Ethanol-Free vs. Premium?

I haven't finished my non-scientific testing yet, but here's what I've found and what I'm doing...

For weeks and weeks my computer was steady at 14.5mpg. I tow a camper every few weeks, so it would drop down during towing, then come back up over the next few weeks of non towing. Like clockwork.

That was while using 93 octane. After the information in this thread, I ran two full tanks of non-ethanol 87 octane. No change in MPG - still steady at 14.5. So I then moved to "regular" 87 octane - with ethanol. That happened to coincide with a camping trip where I was towing. The mpg's dropped, which always happens. But what's odd is that it hasn't come back up to 14.5, despite probably 3 full tanks since then. I'm currently at 14.0. I'm going to give it another week or so, before going back to 93 octane just to see if it increases back to 14.5.

Ultimately, I realize that the difference between 14 and 14.5 mpg is minuscule. And even if the premium fuel provided the 0.5 mpg advantage, it still wouldn't be economically beneficial. I'm just plain curious, at this point...

 

Is the 93 octane that you were using ethanol or non-E? I use E-0 if it's available, I'd choose it before 93 octane.

 

Are you resetting your mpg readout with each tank? When towing vs. not? If not, that will narrow down your results to give a better idea of what's going on when.
Check out fuelly.com, you may like it?

 

The 93 octane is not E-0. I can't find that around here. Only 87 octane E-0.

 

I haven't been. And I realize that will skew the results a little because it will take longer for the fuel grade change to have an effect on the total # of miles recorded. My rationale for not resetting it is that my driving is so varied. I work from home, so I normally only drive a few miles a day in town. But then I will have weeks where I have to travel for work and that involves interstate driving. Then there's the interspersed towing... So I just let the computer run and average everything together.

There's probably a more scientific way to go about it, but it's really just something that I casually monitor for effect.

 

I gotcha. I try to figure out my MPG and its always a little off what the truck reads. Who knows!

 

I wish I could find ethanol free gas around here...

 

Does this help, or not close (practical) enough? http://pure-gas.org/

 

thanks, but closest place to Hampton Roads Va is around 40 miles away. Some kind of law they passed stating none for sale for auto's in the area.
I believe they sell it at marinas here though, but not for the road.

 

The last thing on my mind with a 5.7L, (345ci) 381 HP stock , full size 2nd gen Tundra is MPG's. Especially after a lift and over sized tires. It is what it is. (Saw the Rolling Stones in Hampton Roads in 1981, J Geil's Band opened up.)

 

I just want proper gasoline, none of that other rubbish.

 

What??? How the hell do you get a ridiculous discount like that?

 

Did you know there is a difference in ron 87 octane fuel? you have have rsv 7.8 and rsv 9.0...

Rsv 7.8 is used in towns with clean air problems.

rsv 9.0 is used where no problems are current.

Yes that fuel makes a difference in MPG also.

 

So earlier when detergents were being thrown around, that made me wonder about that is on the market. I know chevrons product was brought up and... paint thinner; but what about the other products? Are they just a waste? or worth something? For instance, i've always run Lucas fuel stabilizer and injector cleaner through my gas burners every once in a while. Is this worth is? Or just a waste of money?

 

Chevron Techron is not paint thinner. (unless you think it's wise to add ACE Hardware paint thinner to your $40K ride) Can't go wrong with Lucas either, especially Upper Cylinder Treatment. Works wonders in the winter. Don't need an engine block heater like you have to with diesel. I actually have "factual" experience with this in AK's worst winter in 2012. Minus 20 F and below for days on end in Anchorage. Not anecdotal / pull it out my ass bs.

By the way, each state has different EPA gas requirements depending on winter/summer regs. (CARB regs anyone?)

 

On the paint thinner comment, i was just making a joke at the guy earlier who was saying that it is basically paint thinner. I don't believe its paint thinner. what about marvels mystery oil? I've heard the comment that its just ATF.

 

I was joking too. What's wrong is that most paint thinners have other chemicals that I would never put in my ride. (Or in any modern engine quite frankly) Yes, Techron is just a detergent additive (not quite like paint thinner) to use in cheap gas that has no detergents. Check out chemical make up on Chevron's site and see for yourself. Advance Auto occasionally has it on sale for BOGO which makes it considerably cheaper than paint thinners. The main thing it is DOT approved. Don't know of any DOT approved paint thinners for automotive use. Marvel Mystery Oil is pretty much this:BENZENE, 1,2-DICHLORO- , MINERAL SPIRITS , NAPTHENIC HYDROCARBONS ie: mineral oil, Stoddard's solvent for example. The ingredients aren't really a mystery at all. Surprisingly, the US Military is the largest buyer of Marvel Mystery Oil. In mass quantities it is relatively cheap to make and comes in handy in severe environments. (desert/tropical conditions/ extreme cold)

 

Nothing is dot approved you put in your tank. DOT has nothing on the books. Its the EPA that does that tells you what you can and cant.


