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New Toyota Sedan- The Crown

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussion' started by Hightide, Jul 16, 2022.

  1. Jul 16, 2022 at 7:43 AM
    #1
    Hightide

    Hightide [OP] SSEM #88 - 3MW - ASCM #2 RGBA#Q

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  2. Jul 16, 2022 at 7:50 AM
    #2
    Windsor

    Windsor New Member

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    Finally bringing the Crown back huh. Been MIA since the 70s here in the US.
     
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  3. Jul 16, 2022 at 7:51 AM
    #3
    MadMaxCanon

    MadMaxCanon New Member

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    Too many, but not enough....
    New avalon replacement I guess?
     
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  4. Jul 16, 2022 at 7:52 AM
    #4
    Pillslinger

    Pillslinger New Member

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    Hmm. It's interesting. Are they replacing the Avalon? I kinda get a Kia vibe from the exterior styling.
     
  5. Jul 16, 2022 at 7:53 AM
    #5
    frichco228

    frichco228 Valued Member

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    Wonder if that engine combo will end up in the Tacoma or 4runner? Thinking that is possible since Toyota likes to leverage its engine choices.
     
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  6. Jul 16, 2022 at 7:53 AM
    #6
    Hightide

    Hightide [OP] SSEM #88 - 3MW - ASCM #2 RGBA#Q

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    Retro is the thing these days.
     
  7. Jul 16, 2022 at 7:54 AM
    #7
    Black Wolf

    Black Wolf Bigfoot Hunter, Sasquatch too, but not Yeti

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    Yep. I was a freshman in high school it's first go around..
     
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  8. Jul 16, 2022 at 7:57 AM
    #8
    Pillslinger

    Pillslinger New Member

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    Lol! At least they didn't reintroduce the Celica but somehow make it a 4 door hybrid crossover or something.
     
  9. Jul 16, 2022 at 8:01 AM
    #9
    Hightide

    Hightide [OP] SSEM #88 - 3MW - ASCM #2 RGBA#Q

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    The celiac will be an EV and it will look like the mustang EV, completely soiling it’s legacy.
     
  10. Jul 16, 2022 at 8:08 AM
    #10
    Pillslinger

    Pillslinger New Member

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    It's plausible. This GR86 they are making kinda fills the place as the 'not a supra' coupe. A true-to-its-roots Celica would be redundant.
     
  11. Jul 16, 2022 at 8:22 AM
    #11
    Black Wolf

    Black Wolf Bigfoot Hunter, Sasquatch too, but not Yeti

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    Hell, I even remember the Corona Yota introduced in the mid 60's.....wasn't much to it but the mpg's definitely woke up a few folks. This new Crown should sell well.
     
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  12. Jul 16, 2022 at 8:26 AM
    #12
    Yugo

    Yugo New Member

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    Disappointed no liftback! Otherwise I like it.
     
  13. Jul 16, 2022 at 8:30 AM
    #13
    OCxCEMENT

    OCxCEMENT HI :)

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    We'll see how it sells, I feel it being a hybrid most would be looking for higher MPG.
     
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  14. Jul 16, 2022 at 8:44 AM
    #14
    GODZILLA

    GODZILLA Hail to the King, Baby.

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    The big thing is going to come down to price. If this is their answer to EVs like Tesla that you can't get decent range in without spending $50K or better, and they put it in that price range... well, I'm out. There are too many reasonable ICE options sub $40K for me to consider the EVs and Hybrids that cost more than that. I haven't seen any hybrid or EV sub $40k that isn't crushed in every metric besides fuel economy by ICE options of comparable price. I would absolutely love to get a Tesla with 300+ mile range, or a hybrid pulling 35-40 MPGs combined, but not at the price of performance as is usually the case in hybrids, or just actual price as is the case for EVs. I can get a Porshe, or luxury Lexus, or a Challenger muscle car for the price of a Tesla or less.

    Back on point of the post, I like the Crown. Kinda has a different look to it, power and MPGs sound good. If I can get one for less than what my Tundra cost, I'd consider it for sure. If it's going to be over that, then it's a hard pass. I can spend 10 grand less and be set for fuel for a long time.
     
  15. Jul 16, 2022 at 8:54 AM
    #15
    Cpl_Punishment

    Cpl_Punishment Young men never die.

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    Yet...
     
