wash was completed and both the bird poop spot (seen above) and the clogged rear bumper/quarters returned to normal hydrophobic features. The coating unclogged with simple maintenance. To put into perspective, several extra steps had to be done to unclog OP7 on my other two vehicles that had less severe driving conditions than this vehicle.

    Attach0 (4).jpg
    Attach0 (3).jpg

    Finished the car up with a layer of Undrdog Quick Detailer (bottle says 1 month protection, but there are several users saying its given them 4 months as a standalone so far). I've noticed the company under-promises on their website and product descriptions and so far, they are overdelivering by a long shot. I've used their WSP (water spot remover) and it has blown several other water spot removers out of the water. Many of the users of UD Pro say the coating doesn't need a topper and have had it on for a decently long time without topping and it is still going strong. I did so just because: 1. I'm used to topping coatings 2. I wanted a relatively equal variable test between this and the R53 where that was washed and topped with a ceramic detailer.

    All in all, I am VERY impressed with UD Pro thus far. This winter and my lack of maintenance washing until around February 2022 will be the real test (for both the Camry and R53). I'm more interested in how the coatings function after being neglected because in my mind, a neglected coating that hangs on well will be an even better coating if it is regularly maintained. I also figure most clients that get their vehicles coated probably do not wash their vehicles as much as I'd like, so I'd like to see the real-world result of a vehicle not being cared for. However, UD kept the Camry looking way cleaner in a similar time-frame for the R53. Washing was as easy as you can imagine a coated vehicle to be with zero extra steps needed to unclog compared to several extra steps needed to unclog Owner's Pride's 7 year coating. I'm actually kind of upset that I have OP7 on my vehicle's and not UD lol. But, only time will tell...

    Attach0 (2).jpg
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2021
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  24. Dec 1, 2021 at 9:46 PM
    #24
    2021 Semi Pro

    2021 Semi Pro New Member

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    Great information thanks for the write up I learned a lot from your expertise
     
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  25. Jan 9, 2022 at 2:10 PM
    #25
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

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    Snowstorm/Salt Quick Update (R53/Camry/Tundra)

    To keep true to the test of the Undrdog coated Camry versus the Owner's Pride coated Mini, I said I wouldn't be washing either of them for most of winter. Unfortunately, some snow storms rolled through last week and left everything a salty mess. Just to remove the salt, I did my own version of a touchless wash.

    I set all three vehicles out in the driveway and presprayed them all down with the pressure washer to remove buildup. I then mixed the foam cannon with my usual Chemical Guys Snow Foam and then 2 ounces of ONR in. Just as ONR is good with water spotting when you're working with hard (well) water, ONR is good at neutralizing salt and breaking it down better than just soap. All three vehicles got foamed and I let the solution sit for about 10 minutes and pressure washed it off to remove all salt deposits. No vehicle got a contact wash today (started to sleet on me and I was soaking wet/cold).

    The R53 and Tundra, both being coated in Owner's Pride, were disappointing. The R53, much like last update, was clogged in all the same areas (entire door panels from midline down, rear fenders). The rear hatch (see photo) was completely flat and dull as well. The truck's sides from the front wheel back are completely flat. But, this is to be somewhat expected, although not to the degree it was. 4wd snow drifting coupled with my tires sticking out an inch and some change from the fenders meant everything was being slung down the sides of the truck while I was out having fun last week lol.

    The Camry, coated in Undrdog Pro, was absolutely amazing. Prespraying showed hydrophobics were still rocking and rolling (telling me less junk had been sticking to the vehicle) and very little flat water behavior (clogging) behind the front tires (fwd vehicle). Foam soaking removed all but a very small portion of this clogging that I'm 110% confident would be fixed after a simple contact wash. @ToyoMafia not that you have salt to contend with but UD is proving to be the real deal so enjoy that bottle you just picked up.

    Short of another snowstorm/salt buildup, they probably won't be washed until March when temperatures begin to rise again.

    271710352_10227030748336586_2943017468536148003_n.jpg
    R53 showing clogging behind rear wheel. This water sticking photo was taken about 5 minutes after I finally rinsed it down...showing how bad the clogging is. Coated 19/1/21 and last washed 11/9/21.

    271734163_10227030749096605_9004569390463498328_n.jpg
    R53 showing flat water behavior on the rear hatch. Don't mind my missing windshield wiper...idk what happened to it lol.

    271696928_10227030748696595_7249769565362035518_n.jpg
    Camry showing very little (if any) flat water behavior on door panels. Coated 10/19/21 and last washed 11/24/21.

    271682126_10227030749296610_4727402892534967898_n.jpg
    Rear hatch comparison to see direct comparison to R53.

    Attach0.jpg
    The truck with completely flat, droopy water behavior on the doors.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2022
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  26. Jan 31, 2022 at 4:41 PM
    #26
    GODZILLA

    GODZILLA Hail to the King, Baby.

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    Just read this thread a dig it, but I'm wondering why you didn't tell us the R53 had a Flux Capacitor in it?
     
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  27. Jan 31, 2022 at 5:24 PM
    #27
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

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    Mine and Doc Brown's secret. :hattip:
     
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  28. Jun 2, 2022 at 9:43 AM
    #28
    Tenncoastie

    Tenncoastie New Member

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    Thanks much for all the effort you put into this info. Contemplating UD on my 21 Tundra and your results on the Camry seem promising!
     
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  29. Jun 3, 2022 at 5:07 PM
    #29
    Ckatz53

    Ckatz53 [OP] Newish

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    Highly recommend. We ended up trading the Camry in for a new Highlander, but I did another wash just forgot to update this and it was going strong. I've applied UD 20-ish times since testing to client's vehicles with excellent results.
     
  30. Aug 1, 2022 at 10:55 PM
    #30
    GODZILLA

    GODZILLA Hail to the King, Baby.

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    2023 Solar Octane TRD Pro TACOMA, 2022 Honda CB500X
    Trying not to mod it
    So, @Ckatz53 , I have a question regarding the Owner's Pride coatings and more specifically about a local detailer. Here's a link to their services page, and it looks like they to OP ceramics along with the usual detailing service. Good google reviews with 4.9 stars and 144 reviews. https://pristineautosolutions.com/services-pricing/

    For the pricing, is this a worthwhile investment in your opinion? I ask as I have a buddy who recently joined the Toyota owner club (Tacoma) and I don't want to recommend him to a ceramic shop on his new truck if the product is shit. He takes his vehicles to a carwash (self wash) and he will dry and even apply a drying aid or something like the Griot's 3 in 1 ceramic spray afterward if it's worth doing. What would be your expert opinion?



    Edit: Found another one that uses a different product line that I've never heard of: Feynlab. Any experience or wisdom regarding their stuff? This detailer uses their products exclusively, from soap all the way up through coatings. https://www.oilcityautospa.com/ceramic-coating
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2022

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