Dot approved cleaner? I want to see the subtile please and on dot handbook what insert please?

 

How do you clean injectors good? only way to clean them. Next time you buy a refurbished injectors smell them...

Epa has more trash coming up with more ways to screw people over and the old timers fix it right the first time and we are done.


If your injectors are getting dirty you need to look closer at your fuel filter... fyi.

 

We use paint thinner at work to clean pin gauges and gauge blocks in a ultrasonic cleaner. Probably what they use to clean injectors too or something similar.

 

Soak and run it though them under pressure. That cleans tips and cleans the screens. Also cleans the disk in the injection too.

Some companies use ultrasonic to clean injectors and a few other ways using sonic they are good but I have no way to tell how bad the injectors where before hand unfortunately.

 

This is an old thread but still has some good info & discussion - thanks!

 

Ethanol is the enemy. Take 87 without ethanol before 93 with ethanol.

 

Here in Texas, QT (Quick Trip) sells ethanol free 90 octane fuel. It is about 10-15 cents a gallon cheaper than the premium 93 octane ethanol fuel (but still about 50 cents more than regular fuel). I am DAP tuned and was running the 93 octane until I found the ethanol free fuel at QT. After using the ethanol free fuel, I am getting an improvement of about 1.5-2.0 mpg. So, cheaper than premium and better gas mileage… its a no brainer for me

 

I’ve done ethanol free a few times on my Tundra. Being more expensive than premium and having to actuality seek it out do not warrant the cost for me. I do notice slightly better gas mileage but not anything note-worthy. What I do notice with non-ethanol and premium is much better response when I put my foot on the gas. That could be all in my head of course but that’s why I fill up with premium often more than regular now.

 

I don't get it. Some posters here in this thread have said the Tundra's ECU determines how efficiently the engine runs on the fuel it is designed to run on which is 87 octane, so, putting anything in your tank other than 87 octane is a waste of $ because the ECU is programed a certain way, right?

Here's a question that no one on this Tundras.com board has yet to answer for me and I've asked it a few times on threads about fuels for Tundras: my tundra is a flex fuel Tundra so doesn't that mean my ECU is programmed to run my engine on regular gas and on ethanol gas? If yes, then because my Tundra is a flex fuel Tundra, does my ECU make a distinction between ethanol free 87 octane and 87 octane (or 91 octane) with 10% ethanol in it?

On flex fuel trucks, does it do any darn good to use ethanol free gas when it's designed to run on ethanol fuel, that is, will it not run MORE efficiently on any fuel with ethanol in it as opposed to any fuel with zero ethanol?

 

Yes. And no.

Ethanol's combustion is not as efficient or powerful as ethanol free so your MPG will take a hit. It all comes down to cost and MPG performance. You'll have to run a few tanks of each and math it out to see if it's beneficial.

A FFV isn't designed to run MORE efficiently on ethanol fuels. It's designed to run on them, period.
There are two parts to a FFV. The composition sensor that reads the alcohol content and talks to the ECU, and components meant to not corrode from ethanol. The ECU cannot make up for energy that isn't there.

 

Several years ago, I lived right next to a small airport. At that time, my daily driver was a 1970 Cadillac with a 472 with 10:1 compression.

The Caddy was not happy with the pump gas at the regular stations, even the premium 93 octane with ethanol. A mechanic friend of mine who lived near the airport too, told me to go to the airport with gas cans and ask for Avgas which was something like 104 octane. He said when they ask what it's for, tell them it's for a home built ultralight. Sure enough, it worked. The Caddy ran really well on Avgas.

 

I hear ya. I have a 572 cid in my boat. About 725 horses. I usually run 91 Shell Vpower in it. Last week I ran 100LL to clean the tank and seat my valves in my carb motor. $5 a gallon!!!. But it ran good and the transom was pretty clean after some shit runs

 

Ok if a FFV is designed to run on ethanol fuels, does the engine run better on zero ethanol fuel? I think no one can really answer that question because it appears to me that your answer is "you're going to have to try zero ethanol fuel to see if there is any benefit" which I already have done and then I got to thinking "hey, this truck is designed to run on ethanol so what benefit is there to run zero ethanol fuel?"

Here's the second part to my question: a poster above said that unless you have a tune, running higher octane fuel is not beneficial to get better performance from the engine. Now, I do have a tune so now I'm running 91 octane with ethanol but I can also get 91 octane with no ethanol but again, why would I worry about 10% ethanol when my FFV truck is designed to run on ethanol?