  16. Jul 16, 2022 at 8:55 AM
    #16
    Cpl_Punishment

    Cpl_Punishment Young men never die.

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    I assume by "hybrid" you mean plug in?
     
  17. Jul 16, 2022 at 9:03 AM
    #17
    GODZILLA

    GODZILLA Hail to the King, Baby.

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    Doesn't matter the type. Hybrids lack the performance of similarly prices ICEs. The added weight of the batteries would be my guess, but IDK. Pick a hybrid, any hybrid, and I can find something I'd rather have for a comparable price. I realize this is personal preference, but until the "green" vehicles bring something besides being "green" to the table without costing way more, they aren't going to be the first choice in the market.
     
  18. Jul 16, 2022 at 9:08 AM
    #18
    Cpl_Punishment

    Cpl_Punishment Young men never die.

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    I was looking at the new Corolla hybrid as a possible eventual replacement for Mrs Punishment's 2013 Corolla. $2k more than the regular Corolla and double the fuel economy.
     
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  19. Jul 16, 2022 at 9:32 AM
    #19
    GODZILLA

    GODZILLA Hail to the King, Baby.

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    If fuel economy is the number one priority, then that's a solid choice. I realize I am not most buyers, but I'm not alone in my sentiments. The complexity of a hybrids puts many at the mercy of a mechanic shop or dealership, it won't run at all if the hybrid portion has a problem, and (usually) fuel prices are affordable enough that it takes a long long time to save enough on fuel to pay for the price differences. If fuel stays in it's upward trend in price, and $5 a gallon is the new norm, that will help the hybrid and EV side of things, but it's pretty shitty when it takes economic hardships to make your product an appealing choice to the majority.

    IDK about Canadas registrations and such, but for where I live I pay a fee based on the MSRP, so a higher MSRP is always going to cost more, and then EVs get an additional $200 annual fee assessed while hybrids are looking at an upcoming $100 fee to help recover lost gas tax funds. Just makes it take that much longer to recover the increased cost of they hybrid/EV to start with.


    Also, gonna be a dick and call out the "double mileage" and $2k more bit. Better mileage, yes. Double mileage, no. And it's a $4k difference in starting MSRP. At $5 a gallon that's 800 gallons of fuel before hitting the price of the hybrid. Say you only get the lower 31 MPGs in the ICE Corolla... That 800 gallons would get you 24,800 miles. For me, that's initial registration, 10-12K miles later a second registration, another 10-12K later a 3rd registration, so that's 3 years of higher registration and $300 in hybrid fees. Just the hybrid fees is another 60 gallons at $5 per gallon gas, or that's easily going to cover any added maintenance in that time.

    upload_2022-7-16_10-19-12.jpg


    I love the evolution of the vehicles and I don't think anyone buying an EV or a hybrid is an idiot or anything else. I just completely understand why it's not catching on as the mainstream primary vehicle type. The fact that it is being forced just adds to the friction and frustration.
     
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  20. Jul 16, 2022 at 10:02 AM
    #20
    Terndrerrr

    Terndrerrr guzzling dealer repellent

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    I like it. I dig the elevated sedan vibe. Wish there was more info on the trunk/cargo situation.

    0-60 in 5.9sec for the 340HP hybrid MAX powertrain...hmmm. Not as wow-y as I would have hoped. My unmodded truck is not even a second slower.

    I've been thinking of getting a second vehicle as a more efficient commuter. Since this never works out to actually save money, it would have to be a really fun driving experience.
     
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  21. Jul 16, 2022 at 10:06 AM
    #21
    EmergencyMaximum

    EmergencyMaximum New Member

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    Oh no, that back end curve reminds me of that honda crossover. Please help me wash my eyes, it burns!
     
  22. Jul 16, 2022 at 10:09 AM
    #22
    Cpl_Punishment

    Cpl_Punishment Young men never die.

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    I trust Toyota's reliability and they've been building hybrids for a while. I think there's a low probability of having an issue with one.

    Do we know for sure that if there's an issue with a hybrid system the ICE won't work on its own?

    Corolla hybrid is $25,250 CAD and it's rated at 64/63/63 mpg (that might be Imperial gallons). Looking at the features, it seems to be closest to the LE CVT Upgrade ($24,250) or the SE CVT ($23,750). The LE Upgrade CVT is rated at 36/46/40 (not sure why the SE CVT is a little better but I'll use the conservative numbers). So, to correct my earlier statement, a hybrid Corolla with comparable features is $1000-1500 more and gets ~50% better combined fuel economy.

