Excessive oil consumption

From what I've read, track cars typically get an oil change after every outing.

From the Driven site, it appears that their motor oils depend on additives, primarily ZDDP, and a "synthetic" base oil formula to provide the additional racing protection. Like almost all motor oils, all attempts to see the MSDS were thwarted by "404 website not available". Since they never say explicitly the composition of the "synthetic" base oil, I conclude that their base oil is close to common "full synthetic" bases, i.e. some percentage of PAO or ester base stocks like Mobil1, Valvoline, Pennzoil, et. al. Having a higher PAO or ester composition would definitely be worth bragging about. At about $30/quart, the cost is nearer to "100% synthetic" motor oils than "full synthetic" like Mobil1. Maybe too pricey for the average Tundra owner ($250+ for a DIY oil change? ).

You can get "100% synthetic" motor oils using PAO or ester base stocks from Redline, Royal Purple, and Amzoil. From their websites, none really market their "100% synthetic" motor oils for general use. It appears that all true "100% synthetic" motor oils with PAO or ester bases are marketed for special purposes like racing or motorcycles. I have seen some comments on BITOG (I know, it's the internet) that blending non-synthetic base components into motor oil is necessary for the "synthetics" to suspend the additives. That may explain why virtually all "synthetic" motor oils marketed for general use are "full synthetics" and not "100% synthetics" with majority percentage of PAO and ester base stocks.

 

I just did the same thing and it shows 2015 and later European 5.7 Landcruiser to use 5w30, 10w30 and 20w30.

 

Lol, I like that.


But it doesn’t drip. Lol

 

I know for a fact that Subaru's engine design changed significantly with the FA motors, I would imagine that carried over to the FB family as well. It seems in your case the oil pressure light was designed with a higher margin of safety.

In regards to 0w20, there are a ton of cars out there running 0w20 with 0 oil-burning issues. My girlfriend's 2015 Mazda 3 is one example, my friend's 2017 Ram Rebel 1500 was another. My guess is Subaru's recent quality control issues, low-friction oil control rings, and most importantly their boxer engine layout are the biggest reasons for the string of oil consumption issues in the new engine designs.

Boxer engines are tricky, and Porsche may be reasonably successful with their designs due to a much higher budget (though I've heard their acceptable oil consumption range is even worse than Subaru's at 1qt/600 miles!).

 

But what you fail to recognize is that there are a ton of cars out there running 0w20 with lots of oil-burning issues. The internet is filled with them and they are all brands, including Toyotas of all models. There are plenty of folks who have no problems and plenty who do. And it can happen all at once. My Tundra did not use a drop of oil for the first 30k and then started using oil, and I am not the only one with that story. Same EXACT thing with warped rotors on Tundras--plenty of people with no problems and lots of people with problems. That means there is a problem or almost nobody would have a problem and it is statistically impossible for the large number of folks saying there is problem to be making it up. And it is not quality of oil, etc. That is an incorrect assumption because lots of folks used Mobile 1 full synthetic and other top brands. This cannot be explained away because it is a problem and I suspect the thin oil (or the design of the engines to run that thin oil) is the problem because these problems did not exist when Toyota and other manufacturers used 5W30. I bet I could google the model of Mazda that your girlfriend has and find plenty of people saying they are having oil consumption issues.

Google Search: https://www.reddit.com/r/mazda3/comments/335cyk/burning_oil_2015_mazda_3/

 

Amsoil Signature series flash point:428 to 431.6°F [Cleveland.]

 

Been looking for it for awhile now...nothing.

 

I don't have the evidence to say for sure that 0w20 is a great oil, and I came from the Subaru world so I totally understand the importance of oil selection and its impacts on oil consumption. That being said, I came from the Subaru world and know very well that the internet is where everyone goes to complain. There's never a thread about how many Subaru owners didn't have their warranty claim denied, or didn't have oil consumption, or didn't spin a rod bearing.

It's like the reverse of survivorship bias in a way. No one goes on the forum to make an account and find the threads (or rack up the post count to start a new thread) to share how great their vehicle has been.

If the Tundra sells over 100k vehicles a year, how do we gather meaningful statistics about the # of warped rotors or 5.7s that burn oil when there's only 38k members on this board?

Again, I'm not here to defend the virtues of 0w20 or API SN+ / ILSAC GF5 ratings or any of that crap. The EPA has restrictions and fee schedules in place to punish manufacturers for not including resource-conserving oils in the owner's manuals of the vehicles they sell here. Globally, the same 3UR-FE motor uses 5w30, with 20w50 being max allowable in UAE or something crazy like that; however, Toyota's hands are tied because they don't want to pay a fee for every Tundra they sell just so they can suggest the optimum oil for every application.

Either experimenting with different oils and weights yourself, or using oil analysis services is really the only way to find what works best for your motor outside of owner's manual, as short-sighted as the owner's manual may be.

 

thanks for this!

 

Interesting information @Ericsopa. I took a look on Amsoils website. Even more impressive is the "Signature" ATF; it has a flash temperature of 458 degrees F. , meets WS spec, and they say it lasts 180K miles.

Pretty impressive. I'm going to have to take Amsoil Signature products more serious in the future.

