New to Towing

I fully agree with all that, except for the conclusion. You say that since airbags transfer weight to the rear axle the bag setup should be done first (ie. intentionally induce that weight transfer.) I say that since there is a such a weight transfer and it is undesirable, set up the WDH first and then add a little air to the bags only for comfort, not to transfer weight. I'd only have the bags functioning as a bump stop, not as an extra spring.

Can you do it safely your way as well? Certainly - in the end everyone should visit the CAT scales once they think they've dialed it in.

 

Last attempt. The reason that weight transfers when you adjust the air in the rear bags after you’ve already set up the hitch is because you are affecting the angle between the truck and trailer. The connection point of the trailer to the truck hitch is a torsion spring. The torsion or torque at this connection point changes based on the angle of the bars. These bars act as a large spring lifting the rear of the truck and forcing the front axle and trailer axles down loading them with more weight and taking that weight from the rear axle. If you unload the rear of the truck by lifting it with air springs you begin to unload the torsion springs because you have changed the angle at the connection point. This adds weight to the rear and takes weight away from the front and trailer axles.

the spring bars have a spring rate. So many pounds per inch of deflection. If you change the angle between the fixed points - the truck hitch and trailer coupler - this changes the amount of force that the spring bars are under, therefore changing the amount of weight transfer.

This is much easier to explain in my head.

the air bags don’t transfer the weight by themselves, the serve as a ‘jack’ to physically lift the frame of the truck higher. The wdh is responsible for weight transfer.

 

All that is good.

What I think I haven't made clear about my position so far: I'm not advocating for use of airbags at all. Let's say there are two ways of using them [1] Pumped up sufficiently to alter the geometry (usually to raise a sagging back end) [2] Pumped in a neutral fashion, insufficient to raise the back end at all (some run 10psi) I've been talking about [2], ie. letting the WDH do all the work and making sure the airbags are out of the way. Yes, if someone is going with approach [1] and also running a WDH, then yes you'd want to set the bags first and then the WDH.

 

You have got to be kidding me. So you are starting with the minimum 5 PSI then maybe bumping it to 10 PSI for “comfort” and as a “bump stop”? It probably wouldn’t really do much of anything positive or negative. If you pumped it up to the 40+ PSI that anyone who bought air bags would likely do, it would cause a major weight shift.

I am 100% done with the subject. Please, anyone reading this who is considering air bags with a WDH, do a lot of research on how to setup!!!

 

What your thinking and what you have been conveying on a public forum are two different things. Someone considering using airbags in conjunctions with WDH and how to set them up are see conflicting information and are probably now more confused based on the back and forth.

BL: adding air after setting your WDH is no different then raising the jack on your trailer after everything is setup...it releases tension on the torsion bars which as results makes them less effective and transitions weight back to the trucks rear axel. Regardless of amount of air added, one should set their bags to that psi prior to setting up their WDH.

 

Why get so bent? With a WDH one shouldn't need airbags at all. They're for people who want the truck to "look good" (ie. not squat) or those who can't run a WDH. As I've said, I wouldn't run them at all. What's I've said is a perfectly valid approach, makes no difference if this is a public forum or not. No one is going to crash if they don't use airbags when using a WDH.

Oh and as for research, here's someone (2nd google hit) saying exactly the same thing as me, so put that in your pipe and smoke it:
https://www.irv2.com/forums/f45/set-up-wdh-and-air-bag-combo-378873.html

 

I shouldn’t have even replied to this, I think I’m getting trolled. Yes, we have all agreed that the airbags are not needed, there is no point of bring that aspect up again.

Your airbag advise isn’t probably bad enough to make someone crash, so congratulations on that. So you found some people on the internet that agree with you, it must be true then? Maybe those flat earth people are right also.

You have successfully turned what could have been a helpful thread into a complete dumpster fire. Thanks a lot and have a good life.

 

Gotta love the logic of @BrakeDust

using another internet forum debate as evidence for his point that makes no logical sense. C’mon man

 

No trolling, just a difference of opinion. So if you run 40psi in your airbags, then yes set them first and then the WDH. I've said that already.

Maybe you're just the type to start bar fights...

 

Went and picked up the camper today. Not too bad of a ride back, about an hour combination of side roads and highway. Kept a good 60mph on the highway but when the wind hit I could definitely feel it, and at one point it felt like it was pulling the truck into the next lane. Equalizer hitch worked well, Only dropped the truck 1 1/4" in the rear and raised about a half inch in front. Gain was set at 6.5 and seemed to work well. Not a bad first trip.

 

Congratulations! Here are a few things that could help with the wind:

Rear sway bar: It is an easy install. I have a TRD version, Hellwig makes a good one too.

Upgraded Tires: Not sure if you have LT tires or stock style P. Going with a D rated or higher tire at a higher pressure will give you more control also.

Since the front end did come up about a 1/2” you could load up the WDH slightly more, just make sure it isn’t less then when fully unloaded.

 

Congrats on the trailer Matt! Hope you guys have fun in it. Travel trailers are naturally not very aerodynamic obviously. I towed a smaller travel trailer with my Tundra. It weighed about 4,300 pounds. I could feel that trailer much much more than my utility trailer and tractor. The utility trailer I pulled with a small John Deere on it weighed 6,000 pounds. It towed much easier than that little travel trailer.

Before ai bought my Tundra, I came so close to an F-150. I test drive my uncles F-150 with 3.5 ecoboost. Same cab as my Tundra. Crew cab and short bed. I used it to tow my 6k trailer and also towed their camper with them up to Gatlinburg. Talk about the tail wagging the dog..... Has nothing to do with power, but that truck is 1k pounds less than my Tundra. When a semi would pull up next to us or we would try to pass one you could feel it sucking us over close to the semi. I could reach out the window and dang touch a semi trailer a few times. My butt was puckered the whole time. Has nothing to do with power or tow ratings, but due to the extra weight my Tundra tows much better than that F-150.

With all that being said, go weigh your truck with a full tank of gas and you in it first. That way you can establish your payload capacity. This will help in setting up your WDH. My guess is after you get everything dialed in you will be all over your payload rating before gear, family, etc...... Not saying the Tundra can't handle it, just talking about "legally" based off of Toyota's ratings.

Be safe and enjoy the trailer. We were in Pigeon Forge and Gatlinburg today and thousands of travel trailers up there right now and people having fun!!!

 

@matt123 congrats on the trailer!

if you are on stock tires still look at the max pressure and try that in the rears. I run 275/65/18 stock michelins and run 44 front 50 rear when towing and it feels very solid


On the airbags and wdh thing. I’m sure not everyone will be using the airbags just for leveling the truck from the trailer weight. Many times when camping we might be tossing in 500lbs of camping gear/toys in the bed of the truck before even hooking the trailer up. So even a perfectly adjusted WDH is not going to make up for all that sag that you started with. Our springs are so soft it just handles better when stiffened up first

 

I have a Blue Ox WDH. The instructions make it clear to disable all air bag systems.

 

Excelent explanation...Spot on IMO