    No extra registration fees in Canada that I'm aware of for hybrids. It's about $80 per vehicle per year plus whatever bullshit fees the registry tacks on (usually about $15). I did the math on it at one point and I think the payback for our specific use case was about 8 years. Given that the wife's current Corolla is going on 10 years old with no concrete plans to replace it, buying the hybrid makes sense to me.
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2022
  23. Jul 16, 2022 at 10:27 AM
    #23
    Pillslinger

    Pillslinger New Member

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    This. Unless I get backed into a corner on the issue I won't do it. Even with this thirsty 5.7 the EV /hybrid market has a long way to develop before I can imagine a lower cost of ownership without substantial sacrifice of utility. Yep gas prices suck. So do my utility bills.my gasoline bill could go down with an EV but my utility company thinks that rolling blackouts are a good idea too.
    However, I would consider buying an EV strictly for the performance perspective, 0-60, low center of gravity, could be a blast. But I don't keep that kinda fun money laying around. I hope the endgame for some manufacture out there is a small, stripped down and inexpensive commuter car that will thrive in urban environments. Put up a Carvana/redbox setup and let someone pay a monthly fee to go get an EV that's up on matienence and charged up for the day. That would be cool as shit.
    Sorry @Hightide not trying to jack your thread
     
  24. Jul 16, 2022 at 10:29 AM
    #24
    Hightide

    Hightide [OP] SSEM #88 - 3MW - ASCM #2 RGBA#Q

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    This kind of thread is meant to be jacked.
    That’s what keeps it alive.

    I enjoy the opinions and knowledge.
    Carry on.:fistbump:
     
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  25. Jul 16, 2022 at 10:36 AM
    #25
    Pillslinger

    Pillslinger New Member

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    :cheers:
    I figure if I was retired living on a golf course in Florida with a big ass Class A in the garage already I'd be tempted. Meanwhile I'm a middle class 40 something with 3 kids 2 dogs and house projects piling up because I like to hunt, fish and explore forestry service roads. It'll be a while before im the target audience of the hybrid /EV market.
     
  26. Jul 16, 2022 at 10:59 AM
    #26
    Hightide

    Hightide [OP] SSEM #88 - 3MW - ASCM #2 RGBA#Q

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    Yeah, my tundra will always get the miles.
    I would get this for the wife’s car.
     
  27. Jul 16, 2022 at 11:02 AM
    #27
    GODZILLA

    GODZILLA Hail to the King, Baby.

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    Yup. Like I said, if 300+ mile range Tesla was sub $40K, I'd be in favor. But when I can go get a V8 Muscle car, turboed compact (think WRX), or comfy Camry family car for significantly less? Nope. See below. That's a lot of mods, fuel, or both before you're into the price of THE CHEAPEST 300+ mile Tesla.

    upload_2022-7-16_11-44-6.jpg




    Now, if the Toyota Crown is replacing the Avalon and comes in at the same price point upload_2022-7-16_11-50-10.jpg then it's in no better a position than the current Hybrid Avalon.

    upload_2022-7-16_11-51-33.jpg

    It actually gets worse MPG than the current Avalon hybrid, but I would guess that's the AWD. The base hybrid Crown has a smidge more HP (215 in the Hybrid Avalon), so it's a valid replacement there.

    The trouble I see is that the Avalon has a non hybrid model that has sales to offset the hybrid investment. The same body panels etc., so even if the hybrid isn't the best seller, you can still make money off the model as a whole. The Crown looks to be a hybrid only, and that adds risk because some people won't buy them at all for some of the reasons I've previously listed. This risk/possible lower sales volume will likely be addressed by increasing the base price straight away. Instead of a $38K intro price like the Avalon Hybrid, I would not be surprised to see the Crown launch with a $42-45 base model price. Possibly even as high as a full 10 grand hike up to $48K. They did it with the Tundra, why not the Avalon/Crown?
     
  28. Jul 16, 2022 at 11:09 AM
    #28
    GODZILLA

    GODZILLA Hail to the King, Baby.

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    To add to all this, the non hybrid Avalon has 301 HP and gets 22/32 MPG. IDK about others, but I can live with that mileage and I'd probably rather have the extra 84 ponies than the extra 11-12 MPGs.
     
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