 

Not a pitchman for Amsoil, but I have used their products exclusively for over 40 years in everything I've owned. Bought my Tundra in late 2015 at 3 yrs old and 30K miles. First thing I did was an oil change with Signature 0W-20, completely change out the ATF with 14 qts of Amsoil Signature, and changed gear lube in the diff. Three days ago, I got around to flushing out the power steering and replacing all of it. Truck has 128K on it now. The oil never has to be topped off between yearly changes at over 20K each year. And Blackstone Labs analysis show good results on the samples each year. That's been my experience with everything I've owned. Previous truck was 1990 Jeep Comanche that I had owned for 26 years. I sold it to my brother at 240K. It had yearly oil/filter changes, maintained its specified compression figures for the entire time I drove it. It had its own little quirks with the Renix electronics, but never a problem with engine/drivetrain mechanicals. That truck would still be in service if a tree hadn't fallen across the cab during Harvey.

 

The evidence that it is a great oil is plentiful at BITOG's website with a plethora of oil analysis results. There is nothing wrong with 0w20 oil. People can argue why the change from 5w30 to 0w20 all day long...doesn't really matter. The oil is solid and the engineers know what they are doing.

 

Well the question is "where did it go?" Had to go somewhere's.

 

I used to agree with this but after having a vehicle burn new vehicle burn 0w20 at an alarming rate and researching the simple fact that 0w20 only exists at an attempt to make engines more fuel efficient. How can you explain other countries being recommended to use 5w30 in the same engine? The US has some of the most convoluted emission requirements forcing manufacturers to do things that may be detrimental to performance simply to comply, remember the whole VW diesel scandal? VW got in trouble for giving their customers higher performance and fuel economy because of emissions. The EPA does not care about the performance or longevity of your vehicle.

 

My 17 has used oil since i bought it new. Atleast a quart between changes of 10k. Sometimes a little more.Doesn't make me warm and fuzzy.And i also get the occasional blue smoke at start up.

 

That's how my Subaru started out, a quart between 7500 oil changes. It got progressively worse, by 60,000 miles it was burning up to 3 quarts between changes, always used Mobile 1 0w20. How many miles do you have on your truck? Ever think about trying 5w20 or 5w30 and see if it still burns? My truck only has 1800 miles on it right now and plan to switch to 5w30 once spring comes just to try and prevent oil consumption.

 

You’re right about 0-20 being used for fuel economy, though Toyota doesn’t seem to hide it...


they also state a new engine burns more oil...

 

31,000 mi right now

 

Not disagreeing with you about the 0w20 vs 5w30 both being recommended/used. Not at all. I am just saying that arguments that 0w20 oil is in someway bad is erroneous. The oil is solid. If this was happening with all engines running 0w20, you might have a point, but that isn't the case. I have been running 0w20 in other vehicles and in my Tundra for years...no oil consumption and UOA's show the oil to be excellent. How do you explain that?

 

This thread has a lot of good information. I have been a mechanic for 30 years and sometimes there’s just not a explanation for things that happen. Maybe bad oil...maybe bad valve seals....maybe oil not changed enough.... maybe maybe etc.
I have learned a few things If something’s not giving you the result your after try something else, test a different way, send oil samples out, get real information about what’s going on, or they way your servicing it. Just because it’s the most popular brand doesn’t make it the best oil tire, exhaust ,radio.... and by all means just because a dealer is doing it does not mean your getting it done correctly. Maybe they didn’t change the filter just oil, so now you have 20,000 miles on filter and 1/2 quart of oil. Lots of maybes play into motors using oil.
I do know one thing Toyota’s are not perfect but over all much more reliable than the big three....

 

I have a little over 2000 miles and am already sitting at a 1/4 below the full line on the dipstick and it was at full when new. Can't wait til spring to get this 0w20 out.

 

Why wait? If it is that much of a concern for you, then dump it and put what you want in the sump. Give yourself peace of mind.

 

I just don't feel like doing an oil change while it's freezing out, maybe if we get a nice day here. I had the same experience with my last vehicle that used 0w20 so I'm not worried too worried about it, just was surprised to have already consumed oil in 2000 miles.

 

I understand. Oil change in the cold is certainly not ideal.

 

Found this over on the Land Cruiser forums. It's the oil recommendation for a 3UR-FE in Dubai. Just makes me feel better about switching seeing it straight out of an owners manual.
https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/what-motor-oil-type-and-weight-do-you-use.977926/

 

Yeah the FJ owners manual for UAE shows the same. I agree the 0w-20 is for economy, but I have 100k on my FJ with Toyota 0w-20 and I get an oil analysis every 20k and everything looks great, no wear metals, fuel dilution, etc.

 

Yeah I don't think 0w20 is bad oil and far as lubrication, it just causes consumption issues from my experience. There's definitely people who use it and seem to never lose a drop but unfortunately I'm not in that group.

 

That really sucks and I hope I dont have that problem with my new Tundra. So far no usage in 10k on it and no usage on my FJ. I run 5w-30 in my 08 Tundra with no issues and will do the same with my other rigs if they start to use oil.

 

I recently traded in my 13 2wd grade Tundra with 85k on it. After the ToyotaCare expired, I did all the oil/filter changes using correct oil weight and toyota oil filters. That motor used zero oil. I am leaning towards "jiffy lube" as the culprit.

 

I’ve used amsoil signature series since my truck had 1k miles on it, I broke it in properly and I don’t burn a drop at 10k intervals... currently at 25k miles... 0w-20 isn’t the problem, I was a tech for Honda for many years, I’ve done thousands of oil changes and it was pretty rare to have an oil level problem on the newer ones that used 0